Attention: Detailers that only offer Full Corrections.....

[David Fermani]

You’re leaving money on the table for others to pick up and run with! :sadwavey:



I can’t help but to notice that several detailers both on various forums as well as ones in the S. Florida area bragging about only being interested in doing full corrections. They won’t even do a Wash N Waxes on their cleint`s cars, Engine Details or an Interior. After all, we’re detailers doing detailing which consists of more that just making paint perfect. Whether you detail full or part time I personally think that it’s pretty narrow minded to only cater to people that want, or better yet need this extreme service :nono



In my opinion there’s nothing wrong with coaching a customer on their options based on theirs and their vehicle’s needs. Just because their vehicle suffers from moderate to heavy marring doesn’t mean that they only see value in a complete correction. I try warning my clients that going after every possible defect is ok, but not unless they are willing to modify their maintenance routine to cater to this new finish I’ll be creating. I feel there’s no point in someone spending several hundred or thousand dollars returning their car’s paint to optimal condition just to have it go right back to its prior state after a few crappy washes through the automatic car wash or from a less than stellar wash regiment.



Case in point, I had 3 clients contact me recently about correcting the paint on their vehicles. I immediately made the time to meet with them to inspect their vehicles. Each vehicle was somewhat swirled so I asked each owner what their expectations were. We also went over the finish with high powered light and I trained them how to inspect their finish and what the different types of defects were caused by, how they can be avoided and how they can be corrected. After giving them different opinions on what to expect from a 1, 2 and 3 step process they were giving the choice on what level of correction they’d fell most comfortable going with. In a few of the cases I explained that a good one step polish will offer decent correction with a pretty nice shine and that the remaining marring would only be noticeable under artificial light and/or from certain angles under close full sun inspection. I also gave them another option of doing a multiple step correction on the more visible horizontal panels with only doing a 1 step on the sides. To say they were delighted about my honestly was an understatement.



With another client I couldn’t help to notice their leather interior. I educated them about their leather and the condition it was in. They thought that using an all in one cleaner/conditioner that makes their leather shiny and soft feeling was the right thing to use. I forwarded them a couple of my interior detailing threads and they were immediately sold. It couldn’t have been made possible without offering more than just full correction services.



Bottom line, by not taking the time to coach your clients on their options (it`s called upselling folks) rather than being insistent about what you want to do on their vehicles only narrows your audience and your income. I’d much rather do 2 or 3 $300-400 1 steps that take just a few easy hours than 1 $700-800+ multiple step/day correction. If someone is that busy with just doing these "perfection" corrections than more power to them, but if you’re interested in growing your business, it’s time to start thinking outside of the box if that matters at all to you. :think2 :53:

[Accumulator]

David Fermani- Hear Hear!! Good post :xyxthumbs

[shirtman]

David - exactly what I was trying to convey in another thread. If the client is not "autopian" in their exectations, and receives a quote commensuarte with full correction, there is a lot of sticker resistance. You also make an even more important point - if the car cannot or will not be maintained at the highest level, then it is probable that the satisfaction level will diminish quickly after the large outlay. Great post.



Jeff

[MirrorDetailing]

Have to agree. I think out of every 10 vehicles I do that have some sort of buffing work...only one is a full paint correction. Most are just 1-2 Step buffs for cleaning the paint up and correcting as much as possible. Generally only full blown show cars are the ones I get for the full package. But each time afterwards, I always like to specifiy the changes they need to make to their wash processes to where the car wont need to be buff for naother 6-12 months and then at that point only need some light correction.

[Thomas Dekany]

PMing the people that you know who are "narrow minded" would have been a much better choice.



Why call them out in the open? Obviously those detailers are doing ok, otherwise they would be taking every job.



Funny that the only detailer I have ever heard of who refuses to do "regular" details is your very good friend Todd Helmes.

[Scottwax]

I agree that it is best to not only find out what the customer`s expectations are but also to find out how committed they will be to modifying their wash regiment to minimize future swirling and marring, then work with them to find the best level to bring the car to that they can then maintain. First and foremost, we are in business to make our customer`s happy, not feed our egos with 150 picture full correction posts on Autopia.



I detailed a swirl fest of a Lexus today. What the car really needs is pretty much a full wetsand to remove numbers RIDS, scuffs and very deep spider swirling. However, the owner of the car wasn`t particularly interested in washing the car properly herself and will continue to use the local tunnel swirl maker. She`s too far away to make it cost effective for me to wash it regularly so she opted to have me remove the buffer swirls and whatever else came out in the process. The car didn`t end up perfect but it looked significantly better and she was really pleased. As much as I would have loved to have gone nuts on the car, it just wouldn`t have been worth it to my customer and I`d be frustrated knowing in a couple months it would look like I`d never touched it (except for the lack of holograms).

[Junebug]

Thomas - you never miss a chance to take a jab at David, he makes a decent suggestion - not pointing a finger at anyone, just a general observation that may help a few detailers make better business decisions.

[JohnKleven]

I certainly agree that you shouldn`t oversell your customers something that they don`t need. On the other hand, most detailers do regular details also, BUT I`m sure nobody is going to show off their work here on autopia showing a car that needs a multi step polish with only a single step. It`s kind of a difficult subject because myself or other autopians can see swirls and defects in paint clearly. WE know what a car needs to look it`s best in OUR eyes, but David is probably right, and 90% of customers may be ok with just a shiny single step polish.

[Thomas Dekany]

Interesting that for him calling other detailers narrow minded is fine with you. I simply pointed out that doing it privately would have been a BETTER DECISION.



Do you really think that he isn`t pointing fingers at anyone? Please....



Do you also think that those who do nothing but fulll corrections really need his suggestion? Maybe those detailers are "busy" 7 days a week making top dollars. Why would they take a job that pays 1/3 $$$?



NOW, if the detailer refuses to do "lesser" jobs because of their ego, and looses out on opportunities to put $$$ on the table??? Do you really think they will magically "get it!!!" after reading this thread? I really doubt it. Most of us are adults on this board and like always, WE ALL DIG OUR OWN GRAVES.



Lastly, if DF left out the name calling, I can’t help but to notice that several detailers brag about only being interested in doing full corrections. It’s time for some to stop being so narrow minded I wouldn`t have said anything, because I agree with him 100%.



However there is life out there beyond the - world according to fermani.

[15951]

I think it was a fine piece of advice for those in the biz, and there`s some education for us non-pros as well. If you have a personal ax to grind, please take it to PM as you suggest. Those of us that are here to learn get tired of watching the multi-page pissing contests with very little usable content.

[moderator]

I cleaned up this thread to keep it on track. If someone has a problem either notify a Moderator or contact the person in question to peacefully resolve your dispute . Bashing is against the rules and will be enforced accordingly. Happy posting!

[imported_Ivan Rajic]

Well said David. I do a Pre-Detail Inspection with every new client and most regulars where I do a full detail on a panel (ONR, clay, tape off 3 sections, polish 1, 2, 3 steps). This way they see exactly what to expect from each service, what the prices is for that service and I get to see the condition and educate them a bit about the whole process, post-detail maintenance, etc.



Good post.

[gigondaz]

David....GRRREEEAAATTT POST!:happy:



We should recommend to customers realistic and practical solutions.

Not everyone needs a full correction detail. I fully agree, and that`s what I do.



But there`s a connundrum here.

The application of the logic above depends on:

1. Your location (high, mid, low end)

2. Your established image in the industry (eg: are u renowned for mainly high-end jobs)

3. Your type of established clientele



Only You+Car Owner Knows Why and What.

When i`m doing a realistic and practical job (partial correction only) on a badly swirled luxury black car, only the car owner and I know the rationale behind that partial-correction job.



SOLO:

Assume you`re going solo, and performing work on that car with overhead lights on. A potential customer walks by, eager to check out that "black car". Most will naturally and conveniently look closely at the hood. He sees you working on it, and the scratches are still there. He has no idea at all about the "job rationale". He asks you, you stop working and explain what kinda job that is. That`s great. What if 3-4persons walk in at different times? You`ll be spending loads of time explaining the job.



SHOP:

Or....you operate a detailing shop. Same scenario as above.

The potential customer might ask your worker why the surface is still full of scratches. Even worse, many are tempted to use their fingers to feel the paint or to rub!!!! Or worst....he might not ask, and just walk out, thinking...Nahhh...this place is not as great as they say it is. :cry1::cry1:



If you`re in the shop, you can engage this potential customer to explain the what and why. But what if you`re not in the shop?

He has 100% no idea what that job was all about.

He just saw that the finished/nearly finished car still hvg loads of scratches....and it creates an immediate "impression" of your place and your "skills".



Even worse.....

If this was not a solo layman who walked in...but a group of newbie detailing enthusiasts who`ve learnt 1001 things about swirls from the Internet....your shop`s name could be painted in a very negative manner the SAME EVENING in their car club`s forum. This has happened to some establishments...without their owners even knowing about it.



Or the best case scenario....

On the other hand, if he/them walk/s in, and sees a fully corrected car/s, WOW!!! and especially a completely clear hood, that`s an instant good impression of you, your establishment! DANG...what we heard about this place was true!! No questions at all.....you are instantly DA MAN!!! and you could be painted in a very positive light in their forums (without you even knowing it).



How I`ve addressed this issue:



1. All work-in-progress cars: restricted access. They can see the cars being worked on...but only from a distance.



2. Only after the final polishing process, when we`re all starting to clean the seams, crevices etc...will that fully-corrected car be driven to another section where anyone can see it, admire it and drool. If space is available, partially-corrected cars/cheaper jobs will remain "inside" the work section and covered up.

This avoids many potential mis-leading notions from 3rd parties who are not knowledgeable.



3. We will never ever perform partial jobs on car club members` cars/young detailing enthusiasts cars. It`s the Whole Way.... or it`s the Highway.

From my experience, these cars, once detailed (partial or full), will/could be subjected to intense scrutiny (trust me) by their fellow forum members, who`ll all huddle over that hood hunting out for swirls. They`ll talk about the overall beauty much later...sometimes...never. How they feel....will appear in the forums (and I`m not talking bout Autopia herezz:zz. This could differ from country to country, based on different cultures.



My current approach also addresses the SAFETY aspect, where I`ve seen (in other establishments), customers nearly tripping over power cords and causing the stand-mounted lights to collapse as they walk round the car while work is going on. And some might bring their kids. Dangerous.

[Accumulator]

...3. We will never ever perform partial jobs on car club members` cars/young detailing enthusiasts cars. It`s the Whole Way.... or it`s the Highway. ..From my experience, these cars, once detailed (partial or full), will/could be subjected to intense scrutiny....

That`s interesting! I can see your point, and I guess it boils down to knowing your audience :think: Very different from anybody I know IRL though...



Repeating for the umpteenth time: It sure is cool that you have not only the abilities you do, but also a client base that appreciates them.

[brwill2005]

Whether you are a professional who does this for a living, or a part time guy who just does it for fun and some extra cash; target the market you think is most profitable and position your product to best serve that market. Then, spend your time figuring out the best way to effectively market to the people in your target market. Worrying about what others are doing, or not doing is not going to help much with your success.