2step polishing.

**sacdetailing** · 10-25-2010, 06:55 PM

If customer requested 2 step polish, how do you do it with a two step with rotary? m105 orange pad and m205 white pad?(some clears react differently and need a 3 step to remove swirls, daily driver type (lots of scratches). If he doesn`t want to pay more for more correction, how do you finish? just leave some heavy rids alone?or most of you finish with da?

**Toymachine2009** · 10-25-2010, 07:16 PM

I never dealt with this but what comes to mind is get what you can get out with 2 step... I don`t see why you couldn`t get out 90-100 percent anyways with m105 and m205.. I don`t really see much that combo would leave behind if anything...

**Dan** · 10-25-2010, 08:22 PM

Hit it with something heavy like 105 and then finish with a strong aio like d151 or fk215

**Envious Eric** · 10-25-2010, 10:35 PM

scratch that process....

PC with orange and 105, then white and menzerna 203

205 sucks IMO. never leaves the paint good enough to finish down with any pad on the PC, and with a rotary and the "non-deminishing abrasives", its awefully hard to finish down hologram free.

wash, clay, 105/203/CGEZCG/wax is my go to process

however, on black, I alway finish down with 85rd no matter the previous process

**Envious Eric** · 10-25-2010, 10:40 PM

oh yeah, if the client doesnt want to pay for a perfected finish, how are you supposed to give it to them? if you tell them it needs 3-4 steps, and they only want to pay for 2, then they get a 85-90% finish, which by the way, is more than fine for 99% of the population.

**Toymachine2009** · 10-25-2010, 10:46 PM

Originally Posted by toyotaguy

scratch that process....

PC with orange and 105, then white and menzerna 203

205 sucks IMO. never leaves the paint good enough to finish down with any pad on the PC, and with a rotary and the "non-deminishing abrasives", its awefully hard to finish down hologram free.

wash, clay, 105/203/CGEZCG/wax is my go to process

however, on black, I alway finish down with 85rd no matter the previous process

I dont see why 205 is hard to finish it down hologram free I never had a problem finishing it down from what I saw I didnt see any holorgrams.. LOTS of people use 205 and I never heard that one before..

**Envious Eric** · 10-25-2010, 10:55 PM

i dont use 205 via rotary, but I have heard that from a few different people...maybe I should have mentioned that...

but I still dont think it finishes down or cuts as well as 203...talked to a few other people who feel the same way as well. Plus the gloss and wetness is better with 203 IMO

**Toymachine2009** · 10-25-2010, 11:28 PM

I never used a rotary before just my DA that may be why it finished better...

**imported_Bert** · 10-26-2010, 09:33 AM

Originally Posted by toyotaguy

but I still dont think it finishes down or cuts as well as 203...talked to a few other people who feel the same way as well. Plus the gloss and wetness is better with 203 IMO

On normal paint (paint that is not stupid soft or rock hard) how difficult is it to finish hologram free with 203 on a white pad with a rotary. I know many on hear have said if the last polishing step involes a white pad or firmer, they put the rotary aside and reach for a DA. Are you able to finish with 203 on white pretty easily?

**Dan** · 10-26-2010, 09:58 AM

Originally Posted by toyotaguy

205 sucks IMO. never leaves the paint good enough to finish down with any pad on the PC, and with a rotary and the "non-deminishing abrasives", its awefully hard to finish down hologram free.

Well, good enough is relative, but 205 looks great, until you finish it with something pike PO85RD, which takes it to amazing.

**imported_JoshVette** · 10-26-2010, 04:20 PM

I agree with Toyotaguy, don`t two step it with a rotary and finish with 205 and expect to make it perfect, big mistake, if using a DA that would be different. Listen to toyotaguy, he`s got it right, as well as the whole not paying for perfection, you don`t give them perfection, and 85% to us is like 95-100% to everyone else. I tell my clients I can give them at least 50% correction with a 1 step process but if they want 95-100% they will have to pay for a full correction and not a 1 step.

Josh

**gigondaz** · 10-27-2010, 10:13 AM

Originally Posted by toyotaguy

oh yeah, if the client doesnt want to pay for a perfected finish, how are you supposed to give it to them? if you tell them it needs 3-4 steps, and they only want to pay for 2, then they get a 85-90% finish, which by the way, is more than fine for 99% of the population.

This is a very subjective matter.

Imagine this:

Customer insists that he/she can only pay up to xxx, and that equates to a 2-stepper and nothing more. This could leave behind loads of RIDS, or some minor swirls.....depends on the type of paint system on that car.You proceed with the job.

When it`s finished, customer inspects car and starts inspecting VERY closely, disappointed that lots of his/her PROBLEMS are still there!!!!! I know you cd hv explained it beforehand. But human nature is such that, if that person is not a car lover and treats this once-in-a long time "polish/wax" job as a BIG thing...then he/she could hv a pre-conceived "fantasy" of how the car SHOULD look like after the job. Slurp!

But alas....their dreams/expectations did not materialise.

This customer will surely pay....but he/she won`t be impressed, and certainly won`t recommend you highly to others.

In short, they see the results as merely "okay". For some, they might be disappointed, but just to be nice, they smile, pay and leave.

Even worse, while doing this 2-stepper, the absolute nightmarish thing (for me) is to have visitors, friends, potential customers drop by.

These people are not familiar with detailing techniques, and when they see the car being worked on still having lots of scratches, they won`t be impressed at all. You can see it on their faces. No ooohhs and ahhhs. If you hv to explain the basis of the job to everyone who sees the job, it might take up too much of your time.

Since 2 years ago, I AVOID these 2-steppers.

I only use 2-steppers to do routine "maintenance detailing" on my clients` car, and I stick a huge "basic maintenance detailing" on the windscreen.

IMO, the 2-stepper is bad for my professional image and my business`s image.

When people drop by and see a finished black car, they often go close and inspect. If u hv those high-bay lights switched on, it attracts them even more. Human nature.

I wanna impress them. No stories need to be told to them. The truth is what they see.

If I hv to do a 2-stepper on a car that I`ve never extensively detailed before, (perhaps a special request by a customer`s friend etc), I`ll do it quickly and cover the car up once the car is done, as I don`t want anyone to see it and make any wrong conclusions.

**Accumulator** · 10-27-2010, 10:36 AM

gigondaz- One of these days I`m gonna start a thread about this, but, short version: I think it`s great *and very surprising* that your customers/friends are so discerning! Very, *VERY* different from the people I know, including my pals who are really into the concours scene. People I know IRL simply don`t/wouldn`t get it. On the rare occasions that I do a car for somebody, they *always* say stuff like "don`t bother making it look like yours" and they truly mean it. When I do a nice job anyhow, they laugh about how nutty I am. I don`t think I know one single person who would pay for anything beyond a quick, mediocre job.

**gigondaz** · 10-27-2010, 11:12 AM

Acc, my core business and main target customers are those who`ll leave the car for a few days for 4-figure jobs.

My main headache is with "non-car lovers" recommended by my regular customers.

These are the un-informed ones who think that a simple "polish and wax" job will transform their poorly maintained paintworks. I used to spend time explaining to them that a `simple job" just won`t cut it. But they remain adamant and clarify that they hv no specific requirements except that, they just wanna a simple job. Many years back, I did that....and I swear I`ll never do it again. Good lesson learned.

Now...it`s strictly a FULL, extensive job first, followed by 2-steppers as maintenance, ...or I`ll just politely refer these cheapies to my friend who does budget jobs from his home garage.

My shop`s doors are mostly closed/half-closed as I don`t deal much with walk-in customers, and many competitors think its unorthodox and weird.

My experience is, when a layman walks by, notices the professional looking shop with gleaming cars inside being pampered by many fellas, it arouses their curiosity and they`ll walk in and ask how much to "polish and wax` like that? These are the old-school cheapie "polish and wax" consumers. Explain to them the REAL job and price, and their jaws drop. It`s a Bottega Venetta handbag which they`ll never buy. They just thank u and walk away.

At a glance or after a few minutes of chatting, you know that this person is NOT your typical customer. Why waste any more time?

My usual customer has paid huge bucks and I OWE it to him/her to devote my time on that car....and not waste time talking to passers-by who`re not my target market. Some people call it being "snobbish"...but I call it being realistic and efficient.

It`s like a sales person in a top-end Hermes boutique who`s so tired of entertaining every single person who walks into the shop, asking loads of questions and just walk out, while the REAL customer is waiting for service. But thank goodness....not everyone walks into these boutiques. Most just walk past/drive past and take a quick peek inside:chuckle::chuckle::chuckle:

**Accumulator** · 10-27-2010, 12:15 PM

gigondaz- Don`t get me wrong, I understand and agree completely! Heh heh, yeah...IMO that`s not snobbish, it`s just dealing with the right clientele; a lot of businesses I patronize are the exact same way, only catering to that small percentile. I`m just surprised that you have a sufficient number of (detailing) clients like that.