Pay scale detailers

**Joshua312** · 10-04-2006, 06:47 PM

Frank,

I now understand why I am so frustrated with your responses...Because everyone else felt the same way - I now know I`m not just being irrational in my thinking this thread and the current thread explain everything about you and your intentions http://autopia.org/forum/showthread.php?t=30737

Be it that this was in 2003 I still cant believe you havent yet changed your ways or haven`t been banned.

Other interesting posts by Frank:

http://autopia.org/forum/showthread....5&page=1&pp=12

http://autopia.org/forum/showthread.php?t=49224

Just a question that you probably won`t answer because it seems you like to ignore people who disagree with you - - Do you ever look at other people`s perspectives on the questions you ask or topics at hand. Or do you merely wish to speak your wisdom for everyone else to hear?

You constantly talk about services, marketing, and prices...Can you please inform us of the services you offer, your prices, and how you meet the customers needs? I checked out your site but all I found were instructional manuals that you sell...do you detail or just sell marketing information? It sounds like you run more of a car wash company than paint correction.

**Bobby G** · 10-04-2006, 08:17 PM

Let`s be sure to keep all comments in check and in the spirit of Autopia... thanks! :hifive:

**imported_mirrorfinishman** · 10-06-2006, 06:35 AM

Originally Posted by MX823

....since the idea of this topic seemed to be, how do detailers increase their perceived value of their service so they can charge rates in-line with the service they provide.

Seek out other detailers pro, part-time and weekenders (even the wash and wax guys) in your area and show them the light. Share information , educate, form a local association to discuss the challenges faced, collectively. So you can raise awareness. You may even have fun spending time with others that share your passion. :hifive:

Imagine more detailers within your DMA (direct market area) spreading the word. Just a thought?!

Although many in the industry will continue to view local detailers as direct competition, there is a lot to be said about teaming up with other pro detailers in your own area.

**EBPcivicsi** · 10-06-2006, 08:38 AM

Wow, what an interesting thread!!

Not sure that I can add much, but just some thoughts that come to mind....mostly random.

In *my* neck of the woods, it seems that no one can remove swirls, nor can they buff without instilling *horrible* holograms. The fact that I can remove this damage(or I think I can anyways

) makes my services more valuable to my clients. When they call me, I am their last resort--price *never* even comes up until I am finihsed and they ask "what`s the damage?" I could charge whatever I want, but I don`t--just the flat $40 an hour. Another thing that I should add is that *all* of my work is referral based, they know that I am "expensive" before I even show up.

So who needs to be educated? Perhaps we all do? I am all for it, let`s learn!! IMO, price is only an issue when a customer doesn`t understand exactly what you are doing. If they can see the value in what you are doing, price is the smallest part of the equation. Once they understand your services, and subsequently why they are paying what you charge, they will swear by your services. Until they reach this point, they are still prospects, not customers. I don`t even consider price shoppers, they are not my target market, they are more concerned with price than value--they always will be.

***DISCLAIMER***

I don`t do this full time, so I don`t even pretend to think of what I do to be the same as the guys around here who put food on the table with detailing. I have mucho respect for these guys, it seems like it could be a tough way to go depending on the market you are in.

**SamIam** · 10-06-2006, 08:47 AM

ebpcivicsi

Wow, great response. You have the clearest vision of anyone on this thread of who does business with you, why they come to you, and what you want out of it. Seems like a recipe for success to me. Congrats!

Sam

**imported_mirrorfinishman** · 10-06-2006, 09:38 AM

I had an interesting conversation yesterday with one of my good customers, an attorney who is also in business for himself. We got to talking about business costs, such as the high cost of health insurance. He mentioned that he was paying out over $2400 per month, which works out to almost $30,000 a year, to insure himself and three other employees.

During our conversation, he asked me how much I charge him to detail his cars. At first I was surprised by his question, especially when you figure I have been taking care of detailing his cars for more than 15 years. Then he went on to explain that since his wife takes care of paying the invoices and he has been completely satisfied with my work, he has never really had a reason to get involved with how much I am charging him. Imagine, the price had nothing to do with his decision to continue to call on me to detail his cars. In his mind, price was never a factor.

True story.

**Joshua312** · 10-06-2006, 09:49 AM

So you just show up, detail the cars without informing your customers on the price and send the invoice? - - You never spoke to anyone about pricing? Ever had anyone unhappy with your pricing when they recieved the invoice

**EBPcivicsi** · 10-06-2006, 10:03 AM

Originally Posted by Joshua312

So you just show up, detail the cars without informing your customers on the price and send the invoice? - - You never spoke to anyone about pricing? Ever had anyone unhappy with your pricing when they recieved the invoice

Happens to me on 90% of details, only I don`t invoice.

I show up, detail, they ask how much, then pay--they typically tip too. :nixweiss

**Setec Astronomy** · 10-06-2006, 10:03 AM

Originally Posted by mirrorfinishman

Imagine, the price had nothing to do with his decision to continue to call on me to detail his cars. In his mind, price was never a factor.

True story.

How does this fit in with the "educating the consumer..." diatribe? It sounds like you just proved what Scottwax said, that the key is finding the customer who wants an Autopian-level detail, not trying to "edumacate" a $3.95 car wash customer into one.

**SamIam** · 10-06-2006, 10:28 AM

Originally Posted by ebpcivicsi

Happens to me on 90% of details, only I don`t invoice.

I show up, detail, they ask how much, then pay--they typically tip too. :nixweiss

Dude, I LOVE your business model!

:hifive:

**imported_mirrorfinishman** · 10-06-2006, 10:35 AM

Mr. Sam. The man with a plan!

Now here`s a guy who understands the K.I.S.S. principle.

**wannafbody** · 10-06-2006, 05:34 PM

just to add another dimension. Plumbers and many other "contractor" type businesses not only have pay health insurance costs but also workers comp and many other insurances. In most cases those companies/individuals have to carry several MILLIONs of dollars worth of coverages. Those high hourly rates are needed to cover the insurance/operating costs of maintaining those businesses.

**imported_mirrorfinishman** · 10-07-2006, 05:34 AM

The reason why these people pay for health insurance costs, workers comp and many other insurances is because they clearly see themselves as operating professional businesses. When they carry several millions of dollars of coverages it is not only to protect themselves, it is also to protect their customers in case something happens that is beyond their control. They understand that as their business costs go up, so should their hourly rate pay scale.

**EBPcivicsi** · 10-07-2006, 07:31 AM

Originally Posted by wannafbody

just to add another dimension. Plumbers and many other "contractor" type businesses not only have pay health insurance costs but also workers comp and many other insurances. In most cases those companies/individuals have to carry several MILLIONs of dollars worth of coverages. Those high hourly rates are needed to cover the insurance/operating costs of maintaining those businesses.

Wouldn`t detailers have the same costs?

**Spilchy** · 10-07-2006, 09:34 AM

Originally Posted by SamIam

If you`re charging $275 for a detail, then you must be doing something right. Congrats. But making great money on the weekend detailing out of the back of your car, even doing it well, is not the same as running a successful detailing business.

Here is the problem in a nutshell. Even you, who know the difference, refer to lowpaid car washers or dealer cleanup guys as "Detailers". They aren`t, they are day laborers who wash cars. I doubt that successful detailers like Jim, or Joe, or some of the others can legitimately be compared to car washers. I would expect they are clean cut, professional, honest, etc., etc., and showing the same admirable traits in their profession that you show in yours.

Again, I am sure that you do a fine job, as does Sean, Joe, and any number of other detailers here. However, I believe there is a huge difference between running a successful detailing business, and as you admit, performing it as a weekend hobby, albeit, a lucrative hobby. And it seems to me, the ability to detail is probably not even the most important skill in establishing yourself and your business as a successful entity.

Here is an advertisement for a detailer in my neighborhood. Now tell me who gives a better image of what a detailer should be; me or this guy? This is what the public thinks of when it comes to who exactly is a detailer and the impression they are left with. This is why folks don`t like to pay good money for a detail or understand why they should. This is what I mean when I say I bring my professionalism from my career as an Operations Manager and help to elevate the industry with my weekend detailing business. (I have "X" out the names):

My name is XXXXX i`m 27 i detail cars for 9 years i`ve worked for XXXXX BMW,Qualaty Auto Body,i worked on Bmw,Mercedes,Ifinity,Jaguar,Porche, Lexus,Aston Martin for any question contact me at: XXX XXX XXXX

This is a fellow professional in the industry. This is what the public thinks about detailers. This is why friends of the family looked at me like I was crossed eyed when I said I wanted to open up my own detailing business. "You want to wash cars for a living?!" That`s what I got. Never mind I have almost 10 years experience in office administration such as payroll, benefits, insurance, bookeeping, invoicing, IT work, lawyer / accountant relationships, etc...

Many of the professional detailers on this board "work out of the trunk of their car" or van or truck, just as I work out of the trunk of my Jetta station wagon with my sandwich board sign to go at the foot of the driveway and professionaly designed and printed tri fold brochures, business cards, invoices, inspection sheets and check-off sheets. I leave the customer with a 2 page print out on how to maintain their finish and properly wash their car; complete with recommended products and procedures.

So, I stand by what I said; that weekend guys like me (and Joe and Sean and others here but who don`t post) work to give detailers a good image and understand what it means to run a small business with a focus on customer satisfaction, stellar results and tolerate nothing less than "Autopian standards" of professionalism.