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2008 Saturn - which polish?
I have 2008 black Saturn Aura (35K miles) that I polished a couple of years ago, and which sits outdoors in the blistering Texas sun all the time. The polish is (I assume) gone and the paint has begun to degrade a bit on the hood, trunk-top, and the roof. I have an electric polisher and 3 Poor Boy`s liquids left over from before (from their sample kit), but the polish is near empty. The paint needs a bit more grit treatment than the Poor Boy`s polish. I would like to order a Poor Boy`s product to bring back the paint surfaces that I mentioned prior to applying the Poor Boy`s polish. What Poor Boy`s product should I use?
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Re: 2008 Saturn - which polish?
Welcome to the forum!
This is kind of a loaded question that you have asked. First, when you say the "polish is gone and the paint has begun to degrade a bit", you understand that a polish doesn`t provide any paint protection, right? Notwithstanding some companies (like Zaino and Duragloss) that call their paint protectants "polishes". So after you are done restoring the brilliance to your paint with whatever Poorboy`s polish we agree on, you will need to apply a Poorboy`s or other paint sealant or wax.
Since you have used the phrases "blistering Texas sun" and "degrade a bit", be aware that what you are seeing could be early clearcoat failure, in which case polishing may not help. With that being said, and since you appear to have a PB`s sampler kit which I presume contains SSR1, SSR2, and SSR3, why don`t you replace the (near empty) SSR1, and simply use the SSR2 before that. And follow that up with some EX-P sealant.
Of course, there are many other products out there, which you may find equal or better to the Poorboy`s products, some of which will undoubtedly be mentioned by subsequent posters.
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Re: 2008 Saturn - which polish?
What I have is the Poorboy`s World Sample Kit #6 which contains (none of them are marked SS-anything, btw) :
Poorboy`s Professional Polish (almost empty)
Poorboy`s EX-P Sealant (3/4 empty)
Poorboy`s Black Hole Show Glaze (2/3 empty)
I am not positive whether I should use the sealant or the Black Hole last. Do you know?
And I need a slightly more cutting liquid than the Professional Polish (which it says is non-abrasive) in order to do the top parts of the car.
So what Poorboy`s products should I buy to do my car - maybe twice.
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Re: 2008 Saturn - which polish?
The Black Hole glaze is used before the EX-P sealant.
Sounds like you want to buy SSR1 which is a very mild polish, and SSR2 as a backup in case the SSR1 doesn`t have enough cut. Of course, according to this chart, SSR1 has very minimal correction ability, although a tad more than the Pro Polish: https://www.autopia.org/forums/paint...ighlight=chart
There`s a lot of choices in polishes out there, a lot of very good ones. A lot of buzz the last few years about the Sonax and Griot`s Boss polishes, I haven`t used either of them yet.
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Re: 2008 Saturn - which polish?
The car is a beater but I don`t want it to go totally bad. Not looking for show quality at all. Don`t want to do this more than once per year.
Maybe after polish I should use this?: https://www.autopia-carcare.com/blac...c-coating.html
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Re: 2008 Saturn - which polish?
A coating like that is a bit more of an advanced product, requiring some experience in the prep and application.
For less money you could get these two:
https://www.autopia-carcare.com/grio...l#.Xc124FdKi70
https://www.autopia-carcare.com/fini...l#.Xc13JVdKi70
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Re: 2008 Saturn - which polish?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
cwr64
I think you will be good with something like this with a quick one step polish and paint prep. Should get you around 9 months maintained properly.
https://www.autopia-carcare.com/gyeo...l#.Xc2BwVdKiUk
The other option is to continually use a spray on product throughout the year. There are quite a few silica spray sealants.
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Re: 2008 Saturn - which polish?
I`m surprised that nobody is suggesting the recently reviewed TW Ceramic Polish and Wax stuff that did so well in that extreme torture test. Seems like a decent one-step product with good lasting protection.
cwr64- Welcome to Autopia! Sorry, I can`t really make a definitive suggestion as I just don`t know what`s really going on with your paint. It`s very challenging to get, let alone keep, a black daily driver in nice condition, and I`d only consider a Coating if a vehicle is close to perfect.
Getting anything to last a full year under your conditions might be a big challenge, but that TW product I mentioned just might do it while being reasonably user-friendly.
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Re: 2008 Saturn - which polish?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Accumulator
I`m surprised that nobody is suggesting the recently reviewed TW Ceramic Polish and Wax stuff that did so well in that extreme torture test. Seems like a decent one-step product with good lasting protection.
Maybe some of us haven`t absorbed those products into our consciousness yet :wacko:
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Re: 2008 Saturn - which polish?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Setec Astronomy
Maybe some of us haven`t absorbed those products into our consciousness yet :wacko:
Heh heh, I`m a little surprised that *I* knew from that TW stuff! "New Posts"...never know what you`ll find, and/but I basically *NEVER* click on any kind of Detailing video, but I did on the one in that thread and, well..OK, sounds like it could be a viable choice for a lot of people. One-step that holds up to *Brake Fluid"?!? Color me impressed...for what it is ;)
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Re: 2008 Saturn - which polish?
So - would I first polish out my imperfect paint with a polishing liquid that has some ability to "cut" and then finish up with one of the TW coatings? If so, which coating should I use?
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Re: 2008 Saturn - which polish?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
cwr64
So - would I first polish out my imperfect paint with a polishing liquid that has some ability to "cut" and then finish up with one of the TW coatings? If so, which coating should I use?
I hope somebody who knows more about Coatings (and the TW lineup) responds..but the Ceramic Polish and Wax apparently has some really good protection in it and works well all by itself. If you do the dreaded SEARCH you oughta find that thread and there`s something there about what to use afterwards if you want more protection...all I remember is that you oughta wait a day or so before doing the extra step (so I`d probably wait until after the next wash).
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Re: 2008 Saturn - which polish?
So - would I first polish out my imperfect paint with a polishing liquid that has some ability to "cut" and then finish up with one of the coatings? If so, which coating should I use?
I don`t care especially that I use a TW coating. It appears that there are several coatings available from different companies and that there are both professional level and cheaper coatings available for non-professionals like me. I would like someone experienced to tell me exactly what coating and polish I should buy. I would like to do the deed in no more than 2 steps (1-polish then 2-coating?) and then have it last for at least a year.
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Re: 2008 Saturn - which polish?
As mentioned you can use the new TW Hybrid Solutions Ceramic Polish & Wax and then follow up with the Hybrid Solutions Spray Coating. It’s cheap and the benefit of a spray coating is you can reapply it as often as you like. Affordable as well if price is a concern.
If you are looking for a couple other options. These will take a bit more work.
Gyeon Primer followed by Gyeon Prep followed by 2 coats of Gyeon CanCoat. Maintain with their spray sealant Cure or equivalent and you should see about 9 months to a year.
CarPro Essence followed by CarPro Eraser followed by 2 coats of cquartz lite. Maintain with CarPro Elixir and you should get 9 months to a year.
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Re: 2008 Saturn - which polish?
In this case I somehow suspect that approaches like the Gyeon and Carpro are geared towards different users/goals.
No, that`s not a slam as even I myself wouldn`t try to do my Dailies with those, let alone if they only last that long.
The Guz- I`m kinda surprised that the Gyeon and CarPro wouldn`t last any longer than that...gee, I`m [ticked] if my conventional approaches don`t last at least that long! But then again, I gather my vehicles are awfully pampered..
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Re: 2008 Saturn - which polish?
Too many factors need to be taken into account for durability regardless of the protection. Not too mention that these are not full fledged coatings yet they perform as one. I would gladly take either one over a polymer sealant.
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Re: 2008 Saturn - which polish?
The Guz- Ah, OK..see how little I know about these?!?
Are they as foolproof as the conventional approaches (which IMO are basically impossible to really botch up, very different from the OptiCoat I`ve used)? What makes they preferable to you over a good sealant? (Not arguing by any means, just curious what could possibly be better as I could barely discern any benefits from the OptiCoat other than not having to redo every year or so; the whole OptiCoat experience made me wonder why I bothered with it.)
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Re: 2008 Saturn - which polish?
Days ago, I requested online (from both their sales people and customer service) at Turtle Wax asking which product they recommended for the particulars of my car. I have been unable to get anyone at TW to respond with information.
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Re: 2008 Saturn - which polish?
Sounds like TW’s CS can’t hold a candle to Autopia’s. [emoji3525]
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Re: 2008 Saturn - which polish?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
cwr64
Days ago, I requested online (from both their sales people and customer service) at Turtle Wax asking which product they recommended for the particulars of my car. I have been unable to get anyone at TW to respond with information.
We did the homework for you. These are new to the market.
https://www.autogeek.net/hybrid-solu...h-and-wax.html
https://www.autogeek.net/hybrid-solu...ing-53409.html
Plenty of videos on them already. Check out Apex Detailing as he has already covered the polish and the spray coating.
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Re: 2008 Saturn - which polish?
The TW spray coating is very forgiving. There are plenty of warnings about high spots on the bottle but I did not find any problems with removing high spots that had cured for over 24 hours. Same with the TW polish. Don`t over apply and its easy to remove. Spots that were missed the previous night removed easily the next morning.
The polish has some decent cut to it for removing water spots and light marring.
The shine is very nice and the combo has a very slick feel to it. The paint also has some nice optical depth to it. The paint color looks good, maybe slightly muted. Not as vivid as when I use PA products on my car.
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Re: 2008 Saturn - which polish?
I have ordered "TW Hybrid Solutions Ceramic Polish & Wax"
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Re: 2008 Saturn - which polish?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
cwr64
I have ordered "TW Hybrid Solutions Ceramic Polish & Wax"
Great! I hope you get a chance to post back about how it works for you (and that it`s all positive).
Remember that most people, most of the time, use way too much product ;) And, IMO, usually work too-large areas at a time under the wrong lighting.
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Re: 2008 Saturn - which polish?
I had a 2008 Black Saturn Sky and the paint was finicky. It polished out nice but left micro swirls. I used M205 finished with Menzerna PO85 if I remember correctly and topped with Autoglym EGP and it came out near flawless and I do like the protection the EGP does provide.
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Re: 2008 Saturn - which polish?
Street5927- Ah, that really got my attenion! Especially as I`m consistently *DISsatisfied* with how M205 finishes out (even on hard clear)...so I guess it`s no huge surprise that the Po85 left it really nice.
To be clear, the TW left it micromarred in a way that (even) the M205 fixed, right?
Oh, and it`s nice to see Autoglym being appreciated even if it`s not one of their products that i use (I like their Super Resin Polish topped with my usual FK1000P).
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Re: 2008 Saturn - which polish?
I will post back when I try the "TW Hybrid Solutions Ceramic Polish & Wax" later this week.
Supposed to be delivered to me tomorrow (Wednesday). But late in the day, with marginal weather and Thanksgiving day soon to follow.
I didn`t buy the TW Hybrid Solutions Ceramic Spray Coating yet. Will buy only if the TW Hybrid Solutions Ceramic Polish & Wax works out well.
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Re: 2008 Saturn - which polish?
So are you going to apply that by machine? Or are you using one of your existing polishes first with the machine before using the TW?
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Re: 2008 Saturn - which polish?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Accumulator
Street5927- Ah, that really got my attenion! Especially as I`m consistently *DISsatisfied* with how M205 finishes out (even on hard clear)...so I guess it`s no huge surprise that the Po85 left it really nice.
To be clear, the TW left it micromarred in a way that (even) the M205 fixed, right?
Oh, and it`s nice to see Autoglym being appreciated even if it`s not one of their products that i use (I like their Super Resin Polish topped with my usual FK1000P).
Accum, yes, the 205 did a great job even on the harder clear and the PO85rd finished it well. I do like to play with the Autoglym Products and have always had good results with them. I too like the SRP. I actually have some FK2180 in my arsenal which I have not used in a very long time. It`s somewhere in the back of my cabinet and has probably separated from not being used. I`ve never had a problem with it and liked the anti-static/anti-dusting properties to it when I would leave my vehicle in garage for a while and not drive it; but it`s just not something I think about going to....and I don`t know why...
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Re: 2008 Saturn - which polish?
Street5927- My little sample bottle of the FK2180 didn`t impress me much so I`ve never done anything significant with that one.
You and I might be the only people here who like the SRP...dusty as [Heck], stains trim, but I still like it anyhow :D
I`m always surprised when people like how the M205 finishes out (at least after the TSO are dissipated/stripped), but adding the the PO85rd oughta fix that just fine.
Autoglym`s Bumper Care is the only "exterior trim slime" product I use. It`s the only thing that makes the Tahoe`s runningboards look decent (for a little while, gotta redo them at every wash).
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Re: 2008 Saturn - which polish?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
cwr64
I will post back when I try the "TW Hybrid Solutions Ceramic Polish & Wax" later this week..
Repeating my usual "small areas at at time, proper inspection lighting" lecture ;)
I`m not sure I`d base my decision about the TW Hybrid Solutions Ceramic Spray entirely on your experiences with the Polish & Wax...the latter will be a bit paint-dependent since it`s an abrasive (possibility of different results with different hardnesses of paint).
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Re: 2008 Saturn - which polish?
Thanks to all of you.
Today I did receive the "TW Hybrid Solutions Ceramic Polish & Wax".
But I still don`t understand the need for "TW Hybrid Solutions Ceramic Spray Coating" in addition to the product I have now.
Help with that, please.
I read on the container of the Polish & Wax that I should wait 24hours before applying the Spray Coating, but I don`t understand what the Spray Coating will do for me that the Polish and Wax does not do.
And - reminder - I really don`t want to do a big wax job more than about once per year.
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Re: 2008 Saturn - which polish?
cwr64- The use of a "Topper" like the Spray (in this case the Spray on top of the Polish & Wax) is to add more protection. JUST protection (the Polish & Wax has, well...abrasive Polish..in it along with the protection of the "Wax" part). That Topper can be reapplied quickly/easily to extend the base protection of the P & W so it will last longer. Even if you didn`t mind the work, you don`t want to use an abrasive polish very often as it can thin the clearcoat. I`d think of that as your "Big Annual Job".
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Re: 2008 Saturn - which polish?
Thanks Accumulator. I`m afraid that a couple of spots on the front roof of the car just above the windshield may have gone a bit too long without protection and the clearcoat and paint may be beyond redemption. Hoping for the best but we`ll see.
I would begin work on the car today but it`s rainy and humid and the car needs a wash. Even in my unheated garage the humidity is high and I just don`t like trying to polish a car when humidity is high.
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Re: 2008 Saturn - which polish?
cwr64- Agree completely about the humidity! Nothing but trouble there...
Even if the clear is compromised in those areas, it`s well worth giving the car a great detail and trying to keep it that way. Consider this:
By the time I talked the original owner of my `93 Audi into selling it to me it was in *TERRIBLE* condition (elderly woman`s winter car...you can imagine :rolleyes: ). Its rich dark blue paint was so oxidized that the service records called it "gray" and it has numerous areas of complete clearcoat failure, a few are down to *primer*. BUT...after a Big Detail over a *decade ago* [Accumulator pats self on back ;) ] it still looks so good that strangers come up to me regularly to compliment me on my "old showcar" (their usual assumption, but when did a `93 become "old"?!?). Yeah, an Autopian might say "oughta repaint it", but to the rest of The Real World, it looks wonderful.
Get it as nice as you can. KEEP it as nice as you can. I bet you`ll pleasantly surprise yourself :D
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Re: 2008 Saturn - which polish?
Well, today I got after it after the sun came out and warmed things up. I used the TW ceramic polish & wax with my DA polisher. I did the trunk lid, the roof, and the front hood. The hood and trunk lid are not perfect but are not too bad. Maybe the paint was actually too hot - news said that it reached nearly 90 degrees this afternoon and I was working on a black car in direct sunlight, and the sheet metal got quite hot. The TW instructions said nothing about heat or shade. I did a couple of areas beneath the side windows where the paint was fairly good and those areas looked fantastic after the waxing. But the roof seems to have a big problem. As I look at the polished roof I see thousands/millions of tiny - maybe - pits in the finished surface. From a distance it looks fairly good but close up at an angle it looks pretty bad. In a couple of roof sections I tried extra polish with extra machine polishing but it made no difference. Any idea what to do? Also, I found it VERY difficult to EVENLY remove the haze after I polished sections. I tried to use only a little product but on those top surfaces, using the micro-fiber cloth, it still left slightly discolored marks where-ever the polisher had tracked. It did not seem to matter how much or little product was used or how much I ran the polisher in those areas.
So, some success but I about killed myself trying to wipe off the haze.
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Re: 2008 Saturn - which polish?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
cwr64
Well, today I got after it after the sun came out and warmed things up...
That warmth from the sun probably caused the difficulties. Hot panels + Detailing = Trouble.
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... Maybe the paint was actually too hot - news said that it reached nearly 90 degrees this afternoon and I was working on a black car in direct sunlight, and the sheet metal got quite hot./
You don`t want the panels to get hot when you`re doing this stuff. I know, easier said than done, but still..
If unavoidable, I`d be working *VERY* small areas at a time, and I sure don`t mean something 2` square. And I`d stick with products that reputable Autopians say will work OK in direct sun (assuming such products exist).
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..The TW instructions said nothing about heat or shade..
They probably assume nobody will use it in direct sun.
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the roof seems to have a big problem. As I look at the polished roof I see thousands/millions of tiny - maybe - pits in the finished surface. From a distance it looks fairly good but close up at an angle it looks pretty bad...
Early signs of clearcoat failure. You won`t make that better, and/but you could easily make it worse. DO NOT ABRADE IT FURTHER. You want...need...all the clear that`s left to keep the deterioration from accelerating.
Hey, my beaters had that kind of damage when I got `em ages ago and they`re still no worse so it`s not inevitable that the paint will completely fail any time soon, but being outside all the time sure won`t help.
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In a couple of roof sections I tried extra polish with extra machine polishing but it made no difference. Any idea what to do?
Taking off more paint isn`t what you want to do at this point, and it could precipitate wholesale failure.
Keep it well-LSPed, preferably with something that resists UV, and keep your fingers crossed. In a perfect world you`d limit its UV exposure as much as possible. The clock is ticking on the need to repaint so try to slow that down, not speed it up.
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Also, I found it VERY difficult to EVENLY remove the haze after I polished sections. I tried to use only a little product but on those top surfaces, using the micro-fiber cloth, it still left slightly discolored marks where-ever the polisher had tracked. It did not seem to matter how much or little product was used or how much I ran the polisher in those areas.
So, some success but I about killed myself trying to wipe off the haze.
It oughta wipe off almost effortlessly. These days, most *EVERY* product oughta be that easy unless something goes haywire.
Noting that I`ve never used that TW product, such issues probably come from the heat and working too-large areas.
Again, if you`re gonna work in such conditions you`ll need a product (if it exists) that`ll accommodate that heat and not flash off quickly and be hard to buff away.
Sorry if the above isn`t too useful...you have a big challenge there with your working conditions and after decades in climate-controlled shops I`m sure no authority on how to deal with them :o
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Re: 2008 Saturn - which polish?
Wiping off effortlessly ... It did wipe off easily in areas where the paint/finish was good in the first place- like on the side of the car right below the side windows. I did not keep on going because I was too wiped out from trying to get the "haze" off the top areas that I mentioned. Those tough areas still show some marking where no amount of rubbing with the microfiber cloths make it look right. Maybe someone will reply who has had experience working outdoors in sun/heat with this fairly new TW product. I tried to get a response from both TW Customer Service and TW sales as to which of their new TW products I should use but neither ever replied -and now it has been two weeks (shame on them). I`ll work on the remainder of my car as time and my ambition (now reduced) permit. There is room in my garage for a car now that the Christmas bins have been emptied and stacked out of the way. Meanwhile I`ll order the TW spray you guys recommended.
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Re: 2008 Saturn - which polish?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
cwr64
Wiping off effortlessly ... It did wipe off easily in areas where the paint/finish was good in the first place- like on the side of the car right below the side windows. I did not keep on going because I was too wiped out from trying to get the "haze" off the top areas that I mentioned. Those tough areas still show some marking where no amount of rubbing with the microfiber cloths make it look right. Maybe someone will reply who has had experience working outdoors in sun/heat with this fairly new TW product. I tried to get a response from both TW Customer Service and TW sales as to which of their new TW products I should use but neither ever replied -and now it has been two weeks (shame on them). I`ll work on the remainder of my car as time and my ambition (now reduced) permit. There is room in my garage for a car now that the Christmas bins have been emptied and stacked out of the way. Meanwhile I`ll order the TW spray you guys recommended.
I`m not totaly certain but think that when you wipe off the TW HS Ceramic Polish and Wax when you have polished a panel. You actually need to be spraying a couple of spritzes with water on it. This both helps with the removal and also so you activate the LSP in the polish. To spray water or a QD on most worked polishes will help you remove it easier. But with this product it`s recommend and needed to be spraying water on it before you wipe it off or just after you have wiped off most of it. Does it says anything about this in the description on the bottle?
Usually you don`t want to work the polish to much when used in the direct sunlight. And use a little extra polish on the pad. It`s usually a sweet spot when to wipe off a polish. As if you work it to little or to much it gets much harder to wipe it off. This can varies between polishes too so it`s a trial and error. In your case with a troubled clearcoat you can get a whole other experience when wiping the polish off so thinking it`s much cause of the condition of the paint you polishing that gets it harder to wipe it off. But a spray bottle with destilled water to help you get it easier off. Or if you have a damped mf towel and wipe it off and do a second pass with a dry mf towel to buff it up could work too. It`s not an easy task you are doing with both a weared clearcoat and in direct sunlight usually makes a big difference when it comes to the user friendlyness. Hope it`s helps a little to understand it.
/ Tony
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Re: 2008 Saturn - which polish?
Stuff I don`t know about this TW product that might be of importance:
- Do the abrasives diminish? I.e., do you have to "work it long enough" for it to work right?
- Since it leaves LSP-stuff behind, should it be allowed to dry/flash off completely before buffing?
- Will spritzing on water/etc. to aid in residue removal cause issues with that LSP-stuff?
cw64- Some thoughts about how certain sections went a *lot* easier than others and about the residual flaws:
- If the sides were consistently easier, maybe it`s because they didn`t heat up as much in the sun and/or it wasn`t as directly on those sections
- The pitting/etc. will indeed make things a little bit tougher, but IME it`s not a *huge* diff..maybe you treated those areas differently since they appeared to need more work?
- Even without seeing it, I`m confident that no matter what you do, you won`t make a night/day difference on the areas where the clear is already compromised. It`s simply damage that can only be fixed with a paintgun and that you`ll have to live with until if/when you go that route. Get the whole car done to whatever extent is genuinely doable (easy for us to spend your time/effort as well as your money ;) but you`re the guy actually investing in this, so I hope you expend your resources the way *you* think best). The upside is that nobody will see/care about that stuff except for you, the rest of the world will just see a "clean shiny car", which oughta be a good improvement over its Before condition.
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Re: 2008 Saturn - which polish?
I have the container in my hand and I can say that it says nothing about applying in direct sunlight. I DOES say to avoid hot surfaces and for sure I applied the product on a very hot car roof. Shame on me. I felt the roof late yesterday afternoon and I can now say that I am not certain the defects are pits. I can feel the almost-microscopic defects with my fingernails and it is possible the defects are tiny bumps rather than pits - but it is surprising that extra machining and rubbing with microfiber towel did not kill the defects at all.
Instructions say " Use a damp microfiber cloth to remove high spots (not sure what they mean by "high spots") and activate shine polymers". I did try using a damp microfiber cloth as directed and it seemed to do exactly nothing.
I will use higher magnification eyeglasses today to try to determine whether defects are pits or bumps.
Question unrelated: Using the polisher with Griot`s pink foam pads and Maguires conditioning spray. After about 15 minutes I noticed that the pad got pretty well "loaded" with the product, so I switched to a 2nd pink pad to continue work. Is that pad loading something I should avoid and change to a fresh pad more often or does it not really matter? Can the 1st pad be cleaned and put back into rotation while still damp from water?