Trouble correcting paint

**valleyrider** · 12-27-2013, 11:19 PM

I`m new to detailing and I have a few questions on polishing.

First, I started out with a GG6" polisher with both a CCS orange pad and an Optimum microfiber pad paired with either BF compound or Menzerna SI 1500 and found that it would require 2 applications using a 5-6 pass section pass each time in order to achieve the results I desired. I went out and purchased some M105 in order to achieve the results desired with less passes needed using the microfiber pad, it only took one 5-6 pass section pass to achieve the results needed.

Now this was on an 2006 Honda Ridgeline, come to this week and I am trying to correct my wife`s 2012 Toyota Camry and its taking 2 5-6 pass section passes with M105 on the microfiber pad in order to remove the swirls in her paint and even then there are places where swirls decide they don`t want to be removed. The car has been run through a swirl & shine wash once a week since new until recently when I decided to learn about detailing. I understand that DA polishers can only handle so much and a rotary has more power but does this sound about on par for compounding with a DA Polisher?

I placed an order for some Menzerna FG400 and some of the Meguiars extra cut microfiber disks in an effort to try to improve efficiency in the correction process.

When correcting I am using firm pressure to slow the pad down but ensuring that it is still rotating and with the speed set to 6. As far as I can tell I am priming the pad properly and I clean it on the fly after every set of section passes.

I`m not sure if this normal to experience with a DA polisher or if there is something wrong in my technique that is creating this scenario. From the posts I read it seems as if people are able to get better results with less aggressive products and fewer passes required to achieve said results.

I can get to some decent results it just takes a bit more time than I was anticipating. Here is a 50/50 of the Camry I am finishing up on.

**mrclean81** · 12-28-2013, 10:12 AM

Ridgelines and Camrys have soft paint. Have you considered that you might be using too heavy of a combo? M105 might be too aggressive for that particular paint. Try using something like M205 or another good polish on an orange or white pad and see what happens.

**Stokdgs** · 12-28-2013, 04:12 PM

How firm is the pressure? How much pad rotation are you getting with the firmest pressure?

How long are the passes? Fast ? Medium? Slow?

I agree completely with the above post - Meguiars 105 is too aggressive for soft Honda or Toyota paint - even more so in inexperienced hands..

If this was in my Shop, I would be using Optimum Hyper Polish, not the compound, on a L/C Hydro-Shred Cyan pad on a Makita 9227C..

Let us know more about your technique..

Good luck with this !
Dan F

**valleyrider** · 12-28-2013, 04:34 PM

Firm pressure so the pad rotates about twice a second
I`m using a very slow speed on my passes, maybe an inch every other second

I started out less aggressive but I wasn`t seeing any results without needing to reapply product multiple times.

I`m lost on how this may have been too aggressive if it still didn`t remove all the swirls on the first set of section passes and how a less aggressive polish might have been better.

**valleyrider** · 12-28-2013, 04:42 PM

I finished up the car this morning with some BF finishing polish on a white ccd pad with the DA polisher set to 4. I applied some PBL cleansing polish then surface coating on the paint and windows.

Here`s some before and afters

**Thomas Dekany** · 12-28-2013, 05:17 PM

You are doing fine.

**Stokdgs** · 12-28-2013, 10:22 PM

Originally Posted by valleyrider

Firm pressure so the pad rotates about twice a second
I`m using a very slow speed on my passes, maybe an inch every other second

I started out less aggressive but I wasn`t seeing any results without needing to reapply product multiple times.

I`m lost on how this may have been too aggressive if it still didn`t remove all the swirls on the first set of section passes and how a less aggressive polish might have been better.

Meguiars 105 is a pretty darn aggressive compound on any paint when used with a Rotary for sure..

One more question - sorry I cant remember - what size backing plate and pads? You want a smaller diameter like a 5" or so to get more pad rotation..

If you were not getting quick correction with M105, you were not using a good technique or pad/s...

In any event, you obviously found a good groove and make the car beautiful !!!!

Great job !!!
Dan F

**valleyrider** · 12-29-2013, 01:32 AM

Originally Posted by Stokdgs

Meguiars 105 is a pretty darn aggressive compound on any paint when used with a Rotary for sure..

One more question - sorry I cant remember - what size backing plate and pads? You want a smaller diameter like a 5" or so to get more pad rotation..

If you were not getting quick correction with M105, you were not using a good technique or pad/s...

In any event, you obviously found a good groove and make the car beautiful !!!!

Great job !!!
Dan F

I have a 5" plate with 5.5" pads on a DA not a rotary. I`m thinking I may try a bit less pressure to get more pad rotation on the next car. Next car looks like it has much finer swirls not nearly as deep as this Camry was so I`m hoping for good results from just a polish without a compound needed.

I`m still working on technique but I`m starting to find a few things that seem to work for me. Not getting fast correction with M105 though, still needed 2 sets if passes till the end before I switched to polish.

**Stokdgs** · 12-29-2013, 04:45 AM

Fresno -
You are doing great and as you have found, the more you work, the more you learn and improve !
My experiences with M105 from years past were that it wants to dry out quick and then stop working, so I would spray something on the paint to give the compound more work time and it would then finish breaking down and when done correctly, will actually leave you with great gloss and clarity...

When Meguiars came out with M101, they seemed to address the drying out part of the 105 so that it was able to work longer..

Everyone has their own personal technique with everything here... Its just how it works.. No exact number of passes, etc., that will give you the exact result, etc.., ever... Way too many variables, way too many definitions, opinions, etc...

What has worked for me has been to work the compound/polish until it is almost completely gone, or just a very thin layer left..

There is very little to wipe away and risk scratching the finish, and it looks great...

Will this mean that I might use more pads because they are carrying more of the by products ? Yes, but the trade off is so worth it to me. Pad Cleaner is cheap and very easy to use...

Again, everyone has their own way to get to the finish they want to achieve...

There is no perfect way that will always work for whatever paint is out there, and there are instead many ways to get to the same place..
Dan F

**valleyrider** · 12-30-2013, 07:39 PM

Originally Posted by Stokdgs

Fresno -
You are doing great and as you have found, the more you work, the more you learn and improve !
My experiences with M105 from years past were that it wants to dry out quick and then stop working, so I would spray something on the paint to give the compound more work time and it would then finish breaking down and when done correctly, will actually leave you with great gloss and clarity...

Will this mean that I might use more pads because they are carrying more of the by products ? Yes, but the trade off is so worth it to me. Pad Cleaner is cheap and very easy to use...

Dan F

M105 did dust on me quite a bit and looking back at it I probably was working it a bit long and that may have been part of my problem.

As far as pad cleaner, I have been using the pressure washer to clean the pads out and most of the residue would be removed. I do not have and actual pad cleaner yet so I would just spray the pads with some cleaner/degreaser at the end of the day for a final cleanup. Is there anything I can purchase at a common retail store that would work better for cleaning pads with since it will be a while before my next detailing purchase?

**Stokdgs** · 12-30-2013, 11:36 PM

There are specific pad cleaners and everything else...

I personally do not like rinsing zillions of soap suds out of pads so I have been using Snappy Clean pad cleaner powder for years..

Its quick, not soapy sudsy stuff; cleans really well, and rinses all out quickly...

I will mix up a packet in 2-3 gallons of water in a 5-gal container and throw pads in there as I use them, for a good presoak.. Sometimes, thats all that is needed, depending on the compound, paint type and how much residue comes off on the pads..

Dan F

**Todd@RUPES** · 12-31-2013, 10:53 AM

"The car has been run through a swirl & shine wash once a week since new until recently when I decided to learn about detailing. I understand that DA polishers can only handle so much and a rotary has more power but does this sound about on par for compounding with a DA Polisher?"

Your paint is trashed.. the marks in it are DEEP. It will take time. It looks like you are doing GREAT