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  1. #1

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    polishing questions

    Im new to this forum an Im unsure if there is a thread for this already but I`m gonna go ahead and post.

    So im branching out to doing other peoples vehicles and Im hoping to turn it into a business as I rather improve my technique and ability as a detailer. Up to now I`ve worked solely with my own vehicle and those of my family and a few friends. Each of the vehicles I`ve worked on is american made (mostly ford and GMC) so I know that the paint I`ve been working with is fairly thick. Im going to list the questions Ive got below and hopefully after all is said and done ill walk away far more confident about working on different vehicles than I am at the moment.

    1. My biggest concern is the different paint techniques used by the different makes. Im most worried about getting a vehicle with a thinner paint as apposed to that of my 2012 F150. Im going to order one of the Defelsko paint meters to help me with this. Now my actual question here is whats the best way to use the readings to determine the thickness of the paint and the thickness of the clear coat to better choose which polish/pad to use.

    2. Once Ive got my reading sorted and know the thickness of the paint how should I use that information to decide which pads to use for which steps?

    3. For body lines i know not to use a machine polisher as to not damage the paint. Would the most affective way to apply a polish to these areas be a microfiber applicator or is there a better method for doing so?

    Those are my main concerns with polishing at this point and any help is greatly appreciated!
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  2. #2
    dansautodetailing.com Stokdgs's Avatar
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    Re: polishing questions

    bamaboy94 -
    Welcome to the Forum !

    Great first post - thanks for telling us about your experience level...

    1. There are a lot of different thickness meters out there with DeFelsko having the most expensive meter at over $2k..

    None of the meters except perhaps the most expensive one are going to tell you - almost - exactly how thick the paint is, but rather they are going to give you an idea of the Total Thickness of the material on that spot of the panel in Mils or Microns...

    I prefer to use the Microns measurement because its to me the most accurate and quicker to change in value as you remove some of the top of the clearcoat on that spot you are working on.. This is because 1 Mil = 25.4 Microns, so if you are measuring in Mils, is the device not going to say something until you have knocked off 25,4 microns? I don`t even want to know that late if this is how it works, so I just keep it at Microns and know quickly if I have just removed even a part of a micron...

    There is only so much actual paint/clearcoat on every vehicle and the rest is going to be perhaps a Sealer, Primer, and then the actual paint..
    The tool is only measuring total thickness and no automotive manufacturer has ever said we put XXX amount of microns of paint on every car...

    There are some that measure the paint inside the door jambs and use that smaller measurement as a baseline to the amount of paint on the car, but I dont like to use that because who knows how much sealer and primer and paint was actually sprayed into the door jambs anyway??? I dont know...
    I do know it will have to be less paint and materials but how much is anybody`s guess..

    I just prefer to measure the thickness of that spot in microns, correct it and measure again to see how much I actually removed of the total thickness, remember, and decide if that is enough for that level of correction, or is the client paying for more correction, and go further or stop there...

    It is always better to error on the conservative side when working on any vehicle..

    2. Once you have measured the total thickness of the paint, you will be able to know if it is pretty even or is there less total thickness on the hood, top and trunk, which might tell you that this paint has been corrected before...

    The condition of the paintwork over the entire vehicle vs what the Client is actually paying you for then determines what you will use and do the the paintwork..

    If the total thickness across the entire vehicle is less than 100 microns, I would definitely be a lot more careful that you don`t take too much off.. And of course you will read the panel, work the panel and re-read it exactly as before to see if you changed it much or not...

    In terms of what pad/s and product to use, that is up to what you have in your inventory - please share that with us - and we can all give you input there, ok ??

    3. When you say body lines are you referring to sharp edges of the paintwork ? If so, know that because those are sharp edges, only so much material - sealer, primer, and paint can adhere to them, and it will always be much less than what is on the rest of the vehicle..

    It is possible to polish on the edges just lightly and quickly to clean them and then, look to see if its good ( and it almost always is), and go on past them...
    You cannot hurt an edge unless you put a lot of pressure and high pad rotation with a compound there, so dont be scared, but just know there is way less material there and it can be hurt more easily than any other part of the vehicle...

    I use nothing but Rotary Power and lightly touch edges very quickly and move on and have never hurt one...

    Good luck - hope to see you around the Campus !
    Dan F
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  3. #3

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    Re: polishing questions

    @stokdgs I appreciate the thoroughness of your reply. I am currently using the FLEX XC polisher sold by Chemical Guys on their website along with the hex logic pads that they produce as well. I also use their V line of polishes and compounds. With the body lines I am referring to any of the sharp edges along the body such as the indention on my rocker panels on my 2012 F150. Im not quite at the experience level Id like to be to use a rotary polisher so I will be sticking with the DA for a little while as its more user friendly and can prevent me from making any mistakes that could cost me a customer or customers. Now with the paint reader which brand would you recommend for someone who is newer to detailing a variety of vehicles as far as cost and effectiveness of said meter? Like I said in my original post Im fairly new to the prospect of working on other vehicles and want to be as prepared as I can when going to start. For example, Ive got my first vehicle lined up and its a 2006 BMW 330i. From what Ive been told from the owner its never had paint correction done and from my initial look at the vehicle the paint is in fairly good condition aside from some some swirl marks and marring. What would your process be to working on something like this? I appreciate the warm welcome to the forum as well. Im excited to get more into detailing and turning it into something not only beneficial for myself but others as well!
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  4. #4

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    Re: polishing questions

    I would also invest some time in reading Mike Phillips books and Kevin Brown`s articles on polishing paint. Good luck to you!
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  5. #5
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    Re: polishing questions

    Personally I would invest in a class with Mike Phillips before investing 2k on a paint thickness gauge. Learn the craft first. Always do a test spot with the least aggressive polish/pad you have (CG V38). Most importantly don`t get lost in the weeds and enjoy the process!
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  6. #6
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    Re: polishing questions

    Quote Originally Posted by bamaboy94 View Post

    1. My biggest concern is the different paint techniques used by the different makes. Im most worried about getting a vehicle with a thinner paint as apposed to that of my 2012 F150. Im going to order one of the Defelsko paint meters to help me with this. Now my actual question here is whats the best way to use the readings to determine the thickness of the paint and the thickness of the clear coat to better choose which polish/pad to use.

    2. Once Ive got my reading sorted and know the thickness of the paint how should I use that information to decide which pads to use for which steps?

    3. For body lines i know not to use a machine polisher as to not damage the paint. Would the most affective way to apply a polish to these areas be a microfiber applicator or is there a better method for doing so?

    Those are my main concerns with polishing at this point and any help is greatly appreciated!
    A lot of good thoughts already listed in the replies above.

    I will add mine...

    1.) Paint gauges are very rough estimates... even $2k+ models. I use mine to show me `red flags`... basically if I find a reading that varies widely from other areas on a vehicle. If this is OEM paint... that `red flag` would be a difference of +/- 50 or so microns, approximately. If it is an aftermarket repaint... then the variance would be quite larger because of potential repair (body filler) will vary these results + human sprayed paint system is less consistent and then you have the variable of texture removal if employed. All domestic OEM`s are reducing the amount of material sprayed on common passenger cars/ trucks. From my experience, higher end domestic performance models seem to have `good` readings and not affected as much by this trend. Checking the jamb with a lower priced PTG is really the only indicator as to what kind of build you have and again, it is a very, very rough estimate and should never be taken for granted. If you are quoting a vehicle and the customer wants polishing work... measure the paint in front of them all over the vehicle. If it doesn`t pass your `gut` feeling... let them know that you are not comfortable with an aggressive process. It is up to you to make the right call and that means looking after the customer`s best interest. A good way to quantify this is by asking questions. IE- "How long to intend to keep the vehicle?" If it is a long timeline and you have less paint to work with than should be... then you know to keep the service lite.

    2.) Pad/ product selection, at the onset, is pretty basic and already laid out for you by the manufacturer. IE- Finishing pad, polishing pad, compounding pad. Finishing polish, Compound. Etc... That will give you some direction but from there, it is all up to you. Test spotting is the only way to find which combo is going to achieve your and the customer`s goals. Every paint system will like a different approach. You don`t dictate what the paint `likes`... the paint dictates to you what it wants.

    3.) Edges and converging angles (B or C pillar to rear quarter) are always concerns as well as other body contours. A D/A polisher is gong to be `safer` than a rotary around these areas. If you are not comfortable machine polishing an area- don`t do it. Hand polish prior then machine polish as close as you are comfortable to the area(s) and that will help with a more uniform appearance. However, you have to become comfortable with it at some point if you hope to move into legitimate business mode.

    Best of luck,
    -Gabe
    Former Pro, Now Enthusiast
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  7. #7

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    Re: polishing questions

    Thank you as well for the feedback!! another question Ive got is in regards to the machine I am going to be using at the start. Im not comfortable on a rotary at the moment so I went with the TORQ 10FX from chemical guys along with ordering a full line of their hex logic pads. With the fact that its a DA polisher and more user friendly, especially for someone who is just starting out, what are the opinions on this machine? I plan on adding on to my arsenal as I move into summer and closer to the winter but for now it will be my go to. Does anyone have any information on it or whether or not it is a reliable tool to use?

 

 

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