Will a MF pad cut what a Meguiars foam cutting pad cant?

[RallyPig]

Hey guys!
I am new to the detailing world, and my current set up is a Meguiars MT-300 DA, 5" backing plate and pads. I have a couple cutting pads, a couple polishing and finishing pads of the new Meguiars line. I am using 105/205 on an older 2003 Corolla and 98 Audi Avant.

The trouble I am running into is while I am able to get 90% correction - I am having a very hard time with some deeper scratches. I give them the fingernail test - and while some fail and I move on - some that dont appear to be DEEP into the clear coat just dont want to buff out. Swirls, water etching etc all come out easily along with numerous other scratches. I am wondering if a MF pad (one of the extra cut 4-ply pads) will do the trick.

I am also having a little trouble with lighter scratches close to plastic - particularly on along the doors bump guard on the black corolla. I cant get the DA against the plastic - or tape over it and make the pad contour for that matter without stopping pad rotation no matter how I try to skin it.

I am thinking of getting a small 3" backing plate and MF pad - or - a small rotary tool (which will help A LOT with snug fog light areas on some other cars I may play on).

**almost off topic question but I dont want another thread going: How do you guys get into the door handles? I have done a couple by hand (I simply pulled off the DA pad and gave it a whirl by hand - but it took a long time 5 or 6 minutes. An additional 20-25 minutes per car with mediocre results). Maybe Ill try some turtle wax rubbing compound I have laying around when I get back too it.
the more I think about it the more I want to try a mini rotary out.

[Mary B]

I got a Mini Flex (pe-8), best investment ever ! She gets the edges with a Megs micro 3" pad, and into very tight places with an extension & 1"- 2" backing plates, just watch your pad compression so nothing overheats. ( paint, machine ) I run mine on speed 1 maybe 2 only.

[Mike lambert]

Microfiber is more aggressive so that should help you.under door handles I use d300 on a micro applicator. You may also consider 3000 finishing discs to avoid excessive heat on the clear.

[Stokdgs]

RallyPig -
Welcome to the Forum -

For under door handles (door cups), the all-around-best-process for me has always been a little Meguiars 105 on one of those thin, white cotton towels they sell at Target in the Automotive Section, on one of your fingers..

Make sure the M105 is just a little damp so it doesnt dry out, and rub under there long enough to finish the compound down and you will see beautifully finished door cups every time ! All the defects (fingernail scratches) will be gone !

Good luck -
Dan F

[Accumulator]

RallyPig- IMO you oughta be *VERY* leery of doing the deeper marring any more than you already are. Unless these vehicles are gonna *stay* marring-free for, say...at least three years...I dont think that aiming for >90% is even remotely reasonable.

Regarding the area behind/under the doorhandles- Heh heh, I wouldnt call "5-6 minutes" a long time! Back before products like M105 it could easily take well over an hour to do such stuff on Audis, sometimes it would take all afternoon. Which wasnt all bad as it took a lot of work to remove a lot of clear (which should always be approached very cautiously).

DO NOT use some second-grade compound in such areas as the subsequent finishing out might be an incredible PIA. M105/M101/etc. are plenty aggressive and will require a lot of finishing as it is, dont make for more work. Be *very* careful around any edges! The paint in that area on my older Audi was overthinned in a huge way long before I ever got the car, and it was obviously from trying to fix fingernail scratches near the doorhandles (which just got scratched up again by the original owner, all the correction on that car before I got it was a waste of time/effort/clearcoat as it just got marred again).

Remember that M105 doesnt "break down" it just dries out. If it dries out too much itll leave not-so-micro-marring and that can be a PIA.

IF youre bound and determined to get really aggressive, Id rather you do the heavy lifting with some *MILD* wetsanding, with something like 4K. But again, unless those areas will *NEVER* need aggressive correction again, I think itd be a really bad idea.

OK, OK..end of "Dont over-thin the clear!" lecture.

FWIW, much to my surprise I sometimes get *more* aggressive correction with aggressive foam cutting pads than I do with MF cutting disks! Seems to happen mostly with the Flex 3401 and my (no longer used) rotaries. Yellow LC cutting pads are nasty, leaving a bad finish; Maroon Meguiars cutting pads (both the old and new versions) work well for me. But foam is much harder to keep clean than MF and if they get loaded up things will go haywire.

[RallyPig]

Mary B. -
Yes! While buying a dedicated 3" machine is a bit out of budget right now, I did find that the MT-300 can be used with 3" backing plates (I knew 6" was OK but cool to find out the 3" is too).
This would really help in areas above emblems/between an edge, and rear license plate or fog light areas.

Mike Lambert -
Ive heard D300 doesnt cut as well as M105. Ive heard people *cut* M105 with the D300 to extend working times - however with a bit of quick detailer to prime the pad or a dot of M205 I can get M105 to have a decent working time. At least as long as I should be working one area to remove a scratch.
Maybe 3" MF pads with the adapter are the way to go.

Dan F. -
Thats a good tip. I may give that a shot as it will probably allow me to put more pressure on the area allowing that M105 to break down a bit quicker. Because yes, it does take longer than 5 minutes to Polish them afterwards (thankfully I havent had M105 finishing out poorly).

Accumulator-
Thank you as always for your in depth responses (I see them. All over the boards) Yes while it isnt a CRAZY long time (I am OCD about things as well) I feel its just alot of time comparatively to removing these scratches with a tool of sorts.
A bit of wet sanding sounds good but.. Man trying to finish them out after sounds like it may take quite a long time. I agree, these areas do appear visibly more thin too on cars. Seems a good place as any to apply a clear bra of sorts when Im done!
Yes, I may be trying to get it *too* perfect, and of course I am overshooting the goal a bit, however this is more about the experience than anything else to me at the moment.

Mastering each step, compounding, polishing and protecting in every area of the paint will take some time and everything is experience for me

[Accumulator]

RallyPig- Noting that my general advice concerning wetsanding is "if you have to ask any questions about it then just dont do it, ever"...using something like 3-4K (of high quality) makes for pretty easy finishing out even by hand. For nasty RIDS maybe a *TINY LITTLE BIT* of work with (good) 2K first, then the 4K.

And, heh heh..."in depth responses" sounds a lot nicer than "long-winded posts"

Repeating for emphasis as I consider it important and not just a matter of semantics- M105 does NOT break down, it merely dries out. Huge functional diff IME compared to compounds that do in fact break down into less aggressive abrasives. You are on the right track regarding its work time, adding something (I use HD Cut) can help if/when you want it to go longer. FWIW, I find that the additional cut of M101 combines with the short work-time of such compounds just right for me- I still only get a few passes but those few do the correction.

And yeah, before I got my little 3" pneumatic, I ran a 3" plate on a few different polishers with good results, though it could be a little awkward.

[Stokdgs]

RallyPig -
Apologies for using the words "Break Down" when speaking of Meguiars 105 -

Yes, Yes, it should have read "Finish Down" because it really does very nicely and if kept damp but not wet, it will not dry out the way it always wants to do right after you start using it the first few passes like on a foam pad with a Rotary, for example...

I used it on zillions of plastic parts on vehicles and it always Finishes Down beautifully clear and glossy..

Here is an example of someone using it around a door handle -- Polishing How To with Meguiar?s M105 / M205 | Ask a Pro Blog
This is exactly what I get using it under the door handle like I said above, and it doesnt really take that long...
What are you going for - speed or perfection ?
Good Luck !
Dan F

[Accumulator]

Stokdgs- Ya know...despite all sorts of attempts and lots of talking with guys like Kevin B. I cant get M105 to finish out OK when viewed under the SunGun in a dark room. Itll get close, and look OK under normal lighting, but even with the hard clear of the Audis/Tahoe, it needs a Final Polish.

And sorry for being all pendantic about that "breaking down" thing, I just dont want people to think that "all the abrasives are broken down, I can just wipe it off like broken-down Menzerna..". Dried out M105 is still mighty abrasive

And yeah, good point about keeping it on the damp side as opposed to letting it get too dry. Its *very* rare that I let a polish actually dry before I buff it off, only do that with products thatre made to be used that way.

[danlc95]

If youre considering the Turtle Wax Rubbing Compound in the tub, I wouldnt let it near a clear coat finish. Its unbelievably aggressive. If its their Premium Grade Rubbing Compound in the squeeze bottle, youll be ok.

[Accumulator]

As I just posted on another threat...with all the great products on the market these days, Id never *DREAM* of using anything questionable. Any potential savings (of time/money/hassle) just arent worth the risk of something going haywire.

Oh, on black exterior plastic parts, which I polish regularly with great success, M205 (let alone M105) was a disaster compared to my usual choices, especially once the Trade Secret Oils dissipated. Even ZAIO caused more issues than it solved and the resulting (not-so-micro) marring was a PIA to correct. IMO the abrasives are just a bit too sharp for use on such materials, but I suppose that different plastics will respond differently.