For anyone who doesn`t believe you can get swirls out with a DA...

**Jngrbrdman** · 11-29-2011, 11:57 AM

I have heard this for years that you can`t remove swirls with a DA. There are clearly two camps that say either you can or cannot. Well, I`m in the camp that says if you can`t remove swirls with a DA, then I wouldn`t recommend trying with a rotary polisher because you clearly don`t know what you are doing. Swirls can and will come out with a DA if you are using the right process and products. If you try to remove them with just a damp pad, then yeah... you`ll have some difficulties. With my FLEX and XMT2 on a blue Edge2000 pad, these are some of the results I get.

(ignore the water streak. I really wish that wasn`t there.)

The left part of this hood was polished and the rest is not yet.

Here is a good before/after on a nice Porsche.

This one is from some dog scratches on the door of an X5.

So just in case anyone ever tells you that in order to remove swirls you need a rotary, don`t believe them. Until recently I didn`t even own a rotary because I`ve never run into something that I`ve needed it for. I guess on that last picture if I really wanted to get every last scratch out then I could have used a rotary, but it isn`t like the dog isn`t going to jump up on it again or that the car is going into a museum or something. lol For a daily driver I don`t think perfection in the absolute sense is even a logical thing to strive for, but you can get close enough with a DA that 99% of people are going to think it is perfect. I guess I`m just not detailing the really nasty stuff, but I`d say that first picture was pretty nasty looking and it seemed to come out just fine with a DA. My motto is "You can do anything you know how to do." If you can`t remove swirls with a DA, then learn.

**Accumulator** · 11-29-2011, 01:07 PM

Jngrbrdman- Hey, it`s great to see you posting :wavey

**Jngrbrdman** · 11-29-2011, 01:27 PM

I owe it to Autopia to give back as much as I can considering how much I learned here. If it weren`t for the stuff I`ve read here, I would probably still think the burgundy bottles of Meguiar`s was as good as it gets and the blue Zymol wax at WalMart was the best of the best. lol We`ll see if I can avoid getting banned too many times.

**C. Charles Hahn** · 11-29-2011, 04:07 PM

Originally Posted by Jngrbrdman

I owe it to Autopia to give back as much as I can considering how much I learned here. If it weren`t for the stuff I`ve read here, I would probably still think the burgundy bottles of Meguiar`s was as good as it gets and the blue Zymol wax at WalMart was the best of the best. lol We`ll see if I can avoid getting banned too many times.

You were banned?

On another note, that sight looks familar (swirled up 996) -- great save, and you are 100% correct, there is absolutely no cause to hate on DA polishers!

**Brad B** · 11-29-2011, 05:21 PM

Originally Posted by Jngrbrdman

If it weren`t for the stuff I`ve read here, I would probably still think the burgundy bottles of Meguiar`s was as good as it gets and the blue Zymol wax at WalMart was the best of the best.

Yea but we developed techniques and skills to make even that crap look wonderful! Now with today`s technology we look like freaking magicians!

Life is good!

**Jngrbrdman** · 11-29-2011, 06:13 PM

You didn`t know? I think I hold the record for being banned from Autopia more than anyone else. lol All in good fun though.

That 996 is likely going to be on the market soon if you want it. lol The whole hood and fenders are protected under a clear bra, so that makes it nicer to detail now. Its a 2001 and he is letting it go for ridiculously cheap. Somewhere in the 30s I believe. He just drives it too much for it to make sense. He goes through four or five sets of tires a year. lol I`d buy it from him, but while I could afford the car I just don`t think I could afford the cost of ownership of one of those bad boys. lol I`ve got my heart set on the 997 anyway.

**C. Charles Hahn** · 11-29-2011, 09:15 PM

Originally Posted by Jngrbrdman

You didn`t know? I think I hold the record for being banned from Autopia more than anyone else. lol All in good fun though.

I kinda lost touch with all that after being perma-banned back in.... 2005 I think it was? That`s kinda funny though considering how long you were a mod here.

That 996 is likely going to be on the market soon if you want it. lol The whole hood and fenders are protected under a clear bra, so that makes it nicer to detail now. Its a 2001 and he is letting it go for ridiculously cheap. Somewhere in the 30s I believe. He just drives it too much for it to make sense. He goes through four or five sets of tires a year. lol I`d buy it from him, but while I could afford the car I just don`t think I could afford the cost of ownership of one of those bad boys. lol I`ve got my heart set on the 997 anyway.

4-5 sets of tires a year?

That`s some serious coin. Hope he`s got somebody paying an expense account for that! I`m in the same boat as you though; love those cars, but I wouldn`t want to own one since it would just be sitting 6+ months of the year.

**Jngrbrdman** · 11-29-2011, 10:40 PM

Originally Posted by Mush-Mouth

That`s some impressive correction work. Do you find yourself using a rotary much theses days? Oh, and btw, nice to see you back here. I use to follow your posts on DC back in the day. That place sure did die. This is my new home too.

Actually I just got the rotary less than a month ago. I was going to use it on a jet detail I did last week, but I forgot the backing plate, so I have still as of yet popped my rotary cherry. I`m really not in any rush though. I got it so I could bust out some larger projects like planes, RVs, and boats that I have lined up next year. The 3401 has plenty of what I need for everything I do, but time is also money, so if I can get results a little faster with a rotary on the really big projects, then I`m all for that. As far as correction goes, most the cars I deal with lately are either late model cars less than 5 years old or show vehicles that spend most of their time garaged. I am going to find a donor car to get some good practice with the rotary before I bust that out on anything worth real money. I`m really comfortable with a DA, but the rotary still scares me a little. Even the baby rotary like the PE14.

**Scottwax** · 11-30-2011, 12:05 AM

I mostly use my DA and MF pads for paint correction but still have to break the rotary out every once in a while, especially on Audis. Plus I like using it.

**Jngrbrdman** · 11-30-2011, 10:47 AM

For what its worth, and to anyone who hasn`t been a member of the forum very long, Scottwax is the ONLY person I have ever (virtually) met who can get swirls out by hand.

To this day you have made it impossible for me to tell people that it is impossible to do a paint correction on an entire car by hand. I will say that the PC is the entry level machine for getting this type of job done. It is nice to know that even you have to bust out the rotary sometimes though.

**Scottwax** · 11-30-2011, 12:01 PM

I haven`t done hand jobs in a long time.

Newer paints are so hard now (with a few exceptions) that other than spot polishing, you are a lot better off using a DA or rotary polisher and the proper pads and polishes.

**Deep Gloss Auto Salon** · 11-30-2011, 12:10 PM

Nice thread!

Originally Posted by Jngrbrdman

Scottwax is the ONLY person I have ever (virtually) met who can get swirls out by hand.

We all know Scott isn`t human. The heat he works in, full sunlight, middle of a parking lot, and great results... ya, he aint human. I have mucho respect for Scott! Props

**Accumulator** · 11-30-2011, 12:38 PM

Just a FWIW, there are still spots you`ll always have to do by hand, like behind door handles. I do it on the Audis when necessary, so yeah...by-hand correction *can* be done. But sheesh, what a job o` work!

Next time, I might try some of the super-fine (up to 1200 grit) sanding media I have, starting with maybe 4K for the aggressive work. But I won`t mind if that "next time" doesn`t happen for a few years

**Grimm** · 11-30-2011, 12:57 PM

Originally Posted by Scottwax

I haven`t done hand jobs in a long time.

Yikes! :tape:

**SVR** · 12-01-2011, 08:24 AM

Hey Long time no see mate, good to see you posting again

I am in the "YES YOU CAN" team

Even though I come from a Rotary only background, the DA machines today are sensational and are the first choice for 1 step up to concourse paint correction work. The rotary is great to have around for jewelling and orange peel removal though

Today I took out some horrendous swirls and scratches and reduced the orange peel with the Festool Rotex we have. Was done on a 2005 BMW M3. used european foam pad from Buff and Shine at speed 5 then back down slowly to 2. no holograms or marring left behind (quick 50/50 video done at the time)

With a microfibre pad from optimum, it works even better on paint defects. by end of 2012, even more things will be capable

I must say though that the extra heat from a rotary does give a paint finish that something extra on some paints.