Car Dealership Detailing In Action!

[C. Charles Hahn]

David Fermani you are right it has some glaze properties, but not enough to hide damage.

If a product has ANY glaze properties, it IS hiding SOME damage. Period. In your case, most likely it`s buffer trails from the wool pad.

I mention earlier that the first vehicle that I do has to stay looking good for the entire time that I am on the job in all weather conditions. This averages 3 to 4 weeks on each job.

So are you acknowledging an awareness that after that 3-4 week period, some of the damage you "removed" may come back as the glaze properties wear off?



Just trying to get to the bottom of what you`re actually doing, or at least what you think you`re actually doing -- this has been the point of contention all along here. If you recognize that by using a product with glaze properties and finishing with a wool pad that is not held flat to the paint surface you`re leaving damage behind that will eventually show up, then the problem we have is that you`re misrepresenting your work by saying all the damage is "gone." If on the other hand you don`t recognize that you`re leaving behind swirls/trails which will eventually show back up, please allow us to educate you and try to help you improve your technique so that doesn`t happen.



I realize it is the nature of dealerships to only care that a vehicle looks good long enough to move off their lot, and thus that is the standard you have to cater to in your chosen line of work, but hopefully you realize that is exactly what you`re doing. People other than overspray companies may see your videos, hear you say "all the damage is gone" and assume the buffing technique you demonstrated is the proper technique for actually removing damage, when in point of fact it`s just hiding a certain amount of the damage. Later these folks come to those of us who specialize in paintwork correction wondering why their damage came back after trying your methods on their own.



I would just urge you not to mislead viewers in that respect when creating videos -- let them know at the very least that there are extra steps involved that either aren`t being shown or aren`t being performed to get the results to actually last because of the type of business you`re in and the outcomes your customers expect and require.

[Jarreds]

A piece of masking tape on each end of the blade keeps it from scratching the paint and only touching the run.

I`ve done this many time to remove runs as well.



I`ve used a blade to scrape off yellow road paint before on the lowers but it was random splatters and not what I`d call over spray. IME it marrs the paint, and one slight slip and it can do irreparable damage to the paint. I would much rather use clay, chemical, or wet sand off over spray before taking a blade to it. Then again I try to avoid over spray job as much as possible.

[Jeff Suggs]

I wanted say to everyone for my part in all this I am sorry. Believe me that is not who I am. I just get a little offended when someone down grades my work. My work and the methods that I use is out of 23 years of trial and error. Everything bad that you can do with a razor blade to a vehicle, I have done. This is just part of the learning curve of blading a vehicle. When I get to a job, I always tell everyone that they are more then welcome to observe my process. I want them to come and watch so that they can see how I do this. I would like to meet some members at someones shop that everyone can meet at and demonstrate how I do this. When you see this in person, you will get it. I have never been to a job, and after I demonstrated my cleaning process was told "no thanks I will pass on that" This is a video of me removing industrial overspray from textured mirrors jeffsuggs`s Channel - YouTube

[Barry Theal]

Takes a real man to say sorry. Very cool of you. I think it would be great if everyone else who offended you would chime in as well.

[Jeff Suggs]

Think about this for a minute, when I am on a job the first vehicle I repair has to stay looking good for the entire time that I am a job. This is always 3 to 4 week in all weather conditions. When a customer has an estimate and they are looking to make some cash off the estimate they have for repairs, the first thing they do is bring it back to the paint shop that gave them the estimate. Now you have several paint and body shop guys that are looking for any little damage they can find. I never hide my cleaning methods, so they know that I used a razor blade to remove the overspray. I have shot down over $525,000 in estimates this year alone. I always save these estimate to show the insurer on the next claim.

If a product has ANY glaze properties, it IS hiding SOME damage. Period. In your case, most likely it`s buffer trails from the wool pad.







So are you acknowledging an awareness that after that 3-4 week period, some of the damage you "removed" may come back as the glaze properties wear off?



Just trying to get to the bottom of what you`re actually doing, or at least what you think you`re actually doing -- this has been the point of contention all along here. If you recognize that by using a product with glaze properties and finishing with a wool pad that is not held flat to the paint surface you`re leaving damage behind that will eventually show up, then the problem we have is that you`re misrepresenting your work by saying all the damage is "gone." If on the other hand you don`t recognize that you`re leaving behind swirls/trails which will eventually show back up, please allow us to educate you and try to help you improve your technique so that doesn`t happen.



I realize it is the nature of dealerships to only care that a vehicle looks good long enough to move off their lot, and thus that is the standard you have to cater to in your chosen line of work, but hopefully you realize that is exactly what you`re doing. People other than overspray companies may see your videos, hear you say "all the damage is gone" and assume the buffing technique you demonstrated is the proper technique for actually removing damage, when in point of fact it`s just hiding a certain amount of the damage. Later these folks come to those of us who specialize in paintwork correction wondering why their damage came back after trying your methods on their own.



I would just urge you not to mislead viewers in that respect when creating videos -- let them know at the very least that there are extra steps involved that either aren`t being shown or aren`t being performed to get the results to actually last because of the type of business you`re in and the outcomes your customers expect and require.

[Jeff Suggs]

This is a vehicle that I repaired in the Ford dealer ship paint and body shop. I show the estimate in the video, and it was over $4800 dollars. The guys in the shop were not too happy for me being there in their shop repairing a vehicle they had the estimate on. The insurer was an old friend of mine, and I did not want to let him down.jeffsuggs`s Channel - YouTube

[Jngrbrdman]

That`s just too painful to watch... Talk about using a cannon to kill a mosquito! You could have just clayed the overspay off and used a DA to do the rest. I mean, it`s silver for crying out loud! What is using a wool pad going to do for it that a DA wouldn`t do? Clearly he isn`t trying to correct all the damage since he isn`t even inspecting the work as he goes, so all he is doing is a burn and churn job in a dealership lot. I`m sorry, but what a hack... That`s ok though. I make good money fixing the problems guys like this create.

[C. Charles Hahn]

Think about this for a minute, when I am on a job the first vehicle I repair has to stay looking good for the entire time that I am a job. This is always 3 to 4 week in all weather conditions. When a customer has an estimate and they are looking to make some cash off the estimate they have for repairs, the first thing they do is bring it back to the paint shop that gave them the estimate. Now you have several paint and body shop guys that are looking for any little damage they can find. I never hide my cleaning methods, so they know that I used a razor blade to remove the overspray. I have shot down over $525,000 in estimates this year alone. I always save these estimate to show the insurer on the next claim.

Still doesn`t seem you bothered to read what I posted in order to address it....

[David Fermani]

David Fermani you are right it has some glaze properties, but not enough to hide damage. I mention earlier that the first vehicle that I do has to stay looking good for the entire time that I am on the job in all weather conditions. This averages 3 to 4 weeks on each job. The only thing I really use BC-2 for is to buff with, it has just enough cut to buff out light paint damage, and not swirl too much. I use other products that are not mentioned in my videos because the other overspray companies are watching the videos. They use BC-2 so it doesn`t manner if they know of me using that product. I am always looking for new products David and would like you opinion on some of the products sold through Autopia site. There is always something for everyone to learn in this business, and that would include me. I would also like to make a video demonstrating the products that I decide to use. This is a new ad that was made for California clay bar. I tried this clay and its okay but not on an industrial scale of use. Paintoversprayremovaloftexas-com-how-to-claybar-a-vehicle

Jeff – I could always tell the dealer cars my guys didn’t do a finishing step on after using wool. Wanna know why? They thought they could get away with 1 stepping a car with a wool pad/BC-2(usually) just because the car looked good *then*. But, after sitting on the dealer’s lot for up to 90 days (many times) the swirls would start to poke though as the fillers broke down. Back then we didn’t do alcohol wipe downs, but that doesn’t mean you can’t to confirm what I’m saying is accurate. Try using BC-2 with wool on a dark colored car, with lower speeds and keep the pad flat and moist. Then pull the car out side in the sun and wipe half the hood down with straight alcohol (once or twice) and see what comes back. You might be surprised!! There’s not a person @ Auto Magic that will say (with a straight face) that their polishes/glazes should be used with wool as a finishing devise for a swirl free finish. It breaks every principal they instruct.



But, and that’s a big but, we both know that overspray clients aren’t paying for their paint to look high polished and perfect. They just want and we’re getting paid to remove the paint contaminants and any damage we inflict as a result of said process. It boils down to returning the vehicle to pre-loss condition. I’m sure you’ve heard that term used before right?? What you’re doing is going above and beyond that requirement and it’s probably made you feel pretty proud about it too. Nothing wrong with that!! But you see, on this forum, people (Autopians) strive to go even further. We don’t stop until every square inch of a vehicle is polished to perfection and stays that way. We tend to avoid the use of glazes and exhaust every possible bit of shine from the surface before relying on any wax, sealant of glaze to protect our hard work. For some, it’s a sickness, for others it’s the only way they know. I hope that a little of this can “rub off� onto you!



As far as my opinion on products for your type of work, I actually have a couple of really good choices. Correct me if I’m wrong, but you essentially need a product that will remove minor oxidation and leve the paint clean and shiny right? You’d also like to go all this in as few steps as possible; probably 1 I take it? Well, if so, then you really need to look into buying a Dual Action Buffer (DA) and using the new Meguiar’s Micro Fiber cutting pads. I’d either use Meguiar’s new D300 polishing compound (smells like cinnamon) or HD UNO. Both can, when used with proper technique, can and will give you everything you’ll ever need.



Tools:

*Porter Cable XP:

http://www.detailersdomain.com/Porte...4XP_p_253.html

Dual Action Polisher - Porter Cable 7424XP for New Look of Your Car



*Meguiar’s MF Correction Pads: http://www.detailersdomain.com/Megui...ck-_p_554.html



Choice of Polishes:

*Meguiar’s D300 Polish: http://www.detailersdomain.com/Megui...300_p_552.html

*HD UNO: Auto Polish Product for Car Paint, Plastic & Glass - HD Uno 32oz | 3DProducts



Paint Sealants:

HD POXY: Polymer Sealant Car Wax & Car Paint Protectant - HD POXY 32 oz | 3D Products

Optimum Poly Seal: http://www.detailersdomain.com/Optim...eal_p_277.html





Both available through our forum sponsors and I believe they are offering up to 25% off right now too. Please let me know if you have any other questions. I really think these things could not only be a real eye opener for you and your business, but could dramatically improve your quality too. Trust me as I faithfully used Auto Magic products for nearly 2 decades and am not looking back.

[pmnewton]

Every time I watch one of his videos I think two things. 1.) That guy does an awful lot of cocaine and 2.) That guy has no idea how to use a buffer.

[Grimm]

I would agree, he`s not aiming for the perfect finish like everyone here. Watching that video of the red Ford truck, I could see the swirls in the hood when the lights hit it after he did the wool pass. I`m assuming the next step after that was the wax that was finished with. And for 95% of the population, his methods are probably going to give expected results for his customers. The paint probably isn`t any more swirled/scratched than before he touched it. All they are concerned with is removing the over spray.

[safetyman2010]

I would agree, he`s not aiming for the perfect finish like everyone here. Watching that video of the red Ford truck, I could see the swirls in the hood when the lights hit it after he did the wool pass. I`m assuming the next step after that was the wax that was finished with. And for 95% of the population, his methods are probably going to give expected results for his customers. The paint probably isn`t any more swirled/scratched than before he touched it. All they are concerned with is removing the over spray.

It`s always a complaint I have with overspray jobs is a majority of the cars are in brutal shape to begin with and there is no way you can just fix the overspray without having to fix preexisting problems to have it turn out acceptable. This summer we did an 8 car overspray job and I was fuming that one of the cars was a mid 1990`s Ford Escort that was absolutely covered in tree sap, hammered with fallout and probably hadn`t been washed in 10 years and the guy was `````ing about the overspray. Impossible to correct the overspray without fixing the other problems as well.

[Jeff Suggs]

My latest work Grimm check the trucks pre-existing report, the hood was attempted to be cleaned by the dealership paint and body grew. They wet sanded part of the hood before I started repairs. That was not swirls it was their wet sanding marks. I am not going to burn someone`s hood trying to fix the body shops mistakes. Check out these rides that i repaired from overspray damaged valued at over $45 million dollars. Now these rides got the works. jeffsuggs`s Channel - YouTube

[Envious Eric]

you know whats funny through all of this drama crap, his website and youtube channel are getting more and more hits from everyone looking at it, so in retro-spec, we are helping him get more business...Maybe I should start telling everyone my own stuff sucks and have 10000 people click on my website link and it will get bumped up in the google rankings...lol

[mikenap]

One thing that`s not so funny are the comments Jeff has made on his youtube channel to other users, including you Eric.



Jeff, I realize that you`re defending yourself and you have every right to do so. But the comments you`ve replied to others on your Youtube channel are crude and vulgar. If this was just an everyday, Joe Blow Youtube channel it wouldn`t be an issue, use whatever language you like especially if you feel you`re being attacked. But since you stress that these videos are for your clients, many of them might be turned off by some of the comments you`ve made, in particular about sisters, girlfriends, wives and mothers. Even though you and I have disagreed on a few things, this IS your livelihood and I`d hate to see you lose any business because of those comments. Don`t forget, when ANYONE goes to your channel, including people looking to hire you, those comments are there for the world to see.



Also, having nothing but pictures of underage, emo girls as your youtube friends sends a bad message too. BTW, you know those are all fake pics, right? Find me one teenage girl that cares about car overspray, much less 200.