Yet again, Makita 9227 of Flex 3401 RO?

**jchambers** · 04-27-2008, 02:21 PM

So, seeing that I have NO experience with a rotary, you guys are still saying get the Makita over the Flex DA? And maybe get another DA of some sort later on? Would you say the rotary is THAT much faster than a flex? I am being told the flex will cut down time from the udm around 40-50%. Is this true? Thanks guys!

**howareb** · 04-27-2008, 03:36 PM

Originally Posted by jchambers

So, seeing that I have NO experience with a rotary, you guys are still saying get the Makita over the Flex DA? And maybe get another DA of some sort later on? Would you say the rotary is THAT much faster than a flex? I am being told the flex will cut down time from the udm around 40-50%. Is this true? Thanks guys!

If you have experience with a PC/UDM then I would say that going to a rotary is the next logical step. If it is "damage" that you are worried about, then know that the Flex can also do damge to paint. Far less likely, but it can. Each tool needs to be respected for its capabilities. A rotary, if respected, is far above any other polishing tool. Even with no experience I would get it and if you do not feel comfortable, get some practice panels. You will quickly find out that it is not as much of a bear that people make it out to be. Take it slow in the beginning. If you learn how to master wool pads then using foam will become a breeze. Stay in control of the rotary, and keep it moving. If you follow these procedures then you will not burn paint.

There are also some decent video out there on buffing with a rotary. Kevin Farrell`s Buffing with confidence video (He uses a DeWalt but the priclple is the same) is a great primer for moving to the rotary. Always keeep in mind though that practice makes perfect.

**BBS01** · 04-27-2008, 04:35 PM

Originally Posted by jchambers

So, seeing that I have NO experience with a rotary, you guys are still saying get the Makita over the Flex DA? And maybe get another DA of some sort later on? Would you say the rotary is THAT much faster than a flex? I am being told the flex will cut down time from the udm around 40-50%. Is this true? Thanks guys!

I`ve been using the pc for 2 years and then udm for 1 and am finally jumping ship to the rotary. The pc and udm are more than enough for what i need them for but the rotary i hear cuts polishing time in half!

**jchambers** · 04-29-2008, 06:00 AM

Well I believe they are talking me into the Flex when ordering. It makes sense though, sense I am about to take a traveling job and will not have time to learn on panels and such, Also like he stated, most people have to go back over with a DA for a last step anyway to remove any holograms and I dont have the money for 2 machines right now. thanks for all the help guys! I still want to make the jump at some point.

**Rob Tomlin** · 04-29-2008, 12:27 PM

Originally Posted by howareb

If you have experience with a PC/UDM then I would say that going to a rotary is the next logical step. If it is "damage" that you are worried about, then know that the Flex can also do damge to paint. Far less likely, but it can. Each tool needs to be respected for its capabilities. A rotary, if respected, is far above any other polishing tool. Even with no experience I would get it and if you do not feel comfortable, get some practice panels. You will quickly find out that it is not as much of a bear that people make it out to be. Take it slow in the beginning. If you learn how to master wool pads then using foam will become a breeze. Stay in control of the rotary, and keep it moving. If you follow these procedures then you will not burn paint.

There are also some decent video out there on buffing with a rotary. Kevin Farrell`s Buffing with confidence video (He uses a DeWalt but the priclple is the same) is a great primer for moving to the rotary. Always keeep in mind though that practice makes perfect.

Other than being faster, what other benefits would a rotary have over the DA Flex (leaving price out of the equation)?

**Bert** · 04-29-2008, 02:26 PM

Originally Posted by Rob Tomlin

Other than being faster, what other benefits would a rotary have over the DA Flex (leaving price out of the equation)?

Generally the finish will look more "refined" with a rotary over a DA. Not to say you can do a good job with a DA but many will argue that you can do a better job with the rotary.

**SuperBee364** · 04-29-2008, 02:50 PM

Originally Posted by bert31

Generally the finish will look more "refined" with a rotary over a DA. Not to say you can do a good job with a DA but many will argue that you can do a better job with the rotary.

There`s also alot of people that say that you can`t beat a DA for final finishing. I`m in the rotary camp, though. A zero-bite finishing pad on a rotary gives you the ability to reach a polish`s maximum ability to jewel the finish by breaking down the abrasives in the polish to a higher degree (smaller abrasive size) than a DA can.

**WASHWAY** · 04-29-2008, 03:51 PM

Originally Posted by corythecarguy

I am a firm believer in the Makita . I have been using the same Makita for over 8 years now and I have never had a problem with it . I do take it apart and clean out any polishing dust from time to time and it has never let me down . I also agree that you will never need to use it at any speed higher than 3 . I have never used a PC or any other type of non rotary polisher . I learned on a rotary and that is how I have done every polish for the last 17 years . Rotary with 3 or 4 steps of pads-polishes and then on to hand applied wax . Lately I have been thinking about getting a PC just to see what all the fuss is about .

Cory

It is good to hear you maintain your polisher! Blow your polisher out with a blowgun before you put it away, and that will help remove the bulk of dust and polish inside. There is nothing better though than opening it up (after the warranty expires or they might use it as an excuse to void the warranty) and getting everything clean.

One thing I am surprised at is that more people don`t talk about the Dewalt DW849 variable speed polisher. It is a great tool and the most widely used here in California. I get customers calling for that and the PC 7424 more than anything else.

Danny

**Rob Tomlin** · 04-29-2008, 04:59 PM

Originally Posted by bert31

Generally the finish will look more "refined" with a rotary over a DA. Not to say you can do a good job with a DA but many will argue that you can do a better job with the rotary.

Will the Flex DA be able to correct swirls/scratches to the same extent as a Rotary (or close)?

**howareb** · 04-29-2008, 05:39 PM

Originally Posted by Rob Tomlin

Will the Flex DA be able to correct swirls/scratches to the same extent as a Rotary (or close)?

Well the main advantage of the rotary is the amount time needed to polish. However in the case of very hard clear coats a rotary is by far the best method. Although you can get an aggressive combo with a DA and do the same corrections with more time.

Basically the difference between the two is the balance of time vs. risk of damage. A rotary has faster correction time with a higher risk of damage, whereas a DA has a lower risk of damage but takes more time. Hope this helps.

**Rob Tomlin** · 04-29-2008, 06:05 PM

Originally Posted by howareb

Well the main advantage of the rotary is the amount time needed to polish. However in the case of very hard clear coats a rotary is by far the best method. Although you can get an aggressive combo with a DA and do the same corrections with more time.

Basically the difference between the two is the balance of time vs. risk of damage. A rotary has faster correction time with a higher risk of damage, whereas a DA has a lower risk of damage but takes more time. Hope this helps.

Yes, that helps tremendously, and I appreciate it.

For someone like me who mostly maintains my own cars and will occasionally detail a friend and family members car, I probably prefer to go the more time with less risk of damage route!

**TTWAGN** · 04-29-2008, 09:01 PM

SuperBee364 may be able to answer this.

With the flex 3403 lightweight rotary, when you have it on the lowest speed setting it runs at 1100rpm if the trigger is held down flat.

Now this is a normal speed which is fine, however is the trigger variable, so u can effectively get the buffer to spin at 600rpm by pulsing the trigger on and off?

That would be good to spread the polish out to avoid slinging and then just pull the trigger down and go straight to 1100rpm which is normal speed. Is this the same for the Makita as well?

My Metabo cant do this which is frustrating at times as the on/off switch gives less control when spreading the polish out.

Also are you limiting the 3403 buffers to 6inch pads? I use 8inch pads with my metabo and people say its more likely to go into thermal protection than the flex 3403 ligthweight rotary. Anyone use 8inch pads?

**charlesaferg** · 04-29-2008, 09:53 PM

I`ve never had problems with my metabo going into thermal shutdown, I`ve only attempted it once on purpose to see what happens, even then it never shut off. I found out that pressing down on the machine too hard won`t bog it down easily, but it will get hot.

Also, if you`re using Menzerna, don`t use water to prep the pads with these products.

**Scottwax** · 04-29-2008, 10:03 PM

Originally Posted by SuperBee364

There`s also alot of people that say that you can`t beat a DA for final finishing. I`m in the rotary camp, though. A zero-bite finishing pad on a rotary gives you the ability to reach a polish`s maximum ability to jewel the finish by breaking down the abrasives in the polish to a higher degree (smaller abrasive size) than a DA can.

Same here. On softer black paint, the buffer haze from a DA/RO buffer is very hard to get rid of completely. With the rotary, no buffer haze at all.

**Junebug** · 04-30-2008, 05:48 AM

The only thing I can add to this - (I have a PC and a Makita) is if you are using a rotary, you have to be careful with painted trim pieces like door moldings and bumpers. A rotary can (been there-done that) roll the paint off plastic. It was entirely my fault, I was trying to get too close to a piece of trim and was too stupid - should have taped it up. But, I learned from that and moved on. If you have a detail where the paint is in bad shape, you can do Megs 105 on wool, followed by Ultrafina on 3M blue foam and get fantastic results in much less time than you would spend with a PC, especially on black paint.

Most details I get lately can be polished up with just Ultrafina or Menzerna FFII, use a soft foam pad like 3M or LC gray-or white and you`re done. Just tape up trim!