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  1. #91

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    Re: 2018 Health and Fitness Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by jrock645 View Post
    Actually, everything ive ever read said cardio for fat loss should either be low intensity(in relation) to HR or be HIIT. Once your HR hits about 140, its not cardio anymore, but aroebic exercise. That burns carbs instead of fat. In keto, theres no carbs to burn so youll burn protein instead.
    Check out the recent research (especially that study using identical twins); every study I`ve seen says the same thing:

    Two cardiovascular benefits from "cardio":
    -Improved left ventricle function (from anaerobic work ~>90% HRmax HIIT/SIT)
    -Reduction/prevention of arterial stiffness (from lower intensity, in the ~75% HRmax range)

    Neither has been shown to do both. (So I max out during cardio sessions and also do the sorta-demanding dog walks.)

    Fat Loss:
    -in some studies, moderate intensity results in lower bodyWEIGHT
    -in all studies, anaerobic work results in lower bodyFAT

    Eh, guess I`m an example of how "there`s nothing worse than a reformed anything" I used to do the "fat-burning zone" stuff too but it was minimally effective and took forever. At 58, and exercising less, I do better with just a few minutes at near-HRmax (which isn`t even close the "220-age" thing, a tentative hypothesis that somehow took hold despite being subsequently discredited by even the guy who came up with it). Sure is unpleasant though

    But.... I get lots of lower intensity work in by just taking the dogs out and doing my regular chores, so I guess it`s easy for me to focus my "cardio training" on the more intensive stuff and think of everything else as "just activity".

    And, eh.. I can`t really speak from personal experience with regard to significant fat loss, think the most bodyfat I`ve ever lost was maybe 8lbs or so and that was in the early `90s. People who lose [big number]pounds and keep it off have my respect no matter how they do it.

  2. #92

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    Re: 2018 Health and Fitness Thread

    Thoughts on bodyfat%...

    -First time I got mine tested I had a visible sixpack and thought I was nice and lean, but it was 11%
    -When I got below (IIRC) 5-6% I looked decidedly unhealthy and felt lousy
    -Guys in magazines/etc. who supposedly have [minimal %] bodyfat look *infinitely* fatter than I do at those levels

    I only had mine tested using calipers, but the same tech got within 1% of the Immersion Method when my wife got tested both ways. (Uh-oh..maybe testing women is *that* different?) I finally quit having it done after dozens of sessions (at $10 per), just as I quit getting on the scale; now I just go by visual cues and how I feel.

  3. #93
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    Re: 2018 Health and Fitness Thread

    Itís a tricky thing for me. I had good results with low/moderate intensity stationary bike and losing fat but it gets really boring after doing it day after day. The bike sits in my living room unused at this point as Iím just burnt out on it anymore.

    As Iíve mentioned, the HIIT on the elliptical is a bit hard on the back and is guaranteed to knock me out of alignment. Sprinting is also out, due to impact. The stationary bikes at the gym donít look well suited for HIIT, so not sure what other option I have.

    The high(er) intensity cardio at 30-40 minutes on the elliptical gets the HR up to 150 or so... I actually enjoy, and itís good conditioning but probably not great for fat loss.

    Its ts a bit of a conundrum.

    I feel like Iím getting in better ďshapeĒ from a conditioning standpoint but thatís not yielding much aesthetically and def not on the scale. Torso looks a light bit tighter but my biggest problem area has always been my love handles- I was about 9% in high school and still had love handles. Just canít get rid of them.
    2018 Acura TLX ASpec

  4. #94

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    Re: 2018 Health and Fitness Thread

    jrock645- I gather I didn`t give offense yesterday..I`d been wondering about how I came across and..Oh Boy can I sound like a know-it-all windbag

    My wife and I were discussing this last night...back when I did longer/less intense sessions on the StairMaster I got my HR up to about 160 or so. Tough enough that I worked up a good sweat and felt I`d done a good workout, easy enough that I didn`t mind/dread it. So I really do know where you`re coming from...But that simply wasn`t the right thing for me to do and as I got older I had to quit doing ineffective stuff.

    Speaking of "not the right..", I`d sure avoid anything that messes you up! I can`t run sprints or jog much so I simply gave up on that stuff and now I play to my strengths, namely stuff that`s really hard but doesn`t injure me. Like, I can have some fun on an elliptical, but eh..not a real workout for me anyhow so I`d rather take the dogs for a hike in steep terrain.

    Anyhoo...FWIW I`d see about doing the HIIT on the bike; they used adjustable-resistance stationary bikes in the original Tabata study, adjusting the resistance so the trainees could barely maintain ~85rpms during the work intervals and they`d end the session if the rpms dropped below 80.

    BUT...yes indeed, the burnout/aversion factor! The only exercise that`s really effective is what you`ll keep doing.

    BI do think that if you really, REALLY spike your HR you oughta get good fat burning for a long time, MUCH longer than if you did less demanding work (which burns more during the excercise, but quits doing it shortly thereafter).

    (Eh, I wish I`d archived the studies that convinced me instead of just reading them. I`d really like to back up what I`m sayin` with some hard data. You can find them..eventually...by reading all the stuff on the websites for Clarence Bass, Dick Winnett, and uhm...Mercola, but from those you still gotta go find the actual studies and pore through the data..heap big research project.)

    Heh heh...repeat my advice to ignore the scale and keep doing the ~150 bpm work to keep your arteries OK. Just figure out a way to do harder work for the fat burning.

    I`ve had what I considered "loose skin" in that Love Handle area since I was a kid, so I sympathize. I made progress (finally) by working my obliques hard/frequently enough to keep them slightly overtrained. You know how "spot reduction is a myth?", well...note those scare-quotes. Recent advances in being able to track stuff on the cellular level implies differently, and perhaps it`s just coincidental but ever since I figured out good exercises for my Obliques and started doing them more often, I`ve tightened up that area quite nicely, guess it wasn`t all just loose skin after all! The oblique work is the only time I do really high reps, and it took a few months to be able to do many at all as the effective exercises were (?are?) very difficult for me. I`d been doing [crap] like side-bends or improper trunk-twists forever, but never realized they weren`t effective, thought I just wasn`t working hard enough.

    EDIT: I`m assuming your diet is relatively good...trying to out-exercise a poor diet is a losing proposition long-term.

  5. #95
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    Re: 2018 Health and Fitness Thread

    Diet has been very on point for the past month or so. Strict keto, didn’t have a real cheat meal until earlier this week. Intake has been minimal- obviously calories still matter in keto.

    All told, I’ve lost 2lbs. All told, I’m probably only about 8-10lbs from where I’m really trying to get to. The last few are always the toughest to lose, right?

    Ultimately, I feel good. Definitely feel my body making the keto switch. Less inflammation, calmer stomach, steady energy and sleep patterns and I feel good in the gym, plus little hunger and no food cravings.

    I tell myself to just keep chipping away at it.
    2018 Acura TLX ASpec

  6. #96

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    Re: 2018 Health and Fitness Thread

    jrock645- I was reading a bit on the Keto diet recently (mostly at Mercola Fitness) if only to better understand where you`re coming from.

    What`s your targeted rate of fat loss? I think in terms of around 1lb./month but I gather most want to lose faster than that.

  7. #97
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    Re: 2018 Health and Fitness Thread

    More than a lb a month, for sure. 8months to lose 8lbs - just as an example- doesn’t sound like a real winning formula to me. I don’t have a real firm number in mind, but the lack of progress is frustrating.

    Did some work at the gym today- 20 minutes incline walking, calisthenics routine, around 20 total sets for legs, and 40 minutes on the elliptical.

    Been skipping the bcaa’s during my workouts this week and keeping the heart rate down a bit- ammonia smell is much less. Still present a bit, but I wonder if some of that is residual in my workout clothes- some smells like that never really wash out.

    Tried a sensory deprivation/float tank last Monday. Was interesting. Same place offers IR sauna, going back tomorrow after my chiropractor appointment to try that out and see what’s different about it and a regular sauna, which I use after my workout almost every trip to the gym.
    2018 Acura TLX ASpec

  8. #98
    Autopia Specialist RaysWay's Avatar
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    Re: 2018 Health and Fitness Thread

    I joined LA Fitness yesterday and worked out in a gym for the first time in....a long time. Felt great. Normally when I join the gym I`m in bad shape and its a rough start, this time at least I`m in mobile detailing shape so I feel like I have a headstart. Officially joining this thread

  9. #99
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    Re: 2018 Health and Fitness Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by RaysWay View Post
    I joined LA Fitness yesterday and worked out in a gym for the first time in....a long time. Felt great. Normally when I join the gym I`m in bad shape and its a rough start, this time at least I`m in mobile detailing shape so I feel like I have a headstart. Officially joining this thread
    Good to have you along Ray!
    2018 Acura TLX ASpec

  10. #100

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    Re: 2018 Health and Fitness Thread

    RaysWay- Hey, good to see you posting here!

    Hope you like the LA Fitness, I bet that satisfaction with the gym (the whole experience of it) can factor in.

    jrock645- Eh, you and I just approach some of this stuff differently I expect to see visible progress maybe every four months or so... very gradually.

    I think of my "progress" in the sense of "by next year I`ll be dialed-in and by 2020 I`ll be in top shape for my 60th". That`s is, BTW, my actual gameplan- I figure it at about 5lbs. bodyfat max that I might lose over about 22 months, but it won`t really be an even 0.25/mo. Doing that without losing muscle or compromising my performance will be challenging enough for Yours Truly!

    20 sets for legs?!? Yikes, last time I did both upper and lower legs on the same day I did...let`s see...maybe 8 sets total, got so sore I couldn`t do cardio for five days (par for the course after doing upper legs anyhow), took nearly three weeks before I was ready to do quads/hams again.

    Did you ever notice any benefit from taking BCAAs? I tried them back in the `90s with zero discernible benefit, then quit taking them with zero discernible effect. Total waste of my money, but some folks swear by `em.
    Likes RaysWay liked this post

  11. #101
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    Re: 2018 Health and Fitness Thread

    As for the bcaa’s, I see a slight improvement in endurance and recovery, but it’s not major. That said, that’s more than I’ve ever been able to say for creatine. Despite all the studies, I’ve never gotten any discernible benefit from taking it. I’m either a nonresponder or I just don’t notice what it’s supposedly doing.

    I think it’s important to note context here, in regards to expectations with results. You’re at a considerably lower bf% than me and seem to be working toward improving where you’re already at. I’m trying to get back to where I’ve gotten the past couple summers. Just not sure why it seems harder to push things forward this time around.
    2018 Acura TLX ASpec

  12. #102

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    Re: 2018 Health and Fitness Thread

    jrock645- Yeah, I`m in a somewhat different place when it comes to my goals and fortunately it fits in with my tendency to take the long view.

    On the creatine, isn`t it funny how experiences differ?!? I`m a genuine poster child for what Creatine can do, my results were simply amazing.

    Heh heh...noting your "non-responder" status with that...when I was a kid everybody from my MD to..well, everybody...told me I was an *exercise* non-responder who just wasn`t destined for physical fitness! Heh heh HEH..there`s a little satisfaction right there, amusing to run into folks who haven`t seen me for a long time. People literally don`t recognize me

    Hey, something I did find beneficial that I didn`t expect- polyphenol supplementation. I`d thought it was almost certainly a generally good thing, but was shocked to find that after a few months I just had a vague, but undeniable, sense of being healthier. Still can`t really describe what I`m getting out of it, I just *FEEL BETTER* and that`s the variable that I credit. Basically the in-a-capsule equivalent of eating tons of blueberries/etc. every day. Never woulda thunk it...but OK.

  13. #103
    My name is Mike mjlinane's Avatar
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    Re: 2018 Health and Fitness Thread

    FWIW - I lost 2-3 lbs per week on a time restricted Ketogenic diet with minimal exercise. (So ate keto but only from 11AM-6PM - not counting the morning Bulletproof coffee which should not cause insulin spike.) Once you become fat adapted, actually pretty easy to do. "Accidentally" lost 10 lbs recently that I really wasn`t trying to. Down to a BMI below 22 and 12%-ish BF.

    Am experimenting now with true intermittent fasting (as compared with keto which is basically carb fasting) - more for anti-aging and health benefits rather than weight-loss.

    I do my exercise in a fasted state early in the AM and still do not eat until lunch.

  14. #104

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    Re: 2018 Health and Fitness Thread

    mjlinane- I do my cardio pre-bfast, but I can`t lift worth a [crap] that way or even do my more demanding chores.

    I`ve read about the supposed benefits of Intermittent Fasting (Mercola is really big on it).. you planning to go on to longer-term water fasting or somesuch?

    You get much metabolic slowdown while fasting? You able to do strenuous work in that state?

    Heh heh, I`m so sensitive to caloric restriction that you can practically tell by looking at me if I`m a little late for a meal

  15. #105

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    Re: 2018 Health and Fitness Thread

    Thinking about Fueling the Workout...I don`t think I`ve *EVER* had a mediocre (let alone bad) or unproductive workout after a Denny`s bfast. Probably the least healthy meal I ever have, but !oh man! does it get that specific job done. It`s the same way with [other types of training] too, I always perform to spec after I eat that [crap..(which is what it is)].

 

 
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