Menzerna Finishing Touch Glaze

**Neophyte** · 03-27-2002, 12:00 AM

I understand a polishing product is designed to remove surface contaminents, swirls, oxidized paint, etc. So, if I have a new car which has never been washed or waxed except for the inital dealer prep for delivery, do I need to do the polishing step?

Seems to me, as a beginner at this stuff, getting the car completely clean with a car shampoo product and then going straight to the wax or sealant should work.

For example, I`m considering buying the $299 Blackfire Perfect Shine Kit from Classic Motoring Accessories. It looks pretty complete from someone just starting out. (Is that a good price?)

But it seems like I could skip using the Blackfire Gloss Enhancing Polish, since there shouldn`t be any swirls or oxidation to get rid of on my car. The paint should be near factory perfect. So, to my way of thinking, I`d clean it with Blackfire Gloss Shampoo & Conditioner and then apply the Blackfire All Finish Paint Protection, and finish with a quick wipe of the Deep Gloss Spray.

Am I right or wrong?

One more question: can I layer the BF All Finish Paint Protection to get more protection, like folks talk about doing with carnauba-based waxes?

As much as a super-glossy wax job might look great, I`m far more interested in protecting my paint with a durable, long-lasting finish. I won`t have time to wax every 4-6 weeks, and I will be tracking my car, so it`ll be squashing a lot of bugs at high speed, etc. Protection is my #1 priority.

Thanks!

Chris aka the Neophyte detailer

**Steve @ Guru** · 03-27-2002, 12:29 AM

Welcome to the forum, first and foremost. Hope you find the information helpful and friendly (I always do)

Couple of things:

1) If it were my car, I would tell the dealer not to do a thing to it - don`t let them wash it, don`t let them do anything to it. Take it "as is".

2) Once home, I would wash it with a strong detergent like Dawn dish soap. You don`t want to do this regularly, but for this first wash it`s appropriate.

3) Buy yourself a good bar of paint cleaning clay like ClayMagic, Griot`s, Mothers, Pinnacle, or Zaino. Do a search for clay if you need help with how to use it. No matter what anyone else says, I always clay my cars when I buy a new one...you`ll be surprised at how much "junk" you can pick-up off the surface of a new car.

4) Once it`s clayed, I`d wash it again with normal car wash solution.

5) I would use a paint prep lotion like P21S, simply because it has a very gentle cleanser in it, and it adds extra gloss/shine/depth. It is quickly becoming my very favorite product. It`s called "P21S Paintwork Cleansing Lotion" and it costs about $10 from CMA.

6) Now, for protection....this is going to get interesting, but I would suggest you go with Zaino if you`re looking for long lasting all-out protection. In my tests, it was by far, the longest lasting product we tested.
I would purchase: Z1 (or ZFX - one or the other, not both), Z5, Z6 and some Z7 wash. I`d put on a few coats of Z5 (maybe three) and then I`d wash it with Z7 as needed. You`ll find that three coats is good for about 4-6 months without any trouble at all. Do a search for Zaino or go to www.zainobros.com for more info.

In my testing, the BlackFire just wasn`t durable enough for my liking. However, if you go that route, you`ll absolutely want to use the polish as it "sets" the stage for the sealant. Zaino is the same way, which is why you`ll need either the Z1 or ZFX.

Finally, you might be interested in trying Klasse`s products (search). They lasted longer than the BlackFire in my tests, but not as long as the Zaino.

If you want to go the carnauba route, try out some Collinite carnauba`s, or Meguiar`s #26.

Hope this helps...first thing I`d do is some searching & reading of the archives, then let us know how you`re doing. Best of luck!

**Malibu** · 03-27-2002, 02:25 AM

Hi Neophyte, welcome to the forum!

First of all, listen to what Steve says, he knows what he`s talking about!

Next, before you settle on one product, do a search for Klasse, Zaino and Blackfire. Since one of your main concerns is longevity and durability, a polymer sealant would be what you are looking for. There are pros and cons of each system, and a little research will go a long way in determining what will work for you[/i]. Personally, I use Zaino and I love it. I pretty much put my car to the ultimate test in terms of testing the strength of a polymer. My Explorer gets Zainoed all summer, then driven 2500 miles to MI, then exposed to eight months of horrid roads, awful weather, snow, salt, Ann Arbor drivers, etc. with hardly any washes (I know, I know, but when it`s 10 degrees out and you have three midterms the following week, washing the car just doesn`t happen as often as it should), then a 2500 mile drive back to LA. With just one Z7 wash when I am back in LA, my car looks like it`s just been polished[/i]. So I can definitely recommend Zaino, but like I said, do some research on all the sealants and see what will work out the best for you. Good luck!

Mike

**imported_Intermezzo** · 03-27-2002, 05:09 AM

If protection is your #1 priority, then I would definitely go with either Klasse or Zaino and stay away from Blackfire as I wasn`t too happy with BF`s durability either.

It`s hard to say which would last longer between Klasse or Zaino, but I will say that in my experience, Zaino retains its `just detailed` properties (like slickness, smoothness & shine) a notch better than Klasse.

**Steve @ Guru** · 03-27-2002, 09:05 PM

<blockquote class=`ipsBlockquote` >

Originally posted by Malibu [/i]

First of all, listen to what Steve says, he knows what he`s talking about!
[/b]</blockquote>
*blushing*

aww, shucks. You guys are gonna give me a big head pretty soon!

Thanks for the compliment!
-Steve

**Malibu** · 03-27-2002, 09:42 PM

<blockquote class=`ipsBlockquote` >

Originally posted by geekysteve [/i]


Thanks for the compliment!
[/b]</blockquote>
You`re welcome!

Actually, I have a question for you about the P21S Paintwork Cleansing Lotion, since you`ve piqued my interest in it. My spring detailing plan is:

1) Dawn wash
2) Clay (Blue ClayMagic - I love this clay)
3) Polish with 3M Perfect-It III
4) P21S Paintwork Cleansing Lotion
5) Zaino, Zaino and more Zaino

Now, should I be washing again between any of those steps? The way I clay is after washing the whole car with Dawn, I go right to the claying, using a water/Z7 mixture, clay one panel, rinse off, move to the next, etc. and then dry the whole car off. I usually wash with Z7 after the polishing step, but will that be necessary with the P21S?

Thanks!

Mike

**vettefan67** · 03-27-2002, 09:46 PM

By Perfect-It III you mean Perfect-It III Machine Glaze, right? A knowledgeable 3M rep told me that this stuff is about the same abrasiveness as the retail 3M 39009 SMR but with no fillers or silicones.

I thought you said it has no swirls? Why on earth are you using an abrasive to polish paint that is not in need of polishing?

**Malibu** · 03-27-2002, 10:04 PM

Yup, it`s Perfect-It III Machine Glaze. Actually, I was told the same thing as you were and wanted to give it a try. I used it last year when I had to get rid of swirls (had to take it through an auto wash during winter. Ouch, never doing that again, but the salt really had to go!) and it did a fantastic job. I guess I should rephrase myself: I`ll use it on any problem areas that I find after I dawn wash it. This will be my first time using a PC on the car, and I`m sure I didn`t do as good of a job last year as I could have. In fact, I know that I will have to use it on the right fender, thanks to some bonehead around here.

Anyway, did all that make sense?

Mike

**Steve @ Guru** · 03-27-2002, 10:05 PM

Yes, you`ll definitely want to give it a quick wash after the p21s and before the zaino. If you`re using a wax like collinite, etc after the p21s lotion, then you can skip the wash.

I know that in theory the wash should get rid of the oils in the p21s, but i`ve always been happy with the results. It`s never interfered with my zaino results, and I`ve tried it twice without using the p21s, only to later wish I had used the p21s first.

**imported_Intermezzo** · 03-29-2002, 03:50 PM

GeekySteve,

It makes absolute sense to do wash off the oils after using a product like PPCL/P21S PCL to allow for proper bonding. However, on the advice of a few forum members, I`ve applied two coats of Z-5 on a friend`s car right after cleaning it with PPCL (no wash in between) and the car seems to be holding up fine. It`s been about two months and the car is still very slick and beads like a `properly` zaino`d car would. In fact, I know someone on another forum who applies Zaino right after polishing his car with 3M SMR with silimar results. This goes against my understanding of the way Zaino bonds to your paint. What do you make of that?

Thanks.

Tony

**Steve @ Guru** · 03-29-2002, 04:52 PM

It`s interesting, to say the least. When I did that 740iL yesterday, I gave it a quick wash just to be safe. I`ll have to give it a shot though, maybe on a test panel, just to see how it works.

I know that from our tests, when we applied Z right on top of our freshly prepped panels (Meguiars DACP, SFP, #9), we had a lot of streaking and hazing...but we also applied a tad too much as well.

Well, now I have something to do this weekend!

**jdthompson** · 06-11-2011, 10:53 AM

I`d like y`alls recommendations on the right kind of glaze product to use, after I`ve polished my car with Blackfire Gloss Enhancing Polish and before applying Blackfire All Finish Paint Protectant.

It seems like the Menzerna Finishing Touch Glaze would be the right product, but it`s apparently not being carried by PAC anymore?

Thanks all.

**imported_glfahlc** · 06-11-2011, 07:11 PM

i always was under the impression if you polished to perfection then a glaze was waste of time and product... polish....gloss enhancing polish....bfwd.

**Old Pirate** · 06-11-2011, 07:27 PM

If you want to Glaze after using BF Gloss Enhancing Polish then it`s OK to do. Just remember that some Glaze`s don`t stay on the surface as long as one wants too.