This Weeks Chat Topic "Water Conscious Detailing" with special guest Mel Craig

[Ben@3D]

Hey Guys,



Thanks for those that were here for our chat session last night. Was fun while it lasted. Unfortunately, the internet here at 3D went down part way though and there were a few issues with the chat program itself. Hopefully we can sort those out for next week.



So do you guys have any ideas on chat topics and should we continue the Water Conservation topic from last night?

[Paul Sparks]

With the chat starting with a couple of hic-ups it eventually seemed to be back up to speed. I can only speak for myself on this so here goes. I recognize the industry is constantly changing and leaning in the green direction. Rinseless and waterless wash products have come a long way since 05 when my interest in detailing really took off and became more then a way to just clean my car. Being located in the midwest and having the seasonal changes that we do the demands for eco-friendly wash is on a different level then say southern Ca or Fl. As I drove around today I noticed the local tunnel wash was lined up over a block and I thought that most of those customers could care less about saving water or going green. They only wanted to get the salt spray from this weeks snow off their car and for it to shine a little. This is what we expect three months or more out of each year. These cars aren`t going to come clean with only four towels and a few ounces of product. In the summer and spring there is quite a different story. We can market a rinseless or waterless wash to many of our customers as a altenative option. I will admit I have almost no knowledge of our guest speaker from last night and with all due respect if we start running out of useable water then washing ous cars and serviceing customers most likely won`t be our first priorty. I have read about about the tree-huggers and farmers tug-of-war over water rights out west , and shortages in Ga last season but here locally it hasn`t effected us and IMO not likely to any time soon.So I try to remain open to new ideas and have been using ONR and CG Eco-wash with good results on a limited basis. Just want to also again thank Ben and 3D for the chat room and being able to explore more options in the detailing industry.

OK everybody wake up I`m off my soap box. LOL.

[C. Charles Hahn]

Hey Guys,



Thanks for those that were here for our chat session last night. Was fun while it lasted. Unfortunately, the internet here at 3D went down part way though and there were a few issues with the chat program itself. Hopefully we can sort those out for next week.



So do you guys have any ideas on chat topics and should we continue the Water Conservation topic from last night?

So the internet went down; is that why Mel left so abruptly, then?



I`m going to be perfectly candid about how I felt things went in the chat last night; that topic missed the target by a mile and a half. Here`s why:



1) Obviously, technical issues at the outset that were beyond anyone`s full control didn`t help.



2) Mel`s message seemed to get off on the wrong foot. It seemed to be a quasi-camouflaged attempt at either a sales pitch, a training session, or a real-time interactive click and brag session. I almost hate to say it, but in a way I felt like I was listening to Bud`s threads all over again. All of the statistics about x number of gallons saved, x number of towels and ounces of product needed to clean cars, how tree-huggers will pay x% more for "green" services, and talk of how technique is important to prevent scratches (but no detailed description of the technique), it was all saying a lot without saying much at all. I realize Mel makes his money from conducting training classes and having a proven method but if he`s going to be the "guest presenter" in a chat like that, he needs to come prepared to either answer questions (generally the point of an interactive chat session) or be transparent that his motives are to sell people on buying his training and using the products he`s promoting. When I asked him point blank if that`s why he was there he denied it -- to me that was not cool.



3) It didn`t appear that the topic or discussion took into account who the audience was, and no mention of who the message was going to be calibrated toward was given beforehand. I understand that Autopia casts a wide net and caters to a variety of people, and there`s nothing wrong with that. However if the majority of people participating in a chat are going to be enthusiasts and high end detailers, the topic and tone being set should focus on things that will interest them and be beneficial. On the other hand if the desire is to attract specialty service providers and volume operators, the chat should be marketed to those types in advance and it should be made clear that`s the intent for that given week.



Perhaps a good strategy would be to say "On the first and third week of each month, we will hold a chat featuring a guest who will focus on the technical challenges faced by high end detailers and enthusiasts. On the second and fourth week of each month we will hold a chat featuring guests speaking about the business interests of growing and maintaining high volume shops or mobile services." This would help to avoid any confusion or clashes about what motives are being presented in a chat, and make it clear that a diverse population is being offered a reason to be here.



Autopia has historically been all about raising the bar, and I think leveraging these chats as an opportunity to continue on that mission and legacy is a great thing. However, I think it needs to be approached in a more purposeful and structured manner in order to be effective from here on out.

[Ben@3D]

Thanks for the honest and candid feedback Charles.



If it seemed like it was a camouflaged sales pitch, that is not what the intent was. The goal was definitely to get more people to wrap their heads around the idea of using less water in detailing. Sure Mel obviously has a background in detailing classes and preaches waterless washes in those classes. He uses that to fall back on in making points such as how much water has been saved from students using waterless methods.



The major issue I saw was too many jokes and comments that went in 20 directions at once. Mel was trying to present his case while people were asking more questions and expecting an immediate answer while he is still taking about something else. Also, not everyone types as quickly as others.



Mel would of eventually gotten to people questions, but the untimely internet problems prevented that.

[Ben@3D]

Something to think about....



25 Signs That A Horrific Global Water Crisis Is Coming :

[mikenap]

Thanks for the honest and candid feedback Charles.



If it seemed like it was a camouflaged sales pitch, that is not what the intent was. The goal was definitely to get more people to wrap their heads around the idea of using less water in detailing. Sure Mel obviously has a background in detailing classes and preaches waterless washes in those classes. He uses that to fall back on in making points such as how much water has been saved from students using waterless methods.



The major issue I saw was too many jokes and comments that went in 20 directions at once. Mel was trying to present his case while people were asking more questions and expecting an immediate answer while he is still taking about something else. Also, not everyone types as quickly as others.



Mel would of eventually gotten to people questions, but the untimely internet problems prevented that.

I agree there was a lot of that going on. Ultimately, though, you will almost always get that kind of behavior in an open-forum chat. If there had been a "hold all questions until the end" kind of vibe, it would be different. But being an open chat means the guest presenter NEEDS to be quick to answer questions, deflect hecklers (no names here...), and manage/guide the flow of conversation, all at the same time. And that`s no easy task, even for someone like Mel. It`s like being in a classroom with a bunch of unruly ADHD kids!:dizzy:

[C. Charles Hahn]

Thanks for the honest and candid feedback Charles.



If it seemed like it was a camouflaged sales pitch, that is not what the intent was. The goal was definitely to get more people to wrap their heads around the idea of using less water in detailing. Sure Mel obviously has a background in detailing classes and preaches waterless washes in those classes. He uses that to fall back on in making points such as how much water has been saved from students using waterless methods.



The major issue I saw was too many jokes and comments that went in 20 directions at once. Mel was trying to present his case while people were asking more questions and expecting an immediate answer while he is still taking about something else. Also, not everyone types as quickly as others.



Mel would of eventually gotten to people questions, but the untimely internet problems prevented that.

Thank you for addressing that, Ben. Sounds like the idea was solid, but the execution/format was flawed. I guess my impression was that the idea of having video-enabled chat was so the guest presenter could "take the floor" and stream a presentation at the beginning, and then the floor could be opened for discussion afterward. That would have avoided much of the problems you cited.



Perhaps in the process of searching for and evaluating software (since you said we`re scrapping the AVChat) that should be a priority -- making sure moderation to fit a presentation like that can be done easily and effectively.

I agree there was a lot of that going on. Ultimately, though, you will almost always get that kind of behavior in an open-forum chat. If there had been a "hold all questions until the end" kind of vibe, it would be different. But being an open chat means the guest presenter NEEDS to be quick to answer questions, deflect hecklers (no names here...), and manage/guide the flow of conversation, all at the same time. And that`s no easy task, even for someone like Mel. It`s like being in a classroom with a bunch of unruly ADHD kids!:dizzy:

:werd: I agree 100%.

[Bunky]

I participated (i.e., watched Mel`s comments) in the chat for a while and then dropped off when it seemed to be repetitive and could tell some were getting restless so likely little benefit.



I know there is a pending water crisis and this can be used as a marketing tool to sell to green leaning type people but I know the drill baby drill types do not buy into it so there would be no convincing (hence smart remarks). The pending regulations on water restrictions will drive it. I have heard Mel before on this subject so was not surprised at the points.



I am glad there will be some revamping on the chat room but still think it is better than any other detailing related chatroom (old DC, TID). I do think having a clear agenda outline in advance will help for some structured discussions.



What I would like to see is a demo by Mel or someone on doing a mobile waterless wash type detail including products used (Mel`s classes usually have a commercial sponsor (had been CG, AG, etc) so wonder if the products change), tools, towel management, etc. I may have missed all this after I left.

[Juan@Turbo Wax]

The major issue I saw was too many jokes and comments that went in 20 directions at once.nger:



For me that was the biggest issue, very hard to understand and follow a presentation with such activities taking place. Maybe a live video feed will be more suitable in that way the speaker can do his thing and as the questions comes in, he can answer them in order without interrupting his presentation. :think:

[Total Pro]

Hey everyone, I want to say we`re very sorry the link was dropped during the waterless topic. I had some very cool info I wanted to share. The topic of the waterless issues at hand was not and was never intended to be any type of sales pitch or ploy to divert anyone into misconception or deceit. I Just wanted to make a point that the future holds some very strong issues and concerns as to where the industry may or may not go. I was hoping to show everyone that there are solutions to protecting our position as professional detailers. Yes, I have been in this business for over 38 years but that has nothing to do whether or not you have to listen to me or what I might have to say. You all own your own businesses and get to decide for yourself what is the best choice for you and your companies. A lot of you are not only professional detailers you`re also professional business people as well. Most professional business people I`ve dealt with over the years are open minded to new ideas and options and just wanted to put some perspective on some great business ideas. For those of you that know me know that I`ve always been about helping people out and raising the bar in the industry.



Since 2004 when the first detailer that approached me and letting me know he had to stop detailing cars on the streets of Solana Beach Calif because the EPA (environment Protection Agency) wrote him a ticket for $500.00 I decided to do what ever it takes to help in anyway I could to come up with ideas and solutions that may make it possible for a man like that to continue his business and support his two little girls. BTW, today he is still in business and doing unreal. I`ve help countless detailers all over the world in many challenges they have faced and will do the same for anyone else that needs that type of support. This is all about being a team and creating something great for all of us. Building futures and creating new things is what makes industries great. If business was easy everyone would do it and there would not be much money in it. Business is hard and that`s what makes it great when it works. Please feel free to contact me for any further advice or help. I want to thank those of you that actually called me and private emailed me looking for answers and more info. Its guys like you that make it all worth while... Thanks again and you are all going to be hearing a lot more from me and our team from this point on... Hey Kenny, you are the man and Im stoked for your success my friend... Keep it up!