Is it possible to achieve perfection?

[daystrom]

Just like the subject says....Is it possible to have visual perfection even on black paint on a daily driven car? Seems like just driving gives you spider webbing. Is it possible to have 0 marks in your paint, no spider webbing, nothing but 100% perfection even in direct sunlight?



Todd

[kiaser]

It`s a never ending battle with a black car, that`s for sure!



ANYTHING that touches the paint creates marring. That goes for towels, pads, dust, etc. It may be so slight that you wouldn`t be able to see the marring, but it`s there. So driving daily is going to create marring no matter what (you`ll have to remove collected dust sometime). To keep absolute perfection you`d probably have to be doing some buffing bi-weekly.

[Accumulator]

IMO it *can* be done, but that`s not counting the inevitable things that happen (stone chips, "deer incidents" ) if you actually *drive* the vehicle.



IMO the "swirls"/"spiderwebbing"/etc. that people are always concerned with is about 99.9% wash-related (I`m not considering special cases like people who live by a desert). I`ve never had marring of this type from just *using* a car. Learn to move the dirt off the paint without rubbing the dirt *into* the paint and you shouldn`t have marring.



But that`s not to say that everyone will find it worth the effort. It takes me a few hours to wash, and I can`t be inattentive for even a moment. Gotta contantly consider the pressure of the mitt against the paint, the flow from the foamgun, the dirt on the panel and how it`s reacting to my washing, and all the other factors that can contribute to marring. It`s a lot of work. Imagine spending as long washing *one* panel as you might usually spend washing a whole car. Unimaginable? OK, I can see that. But it takes me hours longer to wash "right" compared with a "normal" two-bucket wash (which I can do as fast as anyone, but not without some light marring).



Every now and then I`ll still mess up and cause some marring despite my efforts. But nt often; I don`t have to polish more than once a year, if that. If you don`t rub dirt into the paint it won`t get marred. If your paint keeps getting messed up you`re either gonna have to learn to live with it or polish all the time and run out of paint. Or learn how to avoid inflicting the damage in the first place.



Besides technique, there`s frequency. The longer dirt stays on the vehicle the harder it`ll be to get it off without marring. How often do you really want to wash, let alone wash "correctly"? Life is short ;

ANYTHING that touches the paint creates marring. That goes for towels, pads

Well, I wouldn`t go that far. There are plenty of things that are softer than automotive paint (a wet sheepskin mitt lubed with carwash solution, for example). YOu can inspect with a 30X lighted magnifier and prove to yourself what is/isn`t safe. And note that when people test things on CDs, for instance, they often test the materials *dry* even though they`ll be lubed with product in actual detailing applications. It`s the *dirt* that usually causes the problems. By all means eliminate the obvious offenders (coarse synthetic mitts, etc.), but then worry about how to safely move that dirt off the panels.

[Bill D]

Well said, as always Accumulator! :up



I`ve resorted to using a new, fresh sheepskin mitt at least after each panel. This brings me better piece of mind than worrying that perhaps after rinsing off my present mitt, if indeed, I truly got all of any contaminants out of it. A nice fresh one, either new and machine washed or machine washed and inspected in advance, always stored in a sealed plastic bag satisfies me.



I guesstimate a usage,on average of 6 or so mitts per washing sessions. Sure, to most this sounds way extreme, but for me, the more the merrier.

[pontman43]

Well said, as always Accumulator! :up



I`ve resorted to using a new, fresh sheepskin mitt at least after each panel. This brings me better piece of mind than worrying that perhaps after rinsing off my present mitt, if indeed, I truly got all of any contaminants out of it. A nice fresh one, either new and machine washed or machine washed and inspected in advance, always stored in a sealed plastic bag satisfies me.



I guesstimate a usage,on average of 6 or so mitts per washing sessions. Sure, to most this sounds way extreme, but for me, the more the merrier.

:LOLOL ya, that does sound extreme. :xyxthumbs

[JeffM]

Visual perfection under lighting is pretty difficult. Im talking about getting your nose 4 inches from the paint with a light on it.



My black sections of my truck look pretty much perfect even in direct sunlight aside from chips and a scratch here and there.



But get down on the paint with a bright light and there is microscopic scratches that cannot be viewed even in direct sun, at least not all of them.



For the life of me i cant get rid of them either, even though they are almost invisible. They might be slight marring from a polishing pad, im not sure.



Then there are even more paint imperfections that probably came from the factory. Slight craters, smaller than the end of a piece of hair, just some strange stuff.



I imagine if i were to get a micro scope on the paint it would look like the surface of the moon.



It is very possible to achieve swirl free paint, i dont have any, but it is impossible to have paint that is perfect under severe inspection on a daily driver.



I say be careful wishing for perfect paint, you might drive yourself crazy...

[imported_Gears]

Trying for perfection can drive people crazy.

For some people perfection is after their car comes out of the "Tunnel O Swirls" car wash.



But for us, the informed, we must look at our paint from every angle and using all different light sources to look for marks only we can see.



Sometime I just have to use the 5 foot rule to keep from going crazy. If I can`t see it from 5 feet away no one else is going to notice it.

[pontman43]

Very true about driving you crazy. I remember when I was detailing my car before a show and couldn`t get the black top perfect. I spent like 4 hours on that small portion and still couldn`t get it perfect (before I had PC) the next day I went to the show and put up a for sale sign I was so mad. It made me want to get a new car to start fresh. I`m over it now though, I just love my car too much.

[daystrom]

Very true about driving you crazy. I remember when I was detailing my car before a show and couldn`t get the black top perfect. I spent like 4 hours on that small portion and still couldn`t get it perfect (before I had PC) the next day I went to the show and put up a for sale sign I was so mad. It made me want to get a new car to start fresh. I`m over it now though, I just love my car too much.

Wow, and I thought I was the only one crazy enough to spend that much time on a panel! Black paint is going to drive me insane - I know it.



Todd

[pontman43]

Yep I hate it and yet I still got more painted on my car. Guess the cool factor out weighed the PITA factor. lol Good luck and remember it doesnt` have to be perfect, like Gears said, use the 5 foot rule. Nobody notices what we do, my family thinks I`m crazy.

[EdLancer]

Like most of you guys have said, the less contact with the panel the better.



I usually use a pressure washer to get rid of most of the dirt and then just spray DI water over it and drive away. I only wash with a sheepskin mitt and soap and dry with WW once a month and all the other time in between just pressure wash.

[Scottwax]

There is no one here who has a completely 100% perfect finish.

[Richt]

I agree with Scott on this one, and the darker the colour the harder it is. The black paint on my car seems so soft the slightest think marks it.

[pontman43]

Yep, pictures tell a thousand lies. I can take a picture of a horribly swirled car, but at a certain angle it would look good. So dont go entirely by other`s pictures. If you saw it in person you would notice small flaws, but like scott said, nobody has perfect paint.