Car Wash Industry aims to stop driveway washing

**safetyman2010** · 02-03-2005, 11:19 PM

Who said that anyone has to take their cars to a commercial drive through car wash? Their are abundant self serve car wash facilities for those who choose to wash their own car and are worried about damage to their paint. I am not here trying to drive anyone towards going to a drive through carwash. I am simply adding my educated input to an issue that WILL be a factor in the coming years. It`s going to happen sooner or later so why not just get with the program and come up with some creative solutions to the problem rather than just complaining about it?

**Scottwax** · 02-03-2005, 11:27 PM

I already have my solution. QEW.

**imported_ajbarnes** · 02-03-2005, 11:29 PM

Originally posted by Scottwax

I already have my solution. QEW.

here here:up

**OneCleanCL** · 02-03-2005, 11:48 PM

Originally posted by Gonzo0903

Will the carwash industry take reponsibility for damaging people`s cars when their equipment malfunctions?

Will the carwash industry turn away vehicles with loose trim and damage that can cause problems, or will they go after the buck and take their chances ( remeber that your car might be next in the line)

Until they are willing to step up to the plate, I see a huge problem...

I wanted to shed a little light on this. I manage a full service car wash here in Florida, and in instances like that, we do step up to the plate.

If anything malfunctions, insurance will cover it. Its rare, but like anything else, it can happen.

And I turn away vehicles with loose trim all the time. The risk in it snapping off and potentially causing more damage to the car, my equipment, and maybe the next car behind it is too great for `the buck`. In the end, its more expensive to claim something like that on insurance, pay a higher premium, and then potentially lose the customer plus word of mouth. That costs me a lot more than the $20 for the wash.

**Scottwax** · 02-03-2005, 11:53 PM

OneCleanCL-good for you!

**Peter Crowl** · 02-04-2005, 12:01 AM

The coin-op self serve car washes in my area do not allow bucket washing. You cannot use your mit..you cannot use your shampoo..etcetera.

You can pull out after doing a wash their way and dry off using your own MF`s...in the sun.

You can do a bucket wash if you go furtively in the wee hours and don`t get caught..but I don`t consider that much of a solution.

What would be better is the development of an affordable containment device for those in regulated areas. $1500 is just too much for a casual user.

Peter

**Anthony O.** · 02-04-2005, 12:14 AM

Once again, to solve the problem place treatment units at the drains.

To save water why not put something into play in the midwest....something that can channel the water into storage units and then shipped or piped to areas that need water?? Don`t many of the midwest states flood every year due to heavy Spring rains?

Again, stopping driveway car washes only places a band-aid on a huge wound. Everyone needs to do their part but banning driveway carwashing does nothing for all the gunk and grime rushing to the storm drains when it rains.

**94BlkStang** · 02-04-2005, 12:45 AM

Originally posted by ShineShop

http://www.riversides.org/riversafe/media.html

There you go. No less than five articles written by different authors. Although I am sure you will believe they are just part of a larger "conspiracy" to keep you from your god given right to wash your car at home. This is getting old........

What happens to the contaminants that run off my car in the rain? Are they going to abolish raining in my city? I`d love that. I wouldn`t have to wash my car near as often then. All of those articles you pasted links to didn`t give any concrete numbers or studies on various hazardous ingredients that are in popular car wash soap. If that is seriously a problem, there are definitely ingredients that can be used that are environmentally friendly. To be honest, I bet there are more contaminants being sent down the sewer system related to vehicles that are leaking oil and then having rain water carry those contaminants away. I would like to see studies done that show how much water is actually used when a car is properly washed and have the water contained and anaylyzed to see what the contaminant levels are that rinse off the vehicle. When actual bonafide numbers are presented, then I can decide what I feel is best for the environament.

**Lenny** · 02-04-2005, 04:59 AM

Originally posted by ShineShop

http://www.riversides.org/riversafe/media.html

There you go. No less than five articles written by different authors. Although I am sure you will believe they are just part of a larger "conspiracy" to keep you from your god given right to wash your car at home. This is getting old........

What`s getting old is the sanctimony of your replies. Virtually every municipal waste water treatment plant has, at one time or another, dumped untreated or partially treated sewage, whose contents would make any car wash runoff pale by comparison (as an industrial sales rep, I called on no fewer than a dozen municipal and two dozen industrial waste water facilities).

Furthermore, the runoff from oil leaks, landscaping chemicals, including herbicides and pesticides, and heavy metals just from the rain runoff coming off commercial and industrial buildings makes this whole do-it-yourself car wash runoff "controversy" sound like a scam to bolster the sales at commerical car washes.

**jch217** · 02-04-2005, 05:50 AM

What about all the water golf courses use, not to mention all the chemicals that pollute the ground water. I guess he must play golf.:nono

**safetyman2010** · 02-04-2005, 11:29 AM

Originally posted by Len_A

What`s getting old is the sanctimony of your replies. Virtually every municipal waste water treatment plant has, at one time or another, dumped untreated or partially treated sewage, whose contents would make any car wash runoff pale by comparison (as an industrial sales rep, I called on no fewer than a dozen municipal and two dozen industrial waste water facilities).

Furthermore, the runoff from oil leaks, landscaping chemicals, including herbicides and pesticides, and heavy metals just from the rain runoff coming off commercial and industrial buildings makes this whole do-it-yourself car wash runoff "controversy" sound like a scam to bolster the sales at commerical car washes.

The funny thing about every response to the argument about home or mobile car washing is that no one is really denying that they are polluting by doing it. Trying to deflect responsibility for your actions by saying "well this causes more pollution than what I am doing" is a cop out. I don`t disagree that there are probably scores of different sources of pollution out there that are causing far more harm to the water supply than your individual car wash does. However, add up how many home or mobile car washes are done on any given day and it adds up to be a significant pollution source. If it wasn`t there would be no legislation coming. This is not a commercial car wash initiative to get you to wash your car at the local car wash. It is however, carwash owners and environmental groups fighting for even handed enforcement of all polluters - something I personally do not have a problem with. I also agree with you that the powers that be better get their act together and crack down on the big boys that are doing the serious polluting if they are going to start enforcing this kind of thing as well.

**Peter Crowl** · 02-04-2005, 12:10 PM

May I point out that I didn`t see - if it was there I`d like to have it pointed out to me - in the articles ShineShop cited - any actual data on the run-off from a home wash. They cite the elements that make up the products that can be used....and cite that these elements are harmful. But I don`t see data showing the amount of these elements in the run-off.

Let`s agree that some of the products used can be harmful...some more than others and with that perhaps what`s needed is cautionary information on the labeling that tells consumers which products are more dangerous than others. This will encourage manufacturers to produce less harmful agents as people become more aware.

But...back to my point... what are the actual amounts run-off from a home wash? Are these agents running-off in sufficient quantity to make a home wash a rational target for a ban?

A test such as I`d like to see would also reveal the difference in run-off between a responsible wash and an irresponsible wash... back to education.

Let`s also consider that different areas have different concerns. In one of the articles it was pointed out that it has been practice in Toronto for downspouts to connected to sanitary sewer lines. This has never been allowed anywhere I`ve lived. I also see them encouraging rainbarrels. In Colorado a rainbarrel is not allowed as any unauthoried impoundment of water is illegal.

Peter

**imported_wblynch** · 02-04-2005, 12:12 PM

THE POLLUTION IS NOT COMING FROM DRIVEWAY WASHING !

Does anyone other than a very few of us realize that the SOURCE of the pollution is not driveway car washers?

It is from the particulates that land on our cars as we drive them and from the exhaust, tire rubber and leaking fluids from these same cars.

The worst offenders in my mind are diesel exhaust emissions from commercial vehicles, jet planes, ships in port and trains. All this junk is spewed into the atmosphere and lands on the Earth and anything sitting around (like houses, cars, horses and even people).

Using some of the illogic I have been reading, they should outlaw people taking baths ! ---or at least swimming in rivers, lakes and the ocean.

What about all that junk landing directly onto the ocean itself?

All those ships in and out of Long Beach every day are dropping more junk than all the car washes in Southern California.

Oil refineries, as much progress they`ve made, are extreme polluters. On cloudy and rainy days they are allowed to dump tons more dirt into the air because the rain will wash it out of the sky. Is that not adding to runoff?

If anything needs to be addressed, it is the SOURCE of any pollutants.

But no, they want to go after the weak and defenseless. The little guy washing his car.

**safetyman2010** · 02-04-2005, 01:11 PM

Originally posted by wblynch

THE POLLUTION IS NOT COMING FROM DRIVEWAY WASHING !

Does anyone other than a very few of us realize that the SOURCE of the pollution is not driveway car washers?

It is from the particulates that land on our cars as we drive them and from the exhaust, tire rubber and leaking fluids from these same cars.

The worst offenders in my mind are diesel exhaust emissions from commercial vehicles, jet planes, ships in port and trains. All this junk is spewed into the atmosphere and lands on the Earth and anything sitting around (like houses, cars, horses and even people).

Using some of the illogic I have been reading, they should outlaw people taking baths ! ---or at least swimming in rivers, lakes and the ocean.

What about all that junk landing directly onto the ocean itself?

All those ships in and out of Long Beach every day are dropping more junk than all the car washes in Southern California.

Oil refineries, as much progress they`ve made, are extreme polluters. On cloudy and rainy days they are allowed to dump tons more dirt into the air because the rain will wash it out of the sky. Is that not adding to runoff?

If anything needs to be addressed, it is the SOURCE of any pollutants.

But no, they want to go after the weak and defenseless. The little guy washing his car.

I do not believe that anyone here has ever said the sole cause of pollution is washing your car at home or in the street. It is however one of the causes and that is undeniable. You can stick your head in the sand and avoid the issue by blaming it on someone else but it doesn`t change that fact. Let`s also assume that a typical vehicle has NO pollutants on it`s surface when being washed aside from common dust or soil. What about the soaps and cleaners that are being dumped directly into the storm sewers after rinsing the vehicle off? Do you have any idea of the ecological impact of detergents and soaps on fish and wildlife? Or is it that you just don`t give a damn?

**imported_wblynch** · 02-04-2005, 01:59 PM

Originally posted by ShineShop

What about the soaps and cleaners that are being dumped directly into the storm sewers after rinsing the vehicle off?

Do you have any idea of the ecological impact of detergents and soaps on fish and wildlife? Or is it that you just don`t give a damn?

Of course I give a damn. If there`s a problem with the cleaners we`re using that can be addressed at the source.

I have no doubt that commercial car cleaning products are tightly regulated. I`m sure there are very explicit guidelines about the content of those products.

You can`t seriously believe that a capful or two of Autowash Shampoo is responsible for polluting the ocean? If it is, then let`s reformulate that shampoo.

30 or 40 years ago I remember that Laundry Detergent had to be reformulated and Laundry Soap was completely banned. This had a tremendously positive effect on the environment.

But they didn`t ban washing machines !