more confused then ever

[jch217]

I recently bought two new cars. So the paint is in good condition. Since then I wanted to get the best protection I could afford for my two cars. I have been using Meguiars products for years and have been pleased. But I am in the process of educating myself. That is why I joined your forum. I was happy with NXT but couldn`t help but think there are better. I recently purchased Menzernas line (final polish II, finishing glaze and FMJ)from Properautocare. I am happy with the results easy on easy off but It really didn`t WOW me. Not the WOW I expected after spending $70. I am looking for an easy process preferrably two steps clean/polish and protect. I could do more steps but I want to notice that difference. I am tempted with Klasse but can`t help think there are newer better sealants/polishes out there. This leads me to Zaino. Every where i go People love it, or think its nothing special.

I am a novice to this but it seems to me if zaino is giving some bad advice the dawn detergent( which i believe its bad for your trim and plastic, and the strict terry cloth, MF I believe is a better choice. So I question Zaino`s knowledge

Also Zaino offers a polish is this a polish or a sealant why are they confusing people with their labeling. I have heard stories of bird dropping damaging people paint that use zaino( of course I don;t believe everything i hear but it is in the back of mind. I guess my question would I notice a noticable differernce over the Menzerna line i currently use. The qualities that are important to me are in order of importance.

1. protection

2. shine, slickness

3. durabiltiy



thanks for your help. I really learned a lot in this forum( probably too much for my own good )





:wavey

[jimmybuffit]

Welcome to Autopia!



Seems you`ve done your due diligence.

And now you`re wondering...

Again, welcome. We share your `frustration` and admire your goals.



Me, I`m not much a fan of the complexity and expense of the Sal Zaino regimen. I do recognize that thousands achieve satisfaction with the system...



You didn`t tell us what colors are involved with your 2 new cars. You may be aware that some colors, like black and red, offer great depth and reflectivity, while silver, white, champagne, etc. simply shine, but do not exhibit warmth and depth.



My silver VW, and white Ford van simply shine. But, with my black Miata, I can make it POP, And I can appreciate the subtle differences between multiple sealant layers, or different brands of carnaubasâ€Â¦



Just my preferences:

Klasse Twins (3x SG) Allow plenty of curing time!



Wax monthly: S100/P21S/Souveran/#16 (in no particular order)



And, oh yeah, find the nicest MF towelsâ€Â¦



Make it a hobby, not a challengeâ€Â¦



Have Fun!



Jim

[jch217]

sorry

the honda is a graphite pearl(grey metallic)

and the nissan is red

thanks

[Ed Hartman]

Well, as far as dawn goes, if you don`t think its a smart move to wash your car with it, then simply don`t do it. Your the captain of your cars, not Zaino. If the Zaino labeling confuses you, I would pick up the phone and call them direct and ask them why. While these forums are great, in my opinion never go on someone elses opinion, test for yourself. Its really the only way to know what you like. Test, test, test. Only way to know if you like Zaino is to pick up the phone and order it, then use it. Then come to your own conclusion. I believe that generally speaking when it comes to detailing its more operator than it is product. For example. Im a professional carpet cleaner. Ive seen a technician goes to a house with all $20,000 worth of equipment and do a shabby job. I in turn have seen guys with $2000 of equipment go in and make carpet look brand new. So the point is, before I start second guessing products, I would look into how I can improve myself as a detailer. Every year as a cleaner, I get better. Why?, because of experience, continual learning and so on. I didn`t get better because of the cleaning agents I use.

[BookemDano]

Originally posted by jch217

...

I recently purchased Menzernas line (final polish II, finishing glaze and FMJ)from Properautocare. I am happy with the results easy on easy off but It really didn`t WOW me. Not the WOW I expected after spending $70. I am looking for an easy process preferrably two steps clean/polish and protect. I could do more steps but I want to notice that difference. I am tempted with Klasse but can`t help think there are newer better sealants/polishes out there. This leads me to Zaino. Every where i go People love it, or think its nothing special.

I am a novice to this but it seems to me if zaino is giving some bad advice the dawn detergent( which i believe its bad for your trim and plastic, and the strict terry cloth, MF I believe is a better choice. So I question Zaino`s knowledge

Also Zaino offers a polish is this a polish or a sealant why are they confusing people with their labeling. I have heard stories of bird dropping damaging people paint that use zaino( of course I don;t believe everything i hear but it is in the back of mind. I guess my question would I notice a noticable differernce over the Menzerna line i currently use. The qualities that are important to me are in order of importance.

1. protection

2. shine, slickness

3. durabiltiy

...

:wavey

JCH,



Welcome to the forum. I`m a recent convert to Zaino and a Menzerna user. So...



Regarding Menzerna, I`m very happy with IP and FPII. Less so with the Finishing Glaze and FMJ. FMJ`s durability isn`t as good as Zaino and I didn`t like the look of FMJ on my Dolphin Gray `02 Audi A4. And a major issue is the lack of a native Menzerna QD product. In January, I`m going to strip the FMJ off of my wife`s bright red Subaru Forester and apply Zaino Z2Pro.



Currently I have Z5 (x2) and Z2Pro (x1) on my A4. It looks great and the beading is like the energizer bunny - it keeps going and going and...



Overall I`m very happy with Zaino products. I use Z5 and Z2Pro for sealants, Z6 QD, Z7 Car wash, Z10 Leather protector, Z16 tire gloss and Z18 clay bar. I`m very happy with all of them. I have the Z9 leather cleaner and Z14 Plastic polish. They seem fine too, but haven`t used them much yet.



I especially like Z6. I use it after removing any bird bombs (pretty much daily) and after every wash. It does an excellent job of improving the shine and slickness. The last time I polished (with IP and FPII) I applied Z2Pro to my wheels. After washing, I apply Z6 to the wheels, which makes them pop. It keeps dust to a minimum and makes it easy to dust the wheels daily. (I use a CCD-mini on the wheels.)



For your specific questions...

but it seems to me if zaino is giving some bad advice the dawn detergent( which i believe its bad for your trim and plastic, and the strict terry cloth, MF I believe is a better choice. So I question Zaino`s knowledge

I`ve talked with Sal Zaino a couple of times. He has strong opinions about his products. (I would too if my name was on them.)



Regarding the use of terry cloth, I don`t agree with that. I use MF towels strictly. And, I apply Z5 and Z2Pro with two red buffing pads (one for each) and my PC. It lays down a thin, even coat with minimal effort. No problems.



Regarding Dawn, he recommends that you use if to remove the old wax and sealants but not after that. I use Z7 car wash weekly with a foam gun. Z7 is great stuff. I`ve only used Dawn twice on my Audi. First to remove the original protectant before applying FMJ. And then to remove the FMJ (I didn`t like the look on my Audi) to apply Z5. I haven`t noticed any detrimental affects from the two Dawn washes.

Also Zaino offers a polish is this a polish or a sealant why are they confusing people with their labeling.

Z5 and Z2Pro are sealants, not polishes. Z5 has fillers that tend to fill in some minor defects. Z2Pro has no fillers and is very clear.

I have heard stories of bird dropping damaging people paint that use zaino( of course I don;t believe everything i hear but it is in the back of mind.

Actually, my experience is the exact opposite. I work in the SODO area in Seattle. My parking lot is outside and about 1/2 block from a HUGE garbage recycling facility. It attracts thousands of Seagulls. Nightly I go bird bomb hunting with an MF and plain water spray bottle (followed by Z6). Two nights ago, I removed 11 piles of bird doo (a new record) and some were nasty purple things. What is surprising is that there is NO damage to the paint or Z2 (my top coat). NONE!



This weekend, I`m going to post a thread on this issue to see what others experiences have been. Given the amount of problems other people have with bird poo, I`d like to see if there is a general concensus about which products are damaged the most.



The original Z2 and Z5 have a strong record of durability, shininess and slickness. But some people didn`t like the looks. When I applied Z5 to my Audi, it looked very nice. When I ordered Z2, I didn`t realize that Sal had slipstreamed his new Z2Pro (white cap) in the old bottle. The first coat of Z2Pro really made the gray paint pop.



Last week, as an experiment, I applied Z2Pro again on a section of my hood to see if it would dry without usng ZFX. The next morning, it was dry and removed easily with an MF polishing cloth. What`s interesting is that this second coat of Z2Pro improved the depth even more. While I was pleased with the look before, I`m VERY pleased now.



If you were looking for the ultimate looks, a carnauba wax might be the best way to go. But for your requirements, Z5 and Z2Pro are better, IMO. :xyxthumbs



Regards,



Dan.



p.s., if your paint is very dark, try Z5 then Z2Pro. If lighter, Z2Pro only.

[jch217]

Dan

thanks so much for the detailed report

I think i`ll give it a try

[fertzguy]

Zaino is a complete system from car wash to qd. The only catch is like with any product the surface prep is the key. As far a Zaino being complicated - - - well maybe if you cant follow directions. If you follow the enclosed directions it is almost idiot proof and the easiest product to apply and even easier to remove. I have not tried it but many claim that the new z2 pro is even better than the old z2. Also in the grand scheme of things its cheap as one 12 oz bottle will give a average sedan 25 to 30 coats. The only Zaino direction I have a prob with is using terry cloth towels to remove - a good quality microfiber is 100 times better - but to each his own. Give it a try I will be surprised if your disappointed

[BookemDano]

Originally posted by jch217

Dan

thanks so much for the detailed report

I think i`ll give it a try

jch,



I hope it works out for you. Keep us updated.



As other posters have mentioned, prep is the key. A friend of mine recently bought a 1991 Mercedes SL500 with 29,000 miles in PERFECT condition (for $18,000!). The paint has no scratches or blemishes. The paint looks incredible.



My friend was ecstatic about the paint UNTIL I had him do the plastic baggie test. That`s when his face fell. Then he did the same to my Audi. He was floored about how much difference there was when you really examined the paint. So, I told him about the wonders of claying and good-quality final polishes like FPII. (When the weather clears, I`m going to have a "clay and polish" party at his house.)



So, please... Prep `til your tired of prepping. And then prep some more!



Best of luck,



Dan.

[Dvs Ndn]

BookemDano, i have just purchase Menzerna FPII and Klassue AIO and Have Zaino as well, what should me steps be? do i use FPII first then zanio then Klassue?

[Dvs Ndn]

and where do u get a red pad?

[BookemDano]

Originally posted by Dvs Ndn

BookemDano, i have just purchase Menzerna FPII and Klassue AIO and Have Zaino as well, what should me steps be? do i use FPII first then zanio then Klassue?

Well, let`s see...



First, I`ve never used Klasse, but I understand that a AIO is not necessary if you use a final polish like FPII. I like FPII and I`ve seen lots of posts by people who rave about AIO as a prep step before Zaino. So quite frankly, I don`t know whether there is any advantage of using AIO AND FPII.



AIO is a chemical cleaner. FPII is an abrasive polish. AIO might take care of very minor defects. FPII, although a final polish, should take care of many more defects than AIO. So, I THINK that using FPII replaces that need for AIO. AIO fans should probably jump in here.



Still...



Assuming that there is some benefit to AIO + FPII, here`s the process that I would use:



1) Wash with a good car wash or perhaps Dawn

2) Clay to remove embedded contaminents.

3) Rinse down to remove any left over clay lube.

4) AIO to clean off old wax, sealants, etc.

5) Polish with Menzerna IP to remove moderate blemishes.

6) Polish with FPII to get the best, glossy look.

7) Wash with Z7 to make sure that the surface is squeaky clean.

8) If a dark car, apply Z5 (x2) with Z6 after each coat.

9) Apply Z2Pro (x2) with Z6 after each coat.



It looks like a lot of steps, but your finish should last about six months with moderate care before needing to reapply Z2Pro. If your paint is in good shape, you could skip step 4 and 5. If the paint is a lighter color, you could skip step 8 and go straight to Z2Pro.



My Z2Pro finish is about 3 months old and still slick as glass. In January, I`ll probably add another layer or two of Z2Pro (you can add lots of layers before having to remove the old stuff). I think I`ll probably just give it a good wash with Z7, give it a light claying with Z18 clay and then apply the Z2Pro. Shouldn`t take more than about three hours including wait time.



Z2Pro has no fillers. Z5 has some minor fillers, but still pretty much shows all the defects. So you need to prep well before applying Zaino. Prep is the key.



Regarding red pad, here`s what they look like:







These are Lake Country Constant Pressure pads sold by www.properautocare.com. Here`s info on teh 7.5" pads:



http://www.properautocare.com/ad712inhipa.html



And here`s the 6" pads:



http://www.properautocare.com/hi612infopaa.html



I hope this helps.



Regards,



Dan.

[imported_Burlyq]

The reason Zaino recommends dawn is because it will strip oils, grease, or tar and this will ensure proper bonding for long term durabilty. Once the bad oils are gone, Zaino will leave an incredible slick surface. With your list of what`s important Zaino would be your best choice IMO. Now if you had oxidation, swirls, old paint(and you didn`t want to polish), or were interested in wettest (nuba) possible look, I`d say something else maybe. But for protection, shine, durabilty, you wont find anything better. There are many Zaino haters out there and it has little to do with the newer Zaino products trust me. The new Zaino has ZFX and it`s the only product that cures instantly. Easy on Easy off, leave it on all night if you want, or wipe off immediatly, comes right off. You can put two or more coats if you chose. It takes me 30 minutes to put two coats on an average size car. A minimum order would be z2pro, zfx, detail spray z6 I think. You might want to add another polish either another z2 or z5 because zfx treats two bottles of Zaino.

[jch217]

A minimum order would be z2pro, zfx, detail spray z6 I think. You might want to add another polish either another z2 or z5 because zfx treats two bottles of Zaino.

What is the purpose of Z1

thanks

[BookemDano]

Z1 preps the paint for Z2 or Z5. ZFX took the place of Z1.

[BookemDano]

Originally posted by Burlyq

A minimum order would be z2pro, zfx, detail spray z6 I think. You might want to add another polish either another z2 or z5 because zfx treats two bottles of Zaino.

Add Z7 as a car wash too.