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  1. #1

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    Claying, Cleaning, and LSP

    A while back I posted about detailing new car, then thought about going to a detailer. Anyhow....I did neither! However, i am looking to start up my research again, because I am off next week and plan to do it myself using a Griots G6 that i found in my brothers garage.

    Car is in great shape, no major marring from washing/drying. (Although i did see a few minor ones on trunk lid) Car even has a pretty decent shine still. I`ve been washing regualrly with either Ammo NYC Frothe, or two bucket with Mequiars Gold wash, and always finishes with Ammo NYC Hydrate. The worst part is the front end...it`s low to the ground, and has some slight imperfections.

    When it comes to claying....do you recommend doing the entire car, or just the areas that need it? I have never clayed before.

    As for an LSP....i was thinking of a couple of layers of the FK1000P. I`m Looking for protection, durability, and deep shine. Unless of course you guys can suggest something better.

    The big question...what should I use for cleaner and or polish? In the past I`ve used Klasse Products, and still have enough, but want to try something new.

    BTW...car is a gray Lexus...which i believe is typically known for soft paint. Not sure if that makes a difference for my level of expertise, and condition of paint.

    Thanks again for the info and your opinions.

    -Evan
    Thanks



    -Evan

  2. #2
    acuRAS82's Avatar
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    Re: Claying, Cleaning, and LSP

    Claying: feel the paint with a plastic bag around your hands. It will allow you to feel if any areas are completely smooth and not worth claying. My guess is you will feel some bumps in all areas and I suggest claying everywhere for the first time. But wherever the clay bar shows no resistance and slides back and forth effortlessly with no pressure pushing down, you can move right along because those areas would meet the end condition you are looking for.

    FK1000p is probably a great choice, not sure if it would give you “deep shine” but it will give you shine nonetheless assuming your polish step goes well. FK1000p probably looks nice on Lexus gray.

    Which leads me to polish, you may want something with better abrasives than Klasse AIO, but I have no experience with it. Just read about it and I think it has minimal abrasives? Anyways, I’m out of my comfort zone here, but whatever you use, enjoy the GG 6 and have fun. Get whatever gloss you can out of this step.

  3. #3
    Dan's Avatar
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    Re: Claying, Cleaning, and LSP

    Next week... are you shopping locally or have fast delivery options. That might limit your choices. KAIO is great but it has near zero abrasives.

  4. #4

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    Re: Claying, Cleaning, and LSP

    evan631- Some sorta-random thoughts follow:

    - As long as it`s not stupid-soft paint (e.g., BMW Jet Black and some Infinitis) the hardness shouldn`t matter if you do things right
    -Many/most? people mar the paint a little bit when they clay, and if that happens you might want/need to do some correction
    -From the sound of it, I`d absolutely want to do some correction, but that`s just me
    -I can go either way on doing the whole car, or even on doing it at all; I wouldn`t do anything that doesn`t need done, but again, that`s just me. That color wouldn`t show rust-blooms from ferrous contamination the way white/etc. would...just sayin`
    -KAIO is functionally nonabrasive on autopaint, even on very soft ss black. For correction of any kind, use something else
    -IMO FK1000P is a great choice (still what I like/use/recommend more than anything) and FWIW it works fine over KAIO (another good choice if you don`t need correction)

  5. #5

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    Re: Claying, Cleaning, and LSP

    Quote Originally Posted by Accumulator View Post
    evan631- Some sorta-random thoughts follow:

    - As long as it`s not stupid-soft paint (e.g., BMW Jet Black and some Infinitis) the hardness shouldn`t matter if you do things right
    -Many/most? people mar the paint a little bit when they clay, and if that happens you might want/need to do some correction
    -From the sound of it, I`d absolutely want to do some correction, but that`s just me
    -I can go either way on doing the whole car, or even on doing it at all; I wouldn`t do anything that doesn`t need done, but again, that`s just me. That color wouldn`t show rust-blooms from ferrous contamination the way white/etc. would...just sayin`
    -KAIO is functionally nonabrasive on autopaint, even on very soft ss black. For correction of any kind, use something else
    -IMO FK1000P is a great choice (still what I like/use/recommend more than anything) and FWIW it works fine over KAIO (another good choice if you don`t need correction)
    Thanks guys for your input.

    Whats the best way to apply the FK1000p? Hand or polisher? IF by hand, I assume any MF applicator is good? If polisher what pad do you recommend?
    Much appreciated!
    Thanks



    -Evan

  6. #6

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    Re: Claying, Cleaning, and LSP

    Quote Originally Posted by evan631 View Post
    Thanks guys for your input.

    Whats the best way to apply the FK1000p? Hand or polisher? IF by hand, I assume any MF applicator is good? If polisher what pad do you recommend?
    Much appreciated!
    Funny, but I`ve never done it by machine! And here I`ve done most every other LSP I`ve ever used that way...at least once and often frequently!

    BUT...if doing it by machine I`d *not* use an uber-soft pad (i.e., LC Black) although what I *would* recommend (even though I`ve never used one!) is the LC Gold LSPing pad (which might be awfully soft too).

    I do it by foam LSPing pad most of the time, but when I use a MF (which I always do on wheels/wells/etc.) it doesn`t seem to matter what kind, although I`ve never used a *very* plush one.

    So after all that..my short answer is to use anything you usually prefer because the FK just isn`t very finicky about the application medium. Just remember to apply it thin *thin* *THIN*. It`s also not finicky about how long you leave it on before buffing; but do certainly let it thoroughly flash/dry (I`d go by the finger-swipe test unless you let it sit for a long time).

    FWIW, as with most LSPs, I fog the surface with my breath as I buff off the residue, which I do in a two-stage manner (basically just do every area twice with a pair of MFs instead of doing it all in one pass with one).

    Heh heh, lots of parentheticals in the above, huh? Must not`ve composed it right but I wanted to cover everything kinda quickly

  7. #7

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    Re: Claying, Cleaning, and LSP

    Quote Originally Posted by Accumulator View Post
    -KAIO is functionally nonabrasive on autopaint, even on very soft ss black. For correction of any kind, use something else
    Back in the day I remember it being described as a chemical cleaner. Not only does it not have any abrasives, but since it`s so thin I can`t see it working well at all with a polisher. There are no oils to reduce friction between the pad and the paint, so it wouldn`t even work like Poorboys Pro Polish which depends on the pads to do most of the cutting.

    As long as you use plenty of lube you should be fine while claying, but be careful. Oddly enough I`ve never had an issues claying most paint. My only horror story comes from using a Nanoskin pad. I could never use enough lube to keep it from marring and ended up with terrible results. Of course this was on black VW with hard paint so fixing the damage was a real treat. Traditional clay has never let me down.
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  8. #8

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    Re: Claying, Cleaning, and LSP

    Deseertnate- Actually...I`ve probably used KAIO as much by machine as by hand. Gotta watch that you don`t overwork it, but that`s the only thing I`ve ever had to think about.

    It does contain *something* abrasive as people have noticed a slight drop in gloss when it`s used on a perfectly-finished *and finicky-soft* paint, but it`s not something I can see and I`m awfully particular about such stuff.

    And your experience with the nanoskin is exactly what I`d worry about, and why I don`t use them. I will say that I`ve marred paint with clay before, but very rarely was it bad enough to be readily discernible to the naked eye (when it was, it was because I did more than an inch or two before kneading/replacing/etc. the clay). As you said, "plenty of lube", keep that clay from actually touching the paint directly.

  9. #9
    acuRAS82's Avatar
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    Re: Claying, Cleaning, and LSP

    Quote Originally Posted by acuRAS82 View Post
    Which leads me to polish, you may want something with better abrasives than Klasse AIO, but I have no experience with it. Just read about it and I think it has minimal abrasives?
    Sorry, I mis-thought on this which others made me realize. I guess KAIO has no abrasives. I knew it would functionally (stealing Accumulator’s solid word choice) not correct anything. But didn’t realize it has none whatsoever.

  10. #10

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    Re: Claying, Cleaning, and LSP

    Quote Originally Posted by acuRAS82 View Post
    Sorry, I mis-thought on this which others made me realize. I guess KAIO has no abrasives. I knew it would functionally (stealing Accumulator’s solid word choice) not correct anything. But didn’t realize it has none whatsoever.
    Heh heh...see my Post#8

    That`s why I say "functionally (non)abrasive", referring to the ability to do correction. All sorts of functionally-nonabrasive products do contain them, it just seldom really matters. Now in Glossmeter tests like Loach is running, *then* it could matter, at least with respect to what the meter readings are.

    Maybe pedantic nit-picking, but it could matter in some cases.

  11. #11

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    Re: Claying, Cleaning, and LSP

    Quote Originally Posted by Accumulator View Post
    Deseertnate- Actually...I`ve probably used KAIO as much by machine as by hand. Gotta watch that you don`t overwork it, but that`s the only thing I`ve ever had to think about.
    No kidding!? I used the Klasse Twins for the better part of a decade, but would never have imagined using KAIO with a DA. Did you apply SG with a machine too? Did you go through a lot of product? I`m still trying to picture how you pulled it off with both products being rather watery.

    It was the discovery of how to use a DA along with getting better results from Collinite 845 that killed my hand applied Klasse habit. Still have a little of both tucked way back in my detailing cabinet.
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  12. #12

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    Re: Claying, Cleaning, and LSP

    OK....so now I am second guessing my thoughts on using KAIO. I personally don`t think I need all that much correction, but i would hate to waste my time. I`m looking for that deep color and shine, with tons of protection. I`m going to stick with the FK1000p for the protection.

    Thoughts on what i should use instead of KAIO?
    Thanks



    -Evan

  13. #13
    John U's Avatar
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    Re: Claying, Cleaning, and LSP

    Nice finding a “stray” Griots G6 at your brothers. The most many of us would find is an old wax pad with dried on Kit wax from a decade earlier. One pad at my Uncles had been used to check the oil.... they do make a nice dipstick wipe.

  14. #14

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    Re: Claying, Cleaning, and LSP

    Quote Originally Posted by John U View Post
    Nice finding a “stray” Griots G6 at your brothers. The most many of us would find is an old wax pad with dried on Kit wax from a decade earlier. One pad at my Uncles had been used to check the oil.... they do make a nice dipstick wipe.
    Let me add...that G6 was in the box and never used! New pads too. Anyhow....he took it back and did his Jeep...so it`s now used once, and I will now have to borrow it.
    Thanks



    -Evan

  15. #15

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    Re: Claying, Cleaning, and LSP

    Quote Originally Posted by Desertnate View Post
    No kidding!? I used the Klasse Twins for the better part of a decade, but would never have imagined using KAIO with a DA. Did you apply SG with a machine too? Did you go through a lot of product? I`m still trying to picture how you pulled it off with both products being rather watery.
    I tried doing the KSG by machine but did indeed use/waste a lot of product. But note that I was utterly extreme about "thin applications" with the KSG..like, did my Yukon XLD, including jambs/wheels/etc. with *MUCH* less than one ounce. I still have a lot of KSG left and I only bought one bottle of it in my life. (No, it doesn`t go bad.)

    It was the discovery of how to use a DA along with getting better results from Collinite 845 that killed my hand applied Klasse habit. Still have a little of both tucked way back in my detailing cabinet.
    I used the Collinites (845 and 476S) a lot too, but could never get `em to last as long as (heavily layered) KSG. I do still use 845 on a few problematic areas on the `93 audi, still use KSG on a few things too.

    IMO the best thing about KSG (besides the durability/protection once you get >4 layers built up) is that, with enough layers, it forms a physical barrier against (the lightest conceivable) abrasion. It`s the *only* conventional LSP I`ve ever used where I could genuinely get "micromarring that`s only in the LSP, not in the paint". Makes it perfect for certain exterior plastics, well...at least the ones on some of my vehicles.

 

 
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