PC m105/205 technique and steps confusion. First "real" detail, lot of questions

**rmkleman** · 03-23-2010, 09:27 AM

Hi guys, i have been wondering around here for a LONG time and decided to finally pull the trigger on buying a porter cable last weekend. I got a kit from autogeek.net with the PC, backer plates, counter weight, pad cleaner and conditioner, and a yellow, orange, white, blue, and red pad. I also picked up some megs m105 and m205. I have looed into quite a few threads on the steps to take to use this system but i am pretty lost still. Can you please help refine this for me? I have light swirl marks and some small scratches in my 94 camaro that i want to get rid of and will be using this system for it, i should also note that the camaro was repainted 3 years ago with corvette tourch red but i have no idea about what clear coat was used. I`m confused when to wipe the car down with the ipa (50/50 mix alcohol and water... really?) and a few other steps. Only treatment the car has recieved has been megs wax by hand.

1. Wash with dawn and get everything real good and clean.

2. Dry with microfiber towel

3. Clay bar vehicle ( i have done this before on my 03 duramax and couldn`t believe what it did!)

4. Tape off windshield and windows as well. Do you tape off each panel and work them all out start to finish before moving on? confused...

Here is where i start to get confused... PLEASE correct me if i use any wong terms or i am not going to be doing something right.

4. Spray orange pad with conditioning spray that came with the pads. Apply megs m105 directly to orange pad and rub onto car before turning PC on. Cutting the correct term for this?

4.1 Turn on PC and start working in megs m105 (what speed on PC?) overlapping 50% about 1-2"/min? just enough pressure to slow the pad down a bit?

Do i take a microfiber towel and buff off the excess m105 before moving on after this step?

Wipe down panels with IPA between m105 and m205?

5. Condition pad, M205 with white or blue pad? apply the same way as m105?

Also do i buff this off to remove the excess then wipe with ipa? Same speed on the PC? Polish the correct term?

6. Wax or seal? From what i understand this is sealing in your polish step. Just any decent OTC wax like meguiars (checked my spelling) Do i just use the white pad for this and remove with a fresh microfiber towel?

7. Clean pads with pad cleaner solution that came with pads and store in seperate zip lock bags. and wash all my towels.

8. Crack open a beer and drool! O.K the beer might come out before this

Sorry if this is too long or too many questions but i love this car and i would be furious with myself if didn`t at least try to find the answers before i did this. Like i said about, i am pretty confused with the PC speed to use, if i buff off the excess m105 and or m205, when to wipe down with the alcohol solution, and what to tape off. Any tips, comments, or anything would be very appreciated!!

Also if anyone has any tips on how to polish c5 corvette wheels it would be great, i put a set on the camaro and they have minor flaws in them that just piss me off. From what i understand they need polished just like the paint? I haven`t researched it much yet.

Thanks, i love this forum!!

**rmkleman** · 03-23-2010, 10:05 AM

I should also add that the orange peel on the camaro is horrible!

**Accumulator** · 03-23-2010, 11:10 AM

Originally Posted by rmkleman

Hi guys, i have been wondering around here for a LONG time and decided to finally pull the trigger on buying a porter cable last weekend..

Welcome to Autopia! I`ll try to address some of your concerns, but I think you`ll find things go smoother, but slower, than you`re expecting

I got a kit from autogeek.net with the PC, backer plates, counter weight, pad cleaner and conditioner, and a yellow, orange, white, blue, and red pad. I also picked up some megs m105 and m205.

What size pads did you get? With larger pads, it`s harder to keep the pad spinning while you apply pressure.

I have looed into quite a few threads on the steps to take to use this system but i am pretty lost still...I`m confused when to wipe the car down with the ipa (50/50 mix alcohol and water... really?) and a few other steps.

The IPA mix wipe has two purposes, and IMO one of those is better handled with a different approach.

1) the IPA strips away the oils/etc. that products like M105, and *especially* M205, leave behind.

Those oils can conceal (some might say "fill" but I didn`t say that

) some marring, making you think things are corrected when they really aren`t.

Also, those oils (primarily talking about M205 now) can give a "pseudo-hologram" effect where the paint looks bad in direct sunlight. That`s what I don`t like, so that`s about the only thing I use IPA for. IPA doesn`t always get off all the M205 oils with one try either! BUT, don`t sweat this...it might not even be a problem for you. IF it *is*, you just use IPA or something (Dawn wash, perhaps?) to get the oils off, otherwise don`t worry about it.

2) the IPA makes it easier to buff off the polish residue, especially if you`ve overworked it a little bit. BUT, I prefer to use something like Meguiar`s #34 Final Inspection for this as it has greater lubricity than IPA and IMO is less likely to allow micromarring from the polish residue.

1. Wash with dawn and get everything real good and clean.

OK, though I`d do a regular wash with regular car shampoo first as Dawn lacks lubricity and that can lead to marring if there`s abrasive dirt on the car.

2. Dry with microfiber towel

OK, unless you want to clay while washing- wash panel, rinse, clay, rewash, rerinse.

3. Clay bar vehicle ( i have done this before on my 03 duramax and couldn`t believe what it did!)

OK.

4. Tape off windshield and windows as well. Do you tape off each panel and work them all out start to finish before moving on? confused...

I don`t bother taping much when working via PC. It doesn`t sling product around like a rotary unless you do something, uhm....unwise. If you use the right amount of product (see posts about the KM

and *ALWAYS* keep the pad in contact with the paint while the PC is turned on, they you won`t get much polish thrown around.

I`d tape off rubber/plastic trim and other things that polish can stain. Glass isn`t a biggie as it usually wipes off OK.

Try to keep the pad from getting on places where you don`t want it; this is easier than you might think.

But all that said...yeah, if in doubt tape things off. Either the whole car, or panel-by-panel, I do it both ways. See what *you* think seems right to *you*. You can always stop and tape/untape/whatever part way through.

4. Spray orange pad with conditioning spray that came with the pads. Apply megs m105 directly to orange pad and rub onto car before turning PC on. Cutting the correct term for this?

Yeah, that`s "cutting". BUT...I don`t bother pretreating the pads for PC work. I just prime them properly (see KMB, or I can elaborate).

DON`T rub the product around when using M105. Put the PC on the paint, turn it on and start doing the regular polishing *without* any pre-spreading. M105 flashes off fast and prespreading makes that happen *TOO* fast.

4.1 Turn on PC and start working in megs m105 (what speed on PC?) overlapping 50% about 1-2"/min? just enough pressure to slow the pad down a bit?

Do i take a microfiber towel and buff off the excess m105 before moving on after this step?

Use speed 6 unless you`re using 4" pads, which I prefer to use at 5.

Work a small area, maybe a foot square. Work systematically so the entire area gets equal work. You`ll be able to move the PC across the area maybe six times before the M105 starts to dry out, yeah...it happens fast. Stop before the M105 has completely dried and buff off the excess. Reapply a little more M105 and repeat as needed. Always end by wiping off the M105 residue.

You oughta look up the KBM and/or Mike Phillips`s tutorials on this stuff as those two guys cover it a lot better than I will.

Wipe down panels with IPA between m105 and m205?

You could, it might reveal some areas that need more work.

5. Condition pad, M205 with white or blue pad? apply the same way as m105?

Also do i buff this off to remove the excess then wipe with ipa? Same speed on the PC? Polish the correct term?

Yeah, this is the "polishing" step.

Again, I don`t condition pads for PC use, I just prime them properly. I`d use the white pad, at least for the initial passes. Sometimes I even like a *more* aggressive pad than that depending how the M105 left things.

M205 is used the same way but it has a *MUCH* longer work-time and you can work somewhat larger areas.

When you think everything is OK, then you might want to do the IPA wipedown and pull it into the sun for a good inspection.

IMPORTANT: I`d do *one* panel as a test. M105 and M205, the whole cutting -and-polishing process. Make sure you have everything dialed in/figured out before you do the rest of the vehicle. This is what Mike Phillips calls the "test spot" and it`s really important; people who get a little off-track sometimes mess up their whole car before they figure out that they needed to change some little thing.

6. Wax or seal? From what i understand this is sealing in your polish step. Just any decent OTC wax like meguiars (checked my spelling) Do i just use the white pad for this and remove with a fresh microfiber towel?

Waxes and sealants both have their pros and cons. While I don`t think you need anything especially expensive/exotic, I do think you should get something of quality...say, Collinite or maybe the Autoglym Hi Defininition that`s recently shown up in may Walmarts.

7. Clean pads with pad cleaner solution that came with pads and store in seperate zip lock bags. and wash all my towels.

Yep.

8. Crack open a beer and drool! O.K the beer might come out before this

Yep, and you will have earned it

Allocate a lot of time for this first polishing, it`ll go slower than you expect.

Also if anyone has any tips on how to polish c5 corvette wheels it would be great, i put a set on the camaro and they have minor flaws in them that just piss me off. From what i understand they need polished just like the paint?

My C5 had aftemarket wheels, so I`m not sure. I`d probably try the M105/M205 by hand, but you`d better see if somebody here has first-hand experience with the finish on those wheels before you try something you might regret.

**gmblack3** · 03-23-2010, 11:12 AM

You won`t remove any OP by machine polishing.

Please read the M105 orange pad tips in my sig. Then ask whatever questions you have.

Do not use the pad conditioner.

**Accumulator** · 03-23-2010, 11:29 AM

Originally Posted by gmblack3a

Please read the M105 orange pad tips in my sig. Then ask whatever questions you have..

Yeah, some of your posts Re the KBM will get rmkleman on the right track fast :xyxthumbs

**Rob22315** · 03-23-2010, 11:51 AM

Accumulator, thanks for posting this write-up. I used m205 on my brother`s Miata (actually, the newer one under some new name) over the winter. I kept seeing very faint holograms under just the right sunlight. Now I know it`s probably the oils in the m205. I`ll try an IPA wipedown when we get back to doing this again now that spring is here.

**Accumulator** · 03-23-2010, 12:17 PM

Originally Posted by Rob22315

Accumulator, thanks for posting this write-up. I used m205 on my brother`s Miata (actually, the newer one under some new name) over the winter. I kept seeing very faint holograms under just the right sunlight. Now I know it`s probably the oils in the m205. I`ll try an IPA wipedown when we get back to doing this again now that spring is here.

As long as you weren`t using a rotary, then yeah...I`d assume they were oil-based pseudo-holograms.

OR...if you used M105, then maybe the problem was micromarring from the M105 that was a little too severe for the M205 (and whatever pad you used) to correct. I`ve had both issues crop up. It reads like you only used M205, but I thought I`d mention the possibility in case rmkleman encounters something like that.

**dmxsoulja3** · 03-23-2010, 12:39 PM

You know I was thinking of a way to describe these "holograms" I was getting and everyone is like its rotary damage, but a rotary hasn`t touched my car, EVERYTIME I use NXT I get these, and I notice it in harsh sunlight and can`t capture it on a camera but you have to bend at different angles to get it to present itself, I noticed it on my trunk today, I`m going to IPA wipe down, and put it out in the sun and see if I see them but my guess is not. I put the NXT on super thin with my PC let it flash, swipe test, wipe off... how do I prevent it? I just got 105/205 and the thought of more pseudo holograms doesn`t make me happy lol

**Accumulator** · 03-23-2010, 12:55 PM

dmxsoulja3- Huh, I`ve only used NXT a few times, but I never got `em from that :nixweiss

Maybe try applying it by hand. That`s assuming that you don`t see them after the IPA wipedown.

FWIW, on some paints IPA doesn`t solve the residual-oils pseudo-hologram issue for me. I have to use TOL`s PrepWash or something else that`s pretty strong.

**dmxsoulja3** · 03-23-2010, 01:27 PM

yeah the way I tracked it down was on my own car, I polished my hood, not 100% corrected but 100% improved from where I started, after I polished I wiped it down with quick detailer, and eventually sprayed it off with my pressure washer because pollen is out lately, I dried it, looked great...I NXT`d it, super thin coat speed 2/3 on PC, no pressure just spread it on like butter.. car looked amazing..I drive it to work, I come outside about 3pm when the sun is really beating on it, and im like *** is that.. holograms on the hood front to back in random areas nothing side to side, it almost looks like bars of holograms.. think like an image shift side to side like a shadow but it isnt streaking, because I`ve seen that too, try NXT in direct sunlight in black lol.. so I go home, washed my trunk, clayed it, 50/50 tape job, straight to NXT no polishing to eliminate the fact I damaged the paint.. next day same conditions.. half of my trunk has wierd up and down hologram effect, the other side nothing. My plan is to klasse AIO my hood tonight which should for sure remove the nxt and see how I look tomorrow, AIO is pretty cut and dry if its damaged before, it will look damaged after in my experiences using it.