3M PI-II Fine Cut Rubbing Compound (39002)

[imported_ThreeSixT]

Is it too harsh for my "newer" paint? I have a Nogaro (Royal) Blue 02 Audi A4 with minor defects. These include light scratches, swirls, and oxidation. Am I able to use 39002 on my entire vehicle? I have heard that it may be too abrasive. I wanted to try Menzerna IP and FP to try on the whole car, but I can`t get it soon enough so I decided to go with 39002.



I plan to start with Blackfire Clay, then follow 39002 with P21S GEPC, AIO, SG, and P21S Paste. What do you guys think? TIA

[LouisanaJeeper]

That`s what I use most of the time. It is not all that aggressive. Try it out with a white polishing pad and see if it works, if not step up to a yellow cutting pad and the 3M fcrc.

I hear the Audi paints are pretty hard/durable anyway, so I guess you would need something decently abrasive to remove swirls.

[Jesstzn]

The 39002 I tried on mine seemed to have a lot of fillers and if so the AIO will lift them so you might think of doing a 50/50 water rubbing alcohol mix spritz to make sure the swirls are gone and not filled. I have the German paint too .. Nice car BTW .. had a A4 loaner for a week ..

[imported_edschwab1]

Originally posted by ThreeSixT

Is it too harsh for my "newer" paint? I have a Nogaro (Royal) Blue 02 Audi A4 with minor defects. These inlcude scratches, sand scratches, swirls, and oxidation. Am I able to use 39002 on my entire vehicle? I have heard that it may be too abrasive. I wanted to try Menzerna IP and FP to try on the whole car, but I can`t get it soon enough so I decided to go with 39002.



I plan to start with Blackfire Clay, then follow 39002 with P21S GEPC, AIO, SG, and P21S Paste. What do you guys think? TIA

How deep are the scratches yoou are trying to remove?

What grit paper left the sand scratches?

Oxidation on an 02 A4?

What is the rush to get the car done?



3M FCRC should do just fine, but I would follow up with something a little more abrasive than GEPC, such SMR, PI-III MG, #9/#82 or FP. Then after that follow up with GEPC or AIO.



Eric

[imported_ThreeSixT]

Originally posted by edschwab1

How deep are the scratches yoou are trying to remove?

What grit paper left the sand scratches?

Oxidation on an 02 A4?

What is the rush to get the car done?



3M FCRC should do just fine, but I would follow up with something a little more abrasive than GEPC, such SMR, PI-III MG, #9/#82 or FP. Then after that follow up with GEPC or AIO.



Eric

The scratches are not very deep. You can only see them when you look at certain angles. The swirls throughout the car are light, but heavy around the trunk. The oxidation I`m referring to are light water spots and stains from bugs and bird droppings. The rush is that I have an appointment on Sunday to have pics taken of my car for my sponsor so that they can post them on their website. So tomorrow will be an all day event :xyxthumbs



Oh, and I forgot to mention that this will all be done by hand...

[imported_edschwab1]

My plan of attack would be:



Wash

Clay

39002 only on water/bird spots and heavy scratches

Meg`s #9 or 3M 39009 SMR on whole car

GEPC or Meg`s #7on whole car

P21s wax once on saturday and once early sunday before photo shoot.



Do a search for scottwax`s hand application tips.



Do whole car over once you receive IP and FP with K twins.



Eric

[Bill D]

Before I had my A4 I used the FCRC on my other black car,was very disappointed with the results, didn`t do much. I hear Audi paint is incredibly hard so it may do even less for it. I bought the 1z polishes and when they are needed I`ll see how they fair.

[imported_ThreeSixT]

Thanks for the insight Bill. I `m interested in the 1Z Polsihes also, but am weary of using the Ultra PP due to the fact that it is so abrasive. For my situation, Mike @ Einzett recommended that I start with the regular PP and work from there. However, I`m not sure the PP will do any better than 39002. Any thoughts?

[Accumulator]

The 30992 should work sorta OK on the Audi paint. I myself prefer the PI-III stuff (05933) and feel it leaves a smoother finish, but the 39002 works OK too. But don`t expect it to work miracles unless you use a rotary. As you suspect (and as Bill D and others have found), Audi clear is HARD. I can`t fix the marring on my friend`s A6 with a PC, let alone by hand. Heh heh, I don`t let MY Audis get too marred up in the first place but see last paragraph, below.



IMO it won`t be too aggressive, but you WILL need to follow up with something sorta strong like the PI-III MG (pn 05937). I`d be surprised if the GEPC is strong enough, but give it a try.



Anyone can cut through ANY paint with just about ANYTHING if they try hard enough, but *IMO* you`re just not gonna have a problem with "too aggressive products" on a new Audi (and I`ve done quite a few of them). The more likely problem will be that you just can`t remove the scratches because the clear is too hard.



Bill D- When I got the S8 back from its "deer incident" repair, it had a few scratches on the roof (heh heh, yeah, I, uhm, "adequately expressed my displeasure" to the guys at Stoddard). Even with the 1Z Ultra, I had to use a (small, 4-5") cutting pad on the rotary for the worst of it! I must`ve tried everything in the shop before resorting to that...it`s some HARD clear all right!

[Accumulator]

ThreeSixT - Nah, the 1z PP won`t be much if any stronger than the 3M 39002/05933. *I* equate it more with the 3M PI-III MG (05937), I find the two virtually indistinquishable abrasiveness-wise, at least on Audi clear (and neither is aggressive enough for anything serious).



Get the Ultra too. Seriously. I`m VERY confident that you`ll need it. It`s *NOT* too aggressive for a newish Auid. It might not even be aggressive enough.



Oh, and *I`d* get the Metallic too. The three polishes work VERY well together. I see a slight improvement when I use the Metallic. The AIO will (presumably) remove it`s "wax", but *I* would use it anyhow. Actually, *I* don`t really care for the Klasse twins on Audis, but that`s just me (and I do like them on my Japanese vehicles).

[imported_ThreeSixT]

Thanks Accumulator. I am debating whether or not to hold out on this detail to order either the Menzerna twins or the 1Z line. Since you have experience with Audis, which one do you think I would fair better with?



BTW, I sent you a PM last week and no response. Not sure if you got it.

[Accumulator]

ThreeSixT- Sorry I didn`t spot your PM. I must not have received an e-mail notification or something...I try to get right back on PMs, so again, sorry about that.



Regarding the Qs in your PM, no, I`m NOT familiar with the new 3M product you asked about. I haven`t tried the Menzerna products because I`ve heard they can be hard to remove. Sometimes the 3M PI-III MG can be tough to remove (I use AIO) and that`s enough of a pain that I`ve pretty much switched to the 1Z stuff.



Gee, I`m batting a thousand so far, huh? Perhaps I HAVE answered a few of your Qs in this thread



*I* predict that if you go ahead (with what you have) you will give up LONG before you remove most of the marring. That`s not meant to sound critical, BTW. I`ve nearly killed myself on some Audis..finally got a rotary (which I haven`t needed since the early `80s!), primarily to deal with the marring on my friend`s A6. You`ll make things better, but you`ll probably want more.



Since I haven`t tried the Menzerna polishes, it`s hard to say what YOU`d like best. *I* find the 1Z stuff, to be, by far, the easiest (abrasive) polishes I`ve *EVER* used. That`s good enough for ME, but some will say I`m missing out by not using the Menzerna stuff. I just put SO much value on ease-of-use....and it`s not like I`m dissatisfied with how my cars turn out (heh heh, well, at least not because of my brand of polish ).

[imported_ThreeSixT]

Thanks again for all of your help. :xyxthumbs



Seeing as I have to get this done today and tomorrow. I will have to use what I`ve got and go forward with 1z or menzerna next time around.



So this will be my final plan of attack. I am going to return my PI-II FCRC and just go forward with:



Wash

Clay

P21S GEPC

AIO

SG

P21S Paste



Then in about another month I will revisit my problem with the appropriate chemicals and a PC 7424 and do it the right way. You are absoluteky right in that I don`t want to waste my time on results I won`t be completely satisfied with. I`m sure the plan I have provided will do fine for now. Thanks again.

[Jesstzn]

Originally posted by Accumulator

I haven`t tried the Menzerna products because I`ve heard they can be hard to remove.

).

Accummulator .. I have used Menzerna and still use Menzerna polishes and the only time I found removal a little hard was when I used the Intensive Polish by hand and I put on a little too much. In the Menzerna instructions it says while using IP you can use a 50/50 mix of water/alcohol to remove it to see your progress. I found even this step easy. The FP is very easy to remove.



I think some have applied the IP and let it dry where wipe off should be immediate.

[Bill D]

I have the Menzerna twins and I used them before I got my Audi on black Japanese paint and white American paint. Using them with a PC, they didn`t perform to my satisfaction, I still saw swirls and a few deeper scratches. Yeah, the IP was kind of hard to remove in some spots but the water/alcohol mix did get it right off.I think Menzerna is intended for a rotary. When the time comes to do some serious detailing on my Audi I`ll probably not even include Menzerna in my plan of attack, I`ll go straight to the 1z polishes.