The truth about carnauba vs acrylics/polymers

**medic** · 06-20-2002, 10:40 AM

Originally posted by laynlow

Yeah, I get it, my point is if polymers are bad, why are they a dealer installed option?

so are car bras and dealer installed stereos, but dealers will still try to sell them to you. they`re trying to make $$, and will follow any marketing gimick/buzz word to sell them to you. "Polymer", sounds expensive and difficult so people don`t think twice on putting it on a car they love, plus probably the sell that you don`t have to wax for 6 months to a year.

I agreee, no problem using polymers. Btw, clear bras/X-pel, etc probalby seal in the paint more then a polymer, I figure, so if these things are okay, a liquid polymer should be fine.

**shaf** · 06-20-2002, 01:32 PM

I agree with the points that MiGTI and blkZ28Conv pointed out :up

Just like with herbal medicine and homeopathy, "all natural" doesn`t mean it`s safe or even beneficial. Saying catch phrases like that smacks of snake oil to my ears.

And yes, just like a sheet of saran wrap, plastic bottle, etc synthetically made products can flex and stretch also. Even if it does form a theoretical solid sheet over your paint, how much really does it need to flex and expand? It`s a car, not a balloon. I honestly think there`s some misunderstanding about these "polymer chains" out there. It seems like people think that they chemically react to form one huge interlocking macromolecule on a molecular level, which I highly doubt. In reality they`re probably just a pile of individual chains that happen to hold together really well (once the solvent leaves), but are NOT molecularly bonded - there`s a big difference. This is just my guess, but it sounds right to me....

Note: Zaino seems to imply some kind of chemical reaction since it requires Z1 or ZFX to work right. This sounds like a catalyst like the hardening agent in Bondo or epoxy. Can any Z user shed some light on this?

**imported_Intel486** · 06-20-2002, 06:54 PM

Originally posted by stuart hicks

Whoever said that wax doesn`t build up layers has never been surfing, at least not successfully. To wax a surfboard you rub and rub and rub wax formed in the shape of a hockey puck until little mounds start to pile up. Theses mounds start to bulid into little peaks that pull more and more of the wax from the wax disc onto the surfboard.

After about five minutes you have wax that builds little peaks and valleys. You can get this stuff about 1/8 of an inch thick in no time at all.

I wonder if you could wax the front of your car with something like that to protect it from rock chips and bugs? Might not look good but I`d be willing to use it for a road trip if it helped protect it!

**stuart hicks** · 06-20-2002, 07:52 PM

You could use surf wax on your car but it wouldn`t last that long in the sun. Most of it would melt because it`s made of beeswax.

The residue is a sticky mess that may be hard to clean off without using solvents. Maybe try it on a beater car first. Sex wax makes a hot weather wax that is the most durable. different colors are for different temps, so go for the hottest temp wax available.

**jfeliot** · 06-23-2002, 09:31 AM

I put about 25 coats on Zaino on my car last summer. No ill effects after sitting outside all winter in temps that went as low as -45 deg F at night & warm enough for the sun to melt the snow on the hood during the day.

So I`d say the quality synthetics (Zaino, Klasse) are designed to be flexible enough to not cause problems with expansion/contraction, they will bond to and move with the paint during temp changes.

Just my $.02

**thevolvoguy** · 06-23-2002, 01:49 PM

stuart- "sex wax your car"?? How does this work? Typo? lol:bounce

**stuart hicks** · 06-23-2002, 04:32 PM

The most popular brand of surf wax is called MR. Zoggs Sex Wax.

It has been around for decades and you see the T-shirts in every beach town in America.

**Bobby G** · 06-23-2002, 05:06 PM

or should that be... Yes, We have No Sealants Depot.

**mrdetailer** · 06-28-2002, 11:19 PM

I layer them all the time. The depth really increases by the 3rd coat.

**TurboMan** · 07-03-2002, 06:13 PM

Hi gang,

Layering has much to do with the solvent content and properties of a product, as well as the ability (or inability) of that product, once cured, to redissolve back into that solvent.

i.e. Surf wax has a low solvent content, so it layers easily--that`s what it`s designed to do.

By the way, I prefer the carnauba look on my black Benz as opposed to a polymer look. Gives the car a rich, silky glow rather that a bright dazzling shine. However, I do like the way a poly looks on my silver Nissan Quest. Both work for me!

Aloha,

Keoni

**imported_Aurora40** · 07-17-2002, 09:45 AM

I think BlkZ28 hit it on the head when he mentioned acrylic. The paint on your car is acrylic. The reason it`s called that is because it has plastics in it which is what allows the paint to flex. I don`t see why polymers couldn`t have similar flexing abilities.

But I have to say, to me it seems impossible that some thin little layer of Blackfire, even if it didn`t flex, could really restrain the paint as it expands. When a solid expands, it can exert considerable force in doing so. There is no way some little coat of BF or Klasse is going to prevent this from happening or have enough "bonding" power to crack the paint. It just seems ridiculous to me.