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  1. #1
    acuRAS82's Avatar
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    PBL Paint Coating vs Surface Coating?

    Has anyone tried both of these alone? The sale on Autopia has me interested. I see Mike P. often mention using the Surface Coating to refresh the other PBL Coatings but was curious how it would be as the base coating?

    The Surface Coating says up to 3 years longevity, but given Iíve heard the Surface Coating isnít as durable as the Paint Coating, and given Iíve read the Paint Coating 12-18 months for a DD, can I assume about 9 months real-world from the Surface Coating in a fairly mild (Pittsburgh) environment?

    If the above seems accurate, I would almost view the Surface Coating as a CanCoat equivalent (which is the max time I would want a single LSP for). Iím not sure how many applications come with a 200ml CanCoat, but at 10-15 apps for PBL Surface, $80-something after the sale seems like a good deal.

    Anyways, any experience with longevity of either would be greatly appreciated. Note that I do have the wheel and glass coatings already, so am already leaning towards the Surface Coating. Not sure about the paint coating though.

  2. #2
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    Re: PBL Paint Coating vs Surface Coating?

    So, I had the misfortune of drinking the Kool Aid & buying into the whole Pinnacle paint coating shebang - V2.0.

    It has the same properties as a lot of boutique style detailing LSPs. Application is easy, user satisfaction is high. You think youíre doing great work! Looks awesome when youíre done & beads water well the first time it gets wet.

    Silly me figured a coating rated at 3 yrs should be able to get through 4 mos of PA winter... Was not the case. Basically the stuff on the lower parts of side panels was burnt toast by the time of first wash...

    So what did I do? Applied the ďboosterĒ of course (remember, I bought into the whole kit). Which lasted exactly until the next wash on the same areas. At that point, I realized this stuff prolly isnít as durable as Powerlock on a bad day.

    Ok. To be fair, Iíve found not many things that hold up to the snow mix here on lower panels. Iím sure this stuff would be OK if you live in perfect weather state or garage queen. But so will a lot of other stuff that is a lot cheaper and less work to apply.

    I may apply it to my BMW at one point - which doesnít see bad weather. So, my review is itís all awesome - just not durable over the long haul. I canít imagine the surface coating is significantly different.

    These days itís just easier to take 5 mins & apply Sonax BSD after every wash & itís basically like you have a newly installed coating all the time for $16 a bottle ($12 after 25% off sale) - thereís a booster for ya.

    That was my last adventure with coatings. Iím thinking if the brine solution can rot metal alway there is just no coating or LSP that can stand up to it. My bad. But the manufacturers of these things are blowing smoke saying they will hold up anywhere near 3 years - unless your cat stays parked inside for 3 years under a bubble. Thatís their bad.
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  3. #3
    acuRAS82's Avatar
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    Re: PBL Paint Coating vs Surface Coating?

    Thanks for your experiences Swanic! I may go for the KoolAid too, but partially because I already have everything else PBL (Synergy, Sealant, QD, Shampoo, cleansing lotion, Wheel/glass coatings) all purchased during different sales. I do like the PBLs I’ve tried, and money for my main hobby here isn’t a concern at this time. If I’m going to try a real coating finally (I blame it on the gateway SiO2 sprays), I figure PBL might be a choice for me, especially given the sale prices.

    Maybe your side panels needed a Reset-style wash after 4 months in PA winter, or maybe the salt mix did degrade/crush it. I’ll be prepared for the same, and worst case I have the Sealant/Synergy, or one of 12 different SiO2 toppers to get me by. Gives me more functional reason to use them. It’s mainly the self-cleaning, glossy shine, and base to try out my toppers with... these aspects interest me more than long term durability (I know, I may be crazy).

    At this point I’m leaning towards get the Paint and Surface, but still very interested in others’ experiences before deciding for sure.

  4. #4
    Mike The Guz's Avatar
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    Re: PBL Paint Coating vs Surface Coating?

    Here is my thread on PBL V2. Never used the surface coating so can`t help you there.

    https://www.autogeekonline.net/forum...-w-pbl-v2.html

    Hard to believe I used it 4 years ago. I find PBL to be more of a sealant on steroids than a true coating. Perhaps because I consider a coating to harden the applicator which this does not. This is not a bad thing as it performed well. I gave my bottle away as I just found other coatings to perform better overall and I was never going to use PBL again.
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  5. #5
    acuRAS82's Avatar
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    Re: PBL Paint Coating vs Surface Coating?

    Thanks Guz. When you compare to s Sealant on steroids, this isn’t a knock on the beading/self-cleaning I assume (hoping not since the beads looked like coating beads in the pictures)?

  6. #6

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    Re: PBL Paint Coating vs Surface Coating?

    Donít know about the PBL but was blown away with Cquartz UK3 topped with gyeon can coat and cosmic spritz. The gloss and depth best Iíve ever seen


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  7. #7
    Mike The Guz's Avatar
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    Re: PBL Paint Coating vs Surface Coating?

    Quote Originally Posted by acuRAS82 View Post
    Thanks Guz. When you compare to s Sealant on steroids, this isnít a knock on the beading/self-cleaning I assume (hoping not since the beads looked like coating beads in the pictures)?
    Itís a good product and its ease of use it the selling point. You will get multiple applications out of it.

    I would not be caught up on the longevity of it or any coating.

    If you are a fan of the PBL line then give it a try. There are better coatings on the market.
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  8. #8
    acuRAS82's Avatar
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    Re: PBL Paint Coating vs Surface Coating?

    ^^Purchased PBL paint and surface coatings tonight. Not because I’m dying to get into coatings, but because:
    1) I have the other PBL products to supplement,
    2) figured I should try an easy coating just to say I have done a paint coating, and
    3) if I don’t like my results on the first try, I can try again with the remaining quantity without feeling as though I wasted lots of money.

    It’s only this one time, then I’m done forever.

  9. #9

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    Re: PBL Paint Coating vs Surface Coating?

    Quote Originally Posted by acuRAS82 View Post
    ^^Purchased PBL paint and surface coatings tonight. Not because Iím dying to get into coatings, but because:
    1) I have the other PBL products to supplement,
    2) figured I should try an easy coating just to say I have done a paint coating, and
    3) if I donít like my results on the first try, I can try again with the remaining quantity without feeling as though I wasted lots of money.

    Itís only this one time, then Iím done forever.
    What were your thoughts on these coatings? Specifically the Surface Coating. Just ordered from AG not thinking of looking at reviews. Mike seems to like alot so figure likes Frankís red hot....iíll put that $H!£ on everything.

    Kinda thinking itís a gliss type product? Gonna coat chevelle with prolly something i got on hand.... moonlight or Cancoat. Top with surface coating. Have you tried as stand alone?


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  10. #10
    acuRAS82's Avatar
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    Re: PBL Paint Coating vs Surface Coating?

    Quote Originally Posted by Coatings=crack View Post
    What were your thoughts on these coatings? Specifically the Surface Coating. Just ordered from AG not thinking of looking at reviews. Mike seems to like alot so figure likes Frank’s red hot....i’ll put that $H!£ on everything.

    Kinda thinking it’s a gliss type product? Gonna coat chevelle with prolly something i got on hand.... moonlight or Cancoat. Top with surface coating. Have you tried as stand alone?


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    I think you have the exact right idea on how to use the Surface Coating. Using it as standalone I basically compare it to WG CSC (but I get better longevity out of CSC). To me, it’s strength is as a topper where one can enjoy it’s positive benefits combined with a durable underneath base coat that is doing the heavy lifting as far as protection and longevity.

    Good comparison to Frank’s Red Hot, perfect analogy IMO.
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  11. #11
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    Re: PBL Paint Coating vs Surface Coating?

    I personally think (which isn’t worth much) that all generations of Palm beach coatings up to the blackfire in glass bottle, Were under preforming when comparing to peers at the time. I think a lot of detailers are a little hesitant to try all the new offerings in the glass bottle.

    From the limited review information avab and our man loach it looks like the coatings are now on level of the regulars Cquartz. Gtechniq Gyeon.

    I still have a soft spot for black fires original coating crystal coat which was as thick as gear oil

  12. #12
    acuRAS82's Avatar
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    Re: PBL Paint Coating vs Surface Coating?

    Quote Originally Posted by William_Wallace View Post
    I personally think (which isn’t worth much) that all generations of Palm beach coatings up to the blackfire in glass bottle, Were under preforming when comparing to peers at the time. I think a lot of detailers are a little hesitant to try all the new offerings in the glass bottle.

    From the limited review information avab and our man loach it looks like the coatings are now on level of the regulars Cquartz. Gtechniq Gyeon.
    Yeah, I would compare the PBL sprays more as short term coatings with good slickness and looks but not the longevity and water behavior as competitors.

    I keep coming close to purchasing one of the PBMG glass bottles but I struggle with highest value. PBL / WG which have the same price $120 retail for 50ml) and rated as 4 and 3 years respectively (and I don’t take longevity ratings literally but must count as something for durability when comparing products within a brand, right?) be the BF Pro Black which costs less ($100 for 50ml) and is rated for 5 years. And from the reviews Mike P did, it seems BF applied almost better than the other two and looked very nice. So not sure if/when to pull the trigger on any of these or which one in particular.

  13. #13
    William_Wallace's Avatar
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    Re: PBL Paint Coating vs Surface Coating?

    Quote Originally Posted by acuRAS82 View Post
    Yeah, I would compare the PBL sprays more as short term coatings with good slickness and looks but not the longevity and water behavior as competitors.

    I keep coming close to purchasing one of the PBMG glass bottles but I struggle with highest value. PBL / WG which have the same price $120 retail for 50ml) and rated as 4 and 3 years respectively (and I don’t take longevity ratings literally but must count as something for durability when comparing products within a brand, right?) be the BF Pro Black which costs less ($100 for 50ml) and is rated for 5 years. And from the reviews Mike P did, it seems BF applied almost better than the other two and looked very nice. So not sure if/when to pull the trigger on any of these or which one in particular.
    the two black fires look different the pro one looks like it sweats like Gtechniq CSL instead of rainbow flashing.

  14. #14
    acuRAS82's Avatar
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    Re: PBL Paint Coating vs Surface Coating?

    Quote Originally Posted by William_Wallace View Post
    the two black fires look different the pro one looks like it sweats like Gtechniq CSL instead of rainbow flashing.
    Yeah, Pro Black does the sweating per Mike’s article. And to my knowledge WG and PBL do not sweat, which makes me believe they are quite different and makes me hesitant to spend more money on what may be older formulas. If the BF Pro Black turns out to be the best then why pay more, ya know? But not enough time or users to know details about all 3 of these coatings yet.

  15. #15

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    Re: PBL Paint Coating vs Surface Coating?

    Quote Originally Posted by William_Wallace View Post
    I still have a soft spot for black fires original coating crystal coat which was as thick as gear oil
    ...and twice as hard to remove. That coating was my first introduction to the coating world. The experience was so bad it took me a while before trying again. Fortunately my next attempt was the original McKee`s coating. Went on easy enough, but looked and behaved like Collinite 845. At least it lasted two years.
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