Difficulty removing SSR2.5 swirls with SSR1

**Greg2** · 07-03-2006, 12:44 AM

Hi,

I have just tried a bit of hand polishing with SSR2.5 followed by SSR1. The good news is that this is doing a good job at removing what appears to be water spots. However, I can`t seem to completely remove the swirls which SSR2.5 itself introduces.

Note that despite the fact that I have a ROB with pads, I have not tried this yet. (lack of mains power near the vehicle

) So, I`m only using a cotton t-shirt to apply the polish at the moment I know this is wrong, but my feeling is that it`s probably not a big factor, because I`ve tried rubbing firmly with the t-shirt dry, and this doesn`t scratch. (it probably is scratching, but the scratches are so fine that they`re not important yet). Edit: I`ve also tried rubbing on a fresh area with just the SSR1 - this also does not seem to introduce any scratches/swirls.

I`ve tried multiple applications of SSR1, but the swirls just never seem to go away. I`m not sure if they`re even slowly disappearing.

Just how much effort should be required in removing SSR2.5 swirls with SSR1?

By the way, it says on the bottles to shake well before use. My confidence in being able to shake these full bottles to cause any mixing whatsoever is very low indeed.

Greg.

p.s FWIW, I am at least using a proper microfibre buffing towel to wipe down. (I don`t feel like using this to rub in the polish firmly - waste of a good towel)

**Greg2** · 07-03-2006, 01:56 AM

Note that this thread: http://autopia.org/forum/showthread.php?t=73846 is on the same topic.

(moderators: please feel free to delete my thread. I`m not deleting it myself just yet because I`m hand polishing, and my technique may end up being a factor)

Greg.

**Greg2** · 07-03-2006, 02:21 AM

FWIW, I`ve very nearly removed a scratch from my mobile phone screen using SSR1, so it appears that the polish does have abrasives in it - it`s not obviously defective. (this gels with the results I got when polishing the car with just SSR1 - it did seem to do some polishing - but I felt the need to use the 2.5 as well)

I have a feeling that going from SSR2.5 to SSR1 is just going to require a lot of SSR1, but it will end up working.

Greg.

p.s The SSR1 seems to work well on the plastic screen of the mobile phone - I can`t see any extra marring at all - leaves a nice shiny finish.

**Djmigs** · 07-03-2006, 02:58 AM

Hi Greg,

I dont think you can complete work to break down the polish of ssr on your paint again i have not tried that method...i think you may need a different approach to some product that are more geared to hand application....

checkhere 2 3

again they are suggesting to use meguiars scratch x,1z Paint Polish, also note they suggested glazes ....just to mention you cannot expect results simular to machine unless paint is swirl free and non containments and so forth but in your situation you can make it look better but for the best results by machine..

.also since now that your aware of, you wont be able to remove swirls you will hide them with glaze then seal it with your choice of wax or a sealant or both of your choice...again this method will wear off over time and the swirls will return and you will need to reapply...

imho save your money now and definetly get your self a pc, if you able to at your location if not there are other Random orbital machine that will do the trick also before buy any machine let us know which one it is reason so we can give you are reviews on that machine(some pro detailers plus weekend warriors dont all carry the same machine) so you can decide if it not worth the machine and we can make some suggestions...good luck..but most of all have fun :buffing:

**Greg2** · 07-03-2006, 03:49 AM

Miguel,

Thanks. I do actually have a machine, but I haven`t tried it yet. I`ll try it as soon as I`m able to. (I have the Bosch PEX400AE RO

So, it appears that I should first re-apply SSR2.5 by machine, ensuring that this polish is broken down. Only then move onto the SSR1.

Greg.

**Greg2** · 07-03-2006, 03:32 PM

Well, I can certainly believe that machine use is MUCH more intense than hand use.

I just had to try my ROB on something while I wait, so I decided to attack the glass on my computer screen.

Ever since I had used a scouring pad on it, it had been quite scratched, so I decided to try my luck polishing the scratches out. The ROB works, however, I`m pretty sure that all it`s really doing is rubbing off the anti-glare coating. (a black gummy substance is forming which I strongly believe is the coating - not the polish) It is leaving a pristine glass surface in the areas where I can reach with the ROB. (I can`t reach the corners with my large 6" pad - I don`t have anything smaller) By hand, I just can`t seem to make any difference whatsoever, so the ROB is doing a lot of work. (although presumably I`ll have more luck if I use the same scouring pad I used when I scratched it - haven`t tried that yet)

Greg.

**drck1000** · 07-03-2006, 04:07 PM

Originally Posted by Greg2

Well, I can certainly believe that machine use is MUCH more intense than hand use.

I just had to try my ROB on something while I wait, so I decided to attack the glass on my computer screen.

Ever since I had used a scouring pad on it, it had been quite scratched, so I decided to try my luck polishing the scratches out. The ROB works, however, I`m pretty sure that all it`s really doing is rubbing off the anti-glare coating. (a black gummy substance is forming which I strongly believe is the coating - not the polish) It is leaving a pristine glass surface in the areas where I can reach with the ROB. (I can`t reach the corners with my large 6" pad - I don`t have anything smaller) By hand, I just can`t seem to make any difference whatsoever, so the ROB is doing a lot of work. (although presumably I`ll have more luck if I use the same scouring pad I used when I scratched it - haven`t tried that yet)

Greg.

On word that other Autopians had tried using 425 on their computer/tv screens, I used 425 on my tv at home and it worked really well. However, not sure that I would ever use it for a test surface for a PC/pad/polish combo. If it works for you then great! I`d rather not risk having to but another monitor/tv.

I know how it feels to have detailing products and equipment that you want to try out and you`ve already detailed all the vehicles in your household. I`ve even offered to wash, clay, polish, wax the hoods of friend`s cars just to try out products (hoods because it`s an easy surface to work on and a good area to test durability and don`t quite feel up to detailing their whole car just to try products out). None of them have taken me up on that offer. However, after seeing one of my close friend`s car this weekend, I was almost tempted to tell him to just swing by my place one weekend and I would detail it for him. He`s too lazy to do it himself.

**Greg2** · 07-03-2006, 04:14 PM

The situation I`m in is that the body corporate (I live in an apartment) have nailed up the cupboard where there is a power socket, so I have to solve this problem before I can use my machine for it`s intended purpose - to polish my damn car.

Just an update - I can remove the anti-glare by hand afterall, but boy is it slow going.

Regarding ruining the screen, well, I`m quite sure I have ruined mine, by removing the anti-glare. So you have been warned. (I`m not too fussed about mine - it`s very old, and besides, it`s amazing just how much brighter the areas are which have had the anti-glare removed - that`s an upside)

Greg.

**Greg2** · 07-03-2006, 09:08 PM

Ok, I`ve now tried the ROB. I`m not yet able to achieve a mirror like surface.

Even when I use the SSR1 on a surface which is already in very good condition, the SSR1 makes it worse - it introduces very fine swirl marks/hazing. (fortunately this panel needs repainting for some other damage, so I can use it for practising)

Note that I`m inspecting my work very closely, with a bright headtorch, looking straight at the surface from about a foot away (i.e eyes and beam perpendicular to surface).

When I slowly move my head across the surface, I can easily see the transition from where I worked (lousy) to the untouched area (very smooth, like a mirror or puddle of water)

I`m not 100% sure I`m working the polish enough yet. It`s really very difficult for me to tell.

I`m using a 6" Edge polishing pad. (the blue one)

Greg.

**Greg2** · 07-09-2006, 10:47 PM

Hi,

As you may be aware, I started discussing my problem in another thread, but I now feel that I should return here.

The current situation is that I now have a Bosch PEX400AE ROB, which my supplier says is very good - about the same as a PC. Along with the two SSRs, I have an Edge pad set, and judging from their web site, it`s the classic set. (these ones: http://www.edgepads.com/ec6da.htm )

Although, my pads do not have any Edge branding on the back like the photo on the Edge web site. (I`m going to double check with my supplier regarding this discrepancy)

Even when I start on a panel which is already in very good condition, what happens is that I add swirls/hazing. If I`m also removing some existing scratches, this is rather inconsequential at the moment, because the damage I`m doing is far worse.

I briefly tried hand polishing a section which I damaged, and that improved it, but did not produce a mirror finish.

I`ll try to put some photos up - my first attempt at this did not reveal the swirling so I`ll have to play with the lighting angle and exposure I think.

On advice from my supplier, I`m using the higher speeds of the Bosch for swirl removal - 5 and 6. Also, another Autopian who has this same ROB said that the speed numbers on the Bosch equate to the speed numbers on the PC. (the OPS rating of the Bosch is higher than the PC, however the orbit offset of the Bosch is only 5mm - I think that`s the reason that the speed indications are the same, if it`s true)

Greg.

**Greg2** · 07-10-2006, 05:17 AM

Ok, some pics. There`re closeups, probably only representing about 2" across. I ensured that I focussed on the surface of the paint - not the reflection of the light source.

This is an untouched area of the panel. Some scratches are present, but overall it`s very good. The photo doesn`t show the glossiness very well - it does look very shiny/glossy when viewed naturally.

Here is an area which I`ve polished with SSR2.5 and an Edge Classic green pad. (I`ve also used 2.5 on a blue pad, and 1 on a blue pad, but the most recent work was 2.5 on the green pad). This photo shows the hazing/swirling quite well:

Next, I`ll try SSR1 on the blue pad, and then SSR1 on the white pad, with pics.

Greg.

p.s Am I the first bozo to post an AFTER shot which is worse than the BEFORE shot? :grinno:

**Greg2** · 07-10-2006, 07:31 PM

I`m not going to pursue machine polishing any further, because the noise is disturbing. (I live in an apartment, and despite the fact that the garages are under ground, the sound penetrates up to some of the apartments).

If I can`t do this at home, I`m not interested at all. I`m just going to get my polishing done by a professional, and that`s that. I can still do all the waxing by hand at home, and I`m looking forward to applying some of the products and techniques which I`ve learnt about here.

Just by the way, I`ve had some interesting correspondence with Edge. Edge say that now, by default, the blue and white pads will be polyester urethane. They made this change last year. Originally, the blue and white were Durafoam - the same kind of foam used (both then and now) for the yellow and green pads. They said I should try the new, softer pads, because by and large, they have found the softer pads to be better for polishing.

They also said that some folks still prefer the older (firmer) pads, however.

FWIW, I`ve just done three passes with my current Blue pad with SSR1, and there is still a lot of hazing/swirling. I was then going to try SSR1 with the White pad, but I`m not going to now - I`m stopping.

Greg.

**Greg2** · 07-10-2006, 11:49 PM

FYI, about 15 minutes of intense polishing a small area with Scratch-X, using a bit of t-shirt, has restored a lot of the original lustre. The difference is striking. Now, if I weren`t able to compare the Scratch-X`d area with the original, untouched area, I would have said that it was fully polished. However, when I compare the two, it still is not fully restored. (the reflection of my headtorch in the polished area is still a bit diffuse - the reflection in the untouched area is very sharp - like it`s a reflection in a mirror)

Perhaps if I were to keep going with the Scratch-X, I`d be able to bring back all the gloss - who knows. It does seem to have plateaued, though - the improvement with each pass is barely perceptable now. Perhaps I`d need to switch to a proper polishing cloth or a foam pad to finish it off. (for polishing small areas, I just find it easier to use a cloth, rather than a cumbersome pad. I don`t know why foam pads have to be so thick and absorbent)

Greg.