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  1. #16
    512detail's Avatar
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    Re: paint correction and protection questions

    Quote Originally Posted by PearTree View Post
    Mine is the dark gray metallic color. I see a bunch of different kits on autopia, any opinion on which one would be the best starter kit? And what else would I need to purchase on top of the kit? Also, any ideas on what polish would be best for a beginner to start with? Like I said earlier, Im not looking for a show car just good clear shiny paint with a lot of protection.
    In reference to the Mckee`s coating, any idea on how difficult it is to apply? And how well does the paint need to be corrected before applying the coating?
    Griots Garage & BLACKFIRE Duo Kit would be a good choice....that blackfire duo is very user friendly- I`ve used them both and considering the polisher is 149 alone you get the backing plate and two pads and these two (not cheap) blackfire products for an extra $40

    I`m not sure if the current sale applies to the polisher kits but if it does that will save you more (all I know is RUPES is never on the % off sales so never asked about the Griots stuff)

    Other very easy to use polishes and compounds would be Poorboys World brand....extremely easy to remove even if working in the hot sun (actually I think their products work BETTER in the hot sun than in a garage but maybe that`s just me)

    The Mckees coating is very easy to apply. you`d have a really hard time messing it up.


    Brandt K.
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  2. #17

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    Re: paint correction and protection questions

    If you want to learn how to apply coatings I would suggest you buy Optimum Opti Seal sealant. It is easiest to apply sealant I know of. Once you master this purchase Optimum Gloss Coat. I think that of all the coatings, it is the easiest to apply and very forgiving.
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  3. #18
    PearTree's Avatar
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    Re: paint correction and protection questions

    Quote Originally Posted by Accumulator View Post
    Ah, as soon as I read "sprinklers" I think how the FK1000P is *DEFINITELY* my recommendation. Sometimes nothing is adequate protection from such stuff, but that`s what`s worked best for me.

    Its maintenance is stupid-simple! Just do two coats, with the second one after the next regularly scheduled wash. Then reapply whenever you notice the beading start to change. That`ll keep you ahead of the curve for a long, long time.

    The trick with applying it, and this holds for most any LSP, is to do thin, *thin*, *THIN* applications. Can`t overemphasize or exaggerate that! If a tin doesn`t last somebody at least a decade then something`s totally haywire. Keep it off trim, and if it does get on there wipe it off before it flashes...not a HUGE deal the way some LSPs are, but don`t let it dry on the trim (use something like Ultima Tire & Trim Guard + on the trim and maintain with something like Meguiar`s Ultimate Quik Wax).

    For the polishes...I`m perhaps not the best source of info as I don`t keep up with the latest developments. But FWIW, I find Meguiar`s M101 to be the perfect Aggressive Compound and I`m 100% satisfied with 3D Polish, which I find VERY user-friendly.

    If you use Meguiar`s M205 or Ultimate Polish, be sure you have something truly effective to strip the Polishing Oils. I gave up on M205 because this seemingly minor job was such an incredible PIA, simply drove me nuts.

    OR...if the marring isn`t really bad enough to bug you (and don`t let these forums convince you that your car oughta be perfect), just do it with a FK1000P-friendly All-In-One (I use Zaino`s, which seems excellent for this, and FWIW I`m no Zaino fan in general).
    Thanks for the help! Given the price of the fk1000p I am leaning towards trying that first, as it is half the cost of the Mckee`s coating that has been mentioned here by others. The griots kit from autopia with blackfire polish is the one I am leaning too as it is a very good value. Will the Blackfire play nice with the fk1000p?

  4. #19
    PearTree's Avatar
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    Re: paint correction and protection questions

    Quote Originally Posted by 512detail View Post
    Griots Garage & BLACKFIRE Duo Kit would be a good choice....that blackfire duo is very user friendly- I`ve used them both and considering the polisher is 149 alone you get the backing plate and two pads and these two (not cheap) blackfire products for an extra $40

    I`m not sure if the current sale applies to the polisher kits but if it does that will save you more (all I know is RUPES is never on the % off sales so never asked about the Griots stuff)

    Other very easy to use polishes and compounds would be Poorboys World brand....extremely easy to remove even if working in the hot sun (actually I think their products work BETTER in the hot sun than in a garage but maybe that`s just me)

    The Mckees coating is very easy to apply. you`d have a really hard time messing it up.
    Thanks for the advice on the blackfire kit! How many more pads should I purchase on top of what the kit offers? And do I need a different brand/type? Given the cheapness of the fk1000p I figure I will try that first and if I dont like it I can always try the Mckee`s coating afterwards. It seems that removing a wax and applying a coating would be much easier than trying to remove a coating after it has been applied.

  5. #20
    Administrator GearHead_1's Avatar
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    Re: paint correction and protection questions

    I know others here really dig FK1000. I`ve used it quite a bit over the years and honestly I just can`t make myself like it. Don`t get me wrong there are a lot of products out there that are behind it on the food chain. It`s solid product but just not my solid product. I still have two tins in the cupboard. I don`t like the smell for starters and even with micro-thin coats I find it a little more difficult to use than modern paste waxes, I don`t find it to last as long as many claim and lastly I don`t find the look to be quite what I`m after. This said, it`s probably all me and the way I`m using it or just my expectations. I did however use it about a month on my daughters car, she was having trouble with tree droppings, she parks under covered parking but still gets it blowing in from the open sides. For all the things I don`t like about it, it does seem to do a good job given this situation.

    If I were going to make a recommendation for a last step product to you and I guess I am, it would be to look at BlackFire`s Crystal Seal. It won`t last you a year as some would have you believe but it will give me several months of really nice looking protection that beads extremely well. It`s cost is very reasonable and it takes all of 20 minutes to apply it couldn`t be any easier to put on. It`s gotta be just about stupid simple to use. Just my two cents.
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  6. #21

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    Re: paint correction and protection questions

    PearTree- I have limited experience with BlackFire as I didn`t care for it too much. Their sealant did a "darkening" thing that I didn`t care for and didn`t offer the protection/durability I want. Their Polish wasn`t bad if you like that kind of stuff and plenty of people do (IIRC it`s a variation on the Menzerna 106 line, which I DO *NOT* like). I`d be sure to get all the polishing oils off; I don`t *think* they`d mess with the FK1000P but as they dissipate you might find that marring you thought you`d corrected "comes back".

    You might try the coating on your wheels, IMO that`s a good, not-so-critical application where a little oops! won`t show and coating wheels sure does make them easy to live with as the brakedust/etc. just washes right off for years at a time (at least IME) whereas the FK1000P needs redone now and then.

    GearHead1- I still can`t figure out what`s up with your FK1000P user-friendliness issues, but I guess I`m just, uhm...different..as I honestly can`t recall *any* LSP ever being hard to use unless I did something wrong (isn`t *that* something?!? Lucky me!).

    I *REALLY* can`t figure out why it doesn`t last longer for you, but IIRC that makes two people here who`ve had it work out that way so I guess !YMMV! always applies.

    I`ll agree about the look not being right for every person/vehicle, though I just noticed again today how much I`ve come to like it on the `93 Audi (dark blue, a color it "oughta look lousy on", again, lucky me). Anyhoo..I certainly give you credit for having given it a shot!

  7. #22
    PearTree's Avatar
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    Re: paint correction and protection questions

    Quote Originally Posted by GearHead_1 View Post
    I know others here really dig FK1000. I`ve used it quite a bit over the years and honestly I just can`t make myself like it. Don`t get me wrong there are a lot of products out there that are behind it on the food chain. It`s solid product but just not my solid product. I still have two tins in the cupboard. I don`t like the smell for starters and even with micro-thin coats I find it a little more difficult to use than modern paste waxes, I don`t find it to last as long as many claim and lastly I don`t find the look to be quite what I`m after. This said, it`s probably all me and the way I`m using it or just my expectations. I did however use it about a month on my daughters car, she was having trouble with tree droppings, she parks under covered parking but still gets it blowing in from the open sides. For all the things I don`t like about it, it does seem to do a good job given this situation.

    If I were going to make a recommendation for a last step product to you and I guess I am, it would be to look at BlackFire`s Crystal Seal. It won`t last you a year as some would have you believe but it will give me several months of really nice looking protection that beads extremely well. It`s cost is very reasonable and it takes all of 20 minutes to apply it couldn`t be any easier to put on. It`s gotta be just about stupid simple to use. Just my two cents.
    Thanks for the reply. Comparing the blackfire to the fk1000p, how much difference is the longevity? I`ve read the fk1000p threads and it seems it lasts a good six months, so I was curious how long the blackfire would last? I know most would just suggest a coating but I would like to try a wax first to get comfortable before I start applying semi permament coatings on the paint.

  8. #23

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    Re: paint correction and protection questions

    Quote Originally Posted by PearTree View Post
    Thanks for the reply. Comparing the blackfire to the fk1000p, how much difference is the longevity? I`ve read the fk1000p threads and it seems it lasts a good six months, so I was curious how long the blackfire would last? I know most would just suggest a coating but I would like to try a wax first to get comfortable before I start applying semi permament coatings on the paint.
    See what GearHead1 says so you can compare two extremely different viewpoints/experiences....IME there simply *IS* no comparison and when it comes to etching resistance the diff is even more dramatic.

    I`m not saying how long FK1000P lasts for me since my vehicles are garaged and, well...I gather they`re more pampered that most. But FWIW I seldom *need* to reapply it even annually, though I often do that anyhow just to stay ahead of the curve. Heh heh, actually, I guess I *CAN`T* say how long it lasts for me as I`ve never let anything go so long that FK1000P truly died...although it`s usually getting close to dead on my wheels by the time I do the annual switch to snows (still lasts longer than anything else I`ve used other than a coating, closest rival was Klasse Sealant Glaze X 6 layers).

  9. #24
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    Re: paint correction and protection questions

    Quote Originally Posted by GearHead_1 View Post
    I know others here really dig FK1000. I`ve used it quite a bit over the years and honestly I just can`t make myself like it. Don`t get me wrong there are a lot of products out there that are behind it on the food chain. It`s solid product but just not my solid product. I still have two tins in the cupboard. I don`t like the smell for starters and even with micro-thin coats I find it a little more difficult to use than modern paste waxes, I don`t find it to last as long as many claim and lastly I don`t find the look to be quite what I`m after. This said, it`s probably all me and the way I`m using it or just my expectations. I did however use it about a month on my daughters car, she was having trouble with tree droppings, she parks under covered parking but still gets it blowing in from the open sides. For all the things I don`t like about it, it does seem to do a good job given this situation.

    If I were going to make a recommendation for a last step product to you and I guess I am, it would be to look at BlackFire`s Crystal Seal. It won`t last you a year as some would have you believe but it will give me several months of really nice looking protection that beads extremely well. It`s cost is very reasonable and it takes all of 20 minutes to apply it couldn`t be any easier to put on. It`s gotta be just about stupid simple to use. Just my two cents.
    You are not the only one who feels this way about FK1000. I didn`t really care for it when I used it.
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  10. #25

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    Re: paint correction and protection questions

    The Guz- Very curious about why you didn`t care for it! No, no...absolutely *NOT* looking to argue, genuinely interested in opinions/experiences from the other side of that fence The more differing views we present, the better informed others will be about what they might want to try, or not. Heh heh, just look at the products that I don`t care for... that everybody else loves

  11. #26
    Administrator GearHead_1's Avatar
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    Re: paint correction and protection questions

    GearHead1- I still can`t figure out what`s up with your FK1000P user-friendliness issues, but I guess I`m just, uhm...different..as I honestly can`t recall *any* LSP ever being hard to use unless I did something wrong (isn`t *that* something?!? Lucky me!).
    I guess the user-friendliness issues are in my mind more of a relative issue comparing one product to others on the market. It`s not a break your back type of difficult. I`ve said this before but sometimes how hard a product is to use is really more of a consideration of how long it will take to use it. Certainly over the past decade detailing products in general have become easier to use or at least in my mind they seem to be. Many tend to smell better too. This said, FK1000 is still in the paste wax theater of products and I honestly believe it to require more effort to use than products like Poorboys or Pinnacle (I like both of these) paste waxes to use. I`m not suggesting that it is as hard to use as the waxes of the 70`s or 80`s as I suspect even the difficulties with these waxes was more of a technique issue than product problem. It`s just not as easy as others that I consider to be in the same arena. I simply find other products both easier to use and with a look that I prefer. Spray on or wipe on and walk away products are just so easy to use.

    You and I both know that looks are very subjective and unless you`re looking at two products side by side it can be tough to tell which you like more. When it comes to longevity, admittedly, I don`t honestly know or for the most part don`t really care how long most products last. I`ve watched FK1000 hold on or hang it up (which ever way you decide to say it) pretty much in line with other sealants I`ve used. A couple to several months would be a very long time for me to leave a product on a vehicle without trying something new either in it`s place or on top of it. It`s fair to say that longevity isn`t my primary consideration.

    At the end of this conversation neither of us will have swayed the other even a little bit. Like Mike says, once you find a product you like, use it often. To the OP, the only way you`ll ever know which products you like better is to give several a shot. There are more than enough products out there to satisfy every users needs.
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  12. #27
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    Re: paint correction and protection questions

    Here is where I am at after all the advice given in this thread and further reading on the forums.

    1. Purchase griots gg6 kit with 5 inch backing plate and pads: Griot
    2. Purchase 6 pack of griots boss 5.5 inch pads: 2 white, 3 yellow, and 1 microfiber: Griots Garage 5.5 inch BOSS Foam and Microfiber Pads - 6 Pack
    3. Purchase hd cut + and polish + combo 8 ounce kit: HD Cut+ and Polish+ Combo 8 oz.
    4. Purchase fk1000p and yellow foam applicator pads
    5. Pad cleaner and pad cleaning brush

    Thoughts from the far more knowledgeable on this forum as a good starter kit? With the 15% off sale going on right now that will apply to the entire order.

  13. #28

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    Re: paint correction and protection questions

    PearTree- IMO you oughta skip the Pad Cleaning Brush. I`ve *never* found one that was worth using with polishers like the GG6 (different story with a rotary...sometimes). I`d find some other way to clean out the pads, because if there`s so much cut-off clear and dried-out product in a pad for the brush to do anything then IMO you oughta clean it out properly (or, really...just get out a clean one and clean all your pads later). Also, and related, *I* would need more pads than that, even if only doing a few panels at a time...but maybe that`s just me as I`ve learned I need to be an absolute fanatic about clean pads. I hope the HD Cut+ works OK for you and isn`t too mild. OTHERWISE...yes indeed, that sounds good and I commend you on doing your research before spending your money.

    Gearhead1- I appreciate the informative response! Heh heh, yeah...I sure will admit that Pinnacle Souveran smells better than the FK1000P, and if I enjoyed doing this stuff at all I`d probably enjoy using it (still my fave for the Jag). Though I actually like the chemically smell of the FK pretty much.

    I keep forgetting that many/?most? here reLSP before it`s necessary and actually enjoy it! Heh heh, just FWIW, that "find something you like and use it often" that Mike got from...oh [crap] I can`t remember, think he worked for PPG...is one of those Conventional Wisdom things that I actually *don`t* subscribe to now (more of my Autopian Heresy), though I sure did do it that way for ages. Nowadays, I find something that I like, in part because I *don`t* have to use it often, and then use it as infrequently as I can get away with Sigh...I really *did* enjoy Souveraning stuff back in the day though...even used it on the undercarriage of my last `vette.
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  14. #29

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    Re: paint correction and protection questions

    PearTree- You might check out the thread titled something like "HD Cut Problem" before you order any.
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  15. #30
    Administrator GearHead_1's Avatar
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    Re: paint correction and protection questions

    Quote Originally Posted by Accumulator View Post

    Gearhead1- I appreciate the informative response! Heh heh, yeah...I sure will admit that Pinnacle Souveran smells better than the FK1000P, and if I enjoyed doing this stuff at all I`d probably enjoy using it (still my fave for the Jag). Though I actually like the chemically smell of the FK pretty much.

    I keep forgetting that many/?most? here reLSP before it`s necessary and actually enjoy it! Heh heh, just FWIW, that "find something you like and use it often" that Mike got from...oh [crap] I can`t remember, think he worked for PPG...is one of those Conventional Wisdom things that I actually *don`t* subscribe to now (more of my Autopian Heresy), though I sure did do it that way for ages. Nowadays, I find something that I like, in part because I *don`t* have to use it often, and then use it as infrequently as I can get away with Sigh...I really *did* enjoy Souveraning stuff back in the day though...even used it on the undercarriage of my last `vette.

    Accumulator, let me start by saying that I mean no offense with this post but believe it or not the minute I typed Mike`s (or whoever else may have coined the phrase) comment, I actually anticipated this to be your response. I thought to myself he`s going to say he doesn`t or doesn`t like to touch his car often. I actually believe that people get the fact that you stand more of a chance of marring their paint by touching it than by leaving it the garage to only be viewed.

    Sometimes I wonder why you continue to embrace this hobby? There is certainly a group people that are more interested in the results than actually working on the vehicle. I believe however, the larger group of people who follow the detailing forums actually like touching their vehicles and trying new products. They derive a level of satisfaction working on their vehicles, they like talking about it, they like seeing others results, they like buying tools and products to make their hobby better and they certainly appreciate the fruits of their own labors. For better or worse we`re detailers, some better than others, Pro`s and Hack`s but we touch our cars. That`s the reason the forum exists.

    I suspect at one time you looked at things differently but seriously one can`t help wonder why you continue on with this love/hate relationship? It seems at times to be more hate than love. You use the term Heretic/heresy often but I`ve gotta wonder if the word is at times not synonymous with antagonist when reading some of your posts. This all said, there is nothing wrong with finding ones comfort zone and standing pat. I guess you`ve found something you like and simply choose to use it less often.
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