Removing rust spots (rust blooms)

[togwt]

Definition of Terms used



Decontamination [: the removal of contaminants]



Contaminants [: Imbedded – below surface, usually sequestered metal particulates. Surface- various sources of debris that are on the paint surface]



Iron oxide or more correctly Ferric oxide (Fe2O3) - is an inorganic compound [; Iron (II) oxide, also known as ferrous oxide, is one of the iron oxides. It is a black-colour powder with the chemical formula FeO. It consists of the chemical element iron in the oxidation state of 2 bonded to oxygen. Its mineral form is known as wüstite. Iron (II) oxide should not be confused with rust, which usually consists of hydrated iron (III) oxide (ferric oxide)]. [1]



Rust [: a general term for a series of iron oxides (usually red oxides) formed by the reaction of iron and oxygen in the presence of water or air moisture]



Rust Spots



They are usually caused by metallic brake dust that has penetrated the paint film surface and water / acid rain has produced rust. It can be removed with detailer`s clay, followed with a pre-wax polish/cleaner and a surface protection re-applied.



They should be removed as soon as it’s noticed as it may permeate under the paint surface, causing the paint to `bubble` if this should happen the affected surface should be treated with a suitable rust inhibitor to avoid the rust contaminating other areas



Brake dust or rail dust is very small, almost microscopic particles of steel, iron or their alloys. These particles carry a positive charge (due to friction) while the vehicles they land on are carrying a negative charge. The vehicle surface becomes a magnet, attracting and bonding the ferrous metal particles to the vehicle’s paint surfaces.



The corrosive chemical compounds generated then proceed to etch (corrode) the clear coat, the metallic particles (brake dust) penetrate and act as a conduit spreading the corrosives through the paint film system (and the sheet metal), which results in erosion of the paint surface, that shows on the surface as tiny rust spots (rust blooms)



Although present on all paint surfaces, sintered brake / rail dust is most noticeable on light coloured paint surfaces, especially white. These contaminants are invisible to the naked eye, once they start to oxidise, and turn orange; this is when the problem will be brought to your attention, even on brand new vehicles.



Stages of Corrosive Paint Damage



Stage I- Iron particulates causing surface staining leading to substrate corrosion



Stage II - Contaminants have permeated the paint matrix causing discoloration and corrosion damage



Stage III - Particulates and corrosive compounds causing severe damage to the paints resin (binder) system



Signs of Paint Surface Contamination



• Dark coloured specks

• Brown or Orange (rust) coloured stains or specks

• Yellow stains

• Small metal coloured flecks

• Rough texture

• ‘Water spots’ or marks

• Surface etching

• Oxidation

• Paint ‘stains



In this case, paint care not only serves aesthetics, but also helps preserve the vehicle and its resale value



AQuartz IronXis a neutralised acid salt that offer a safe pH: Neutral 6.5-7.0 chemical alternative to detailer’s clay that removes metallic particulates completely by using an acid salt solution on the paint surface the micro-fissures (‘pores’) are expanded by an exothermic reaction. This releases ferrous particles and caustic compounds that have developed in the paint`s subsurface; the reaction agitates and loosens the particles allowing them to be rinsed away.



This preventative measure puts a stop to corrosion, and contains unique chemical ingredients that effectively dissolves the sintered iron by forming water soluble iron complex. For use on car paint, wheels and glass surfaces (safe for all wheel finishes including painted aluminium and alloys) to remove iron filings and ferrous-based contaminants Automotive paint is porous, by using an acid salt solution on the paint surface the micro-fissures (‘pores’) are expanded by an exothermic reaction.



This releases ferrous particles and caustic compounds that have developed in the paint`s subsurface; the exothermic reaction agitates and loosens the particles allowing them to be rinsed away. Unlike clay that only removes the particulates that protrude from the paint by abrasion



These are one-step, highly effective vehicle paint decontamination, beyond what can be removed by washing or claying, with the cleaning power of an acid with a pH of 7.0, by using a neutralised acid salt, which is safe for use on all automotive surfaces, paint, glass, clear coat, and etc



Neutralization is the reaction between an acid and a base (alkaline) producing a salt and neutralized base; common examples include acetic acid and sulphuric acid.



It contains neutralised acid salts that effectively release the metallic particulates from the surface by dissolve the sintered brake dust particles that are lodged in the paints surface forming a water soluble complex that changes colour (clear to deep red) that can be rinsed away. An exothermic reaction is a chemical reaction that is accompanied by the release of heat i.e. neutralization reactions such as direct reaction of acid and base. Do not allow solution to dry on paint surface.



Ammonium thioglycolate NH4 + HSCH2 COO is its main chemical component; its smell is similar to that used in the formulation of permanent wave lotion. The neutralization reaction of an acid with a base will always produce water and a salt. The carbonic acid formed (H2CO3) undergoes rapid decomposition to water and gaseous carbon dioxide, and so the solution aerates as CO2 gas is released. HCl + NaHCO3 > H2CO3 + NaCl (Salt)

If there is an inordinate amount of surface contamination (tree resin, bitumen or other organic material) wax, or sealants on the vehicle I would recommend you remove them before using IronX to enable the chemicals to work on the ferrous particles without hindrance.



Lightly spray and then spread the product with a sponge, an atomizer type spray bottle is ideal for this process, allow the product to dwell for 5 minutes in the shade.



Using a wet sponge agitate he paint surface and then thoroughly rinse the paint surface



It is really interesting to see the amount of iron particles residue that will be dissolved by Iron X, despite having clayed the car before hand. This product definitely offers advancement in paintwork decontamination. 100-150ml per average sized vehicle



Note: Iron Cut should not be used on compromised chrome or bare metal parts, brake callipers, wheel balancing weights, or SMART paint repairs.



CarPro IronX Soap Gel - pH 6.5-7.0 (a weaker solution than regular IronX, a unique and innovative product that Iron X Soap Gel removes road grime and salt from the paint and leaves it slick and smooth. The soap gel is mainly a maintenance product; that is used when a vehicle needs to be cleaned and shows some rail dust.



This product is basically a fairly thick gel with the ability to remove ferrous iron deposits. It removes what washing and claying can’t. It’s a non-marring alternative to detailing clay that cleans and at the same time removes imbedded iron metal particles, salt and other and contaminates from the paint. This is a highly effective, acid-free and pH corrected (pH 6) paint surface and glass cleaner (safe for all painted surfaces including aluminium and alloys).



Use as a car wash on a regular basis (quarterly or as necessary) on white or light colour paint finishes. Airborne chemical compounds and ferrous particles - particles containing iron - actually penetrate the paint and create corrosive compounds that eat deep into the paint`s sub-layers or paint’s pin-holes. This is a gradual process that often is not evident until it`s too late. Claying or polishing only removes the particulate that is above the surface, not its effects, (corrosion) which are continuing to spread beneath the surface.



During the use of your vehicle, brake dust and road grime become sintered to the surface of the car paint, rims and wheels due to the high temperature conditions they are normally exposed. Brake dust contains high levels of iron and once sintered to the rim, becomes extremely difficult to dissolve or remove without the use of harsh chemicals.



CarPro IronX Soap Gel opens up the paint`s pores by an exothermic process, which releases ferrous particles and to neutralize caustic compounds that have developed in the paint`s subsurface. Ongoing damage is immediately stopped and future damage is prevented by removing the ferrous particles and their potential to act as a conduit for corrosion.



As the cleansing liquid begins to work into the dirt and grime, the formula begins to turn purple/ red.

The purple/red coloration is the Soap Gel forming a bond to the sintered iron on the car paint and wheel and changing its state to a water soluble complex for easy removal. Stubborn, baked on grime may take a small amount of agitation. Rinse car paint and wheels thoroughly with a power washer and wipe dry.



Application:



1. Wash the paint surface with a concentrate

2. Rinse the surface thoroughly with clean water, power wash or hose

3. Pour a few small drops of soap gel onto a wet sponge, and wash the surface.

4. While agitating the surface, the soap gel will start to change colour when it comes into contact with metallic particles

5. Rinse the surface thoroughly with clean water

6. Dry the paint surface



Average consumption per complete car: 0.5 - 1 fluid oz (20 - 30ml) per car



Note: Iron Cut should not be used on

• Compromised chrome (peeling, flaking, etc),

• Unpainted metal parts

• Acrylic painted callipers

• Carbon Ceramic rotors

• SMART paint repairs

• Wheel balancing weights





Relevant Articles



1. “Environmental Damage� - http://www.autopia.org/forum/car-det...l-damage.html#

2. “ValuGard Paint Decontamination System� - http://www.autopia.org/forum/autopia...on-system.html

3. “Nanoskin Surface Prep Towel� - http://www.autopia.org/forum/autopia...rep-towel.html

4. “What will decontamination remove that washing / clay will not? “ - http://www.autopia.org/forum/guide-d...-will-not.html

[Ron Ketcham]

Jon, good information until you get to products to remove the "blooms".

None of these products have the approvals of any vehicle manufacturer or their paint material suppliers.(PPG, DuPont, SherwinWilliams, Spies Hecker, Azko Noble, etc)

"NOT ONE", due to the high potential of long term damage to not only the paint finish, but the exterior trim of vehicles.

To determine if a product, system or process is approved or recommended by a vehicle manufacturer, one need only to look to the Technical Service Bulletins or Advisories, or the factory published service manuals for their vehicles.(like all information, things are superceded as improvements are made and new studies/testing finds improvements, so look for the latest issues)

Ford, Chrysler, Mazda, Hyundai, Kia, Nissan, Infiniti, are examples of manufacturers who have issued such publications regarding correct repair or removal of iron oxides, acid rain neutralization, acid etching, etc.

They require or recommend the ValuGard ABC system and have since the late 90`s.

Ford has even had the system private labeled under their MotorCraft product line and put it`s required usage into all models "shop manuals" issued to each dealership`s repair shop.

My point being this--

"While some may feel that they have a better or such method or product for such concerns, are they really more informed and aware of the concern`s repair than a few hundred automotive engineers, paint supplier engineers and chemists regarding these repairs?"

"Are they smarter than the very companies which produce and warranty the vehicles and their paint suppliers chemists?"

What I observe happening when some jump on a "cheap and easy" product`s band wagon is similar to making the decision to replace one`s SAE 5/40 motor oil with cooking oil due to "I read it or my buddy said" sort of thing.

Engineers don`t make stuff up, they test and test, to failure, before moving to a decision.

Grumpy

[togwt]

Very few detailing chemicals seek prior approval of a vehicle mfg. unless they are supplying direct to an OEM. But I can state that a neutralized acid will not harm paint short or long term

[Accumulator]

Somewhat echoing what Ron posted, I am also a big proponent of the ValuGard "B" product. If it`s not potent enough for a user`s liking one can mechanically agitate the surface being treated with either detailing clay or the ValuGard Bug Pad, which is more gentle on paint than I had expected.



While I appreciate the idea of a color-indicator, my limited experience with the IronX Wash Gel has been somewhat unsatisfactory. I could never get the product to *not* change color, even with repeated applications, and it did not seem to be as potent as the "B". As I understand it, their other product is more potent than the Wash Gel.





Another product that might be of interest is FinishKare`s Step 2 Steel Iron Rust Remover ("SIRR"), which I have yet to try. I hear that their admonition to "use with care, only as directed!" should be taken seriously lest it do some damage.

[Ron Ketcham]

George, don`t ever just use the "B" product for iron oxide deposits.

Reason is simple, as Jon points out, and the vehicle manufacturers and their paint supplier know--the oxides produce acids as they "bloom" and "grow downwards" into the paint film.

These acids must be neutralized and removed or there is the real possibility of future reactivating of them when subjected to water and heat, which of course, then "eats the resin system (film former-binder) of the paint film.

All of this is why ValuGard produces a "system", which requires a "process" for the ABC system.

I am aware you are not a fan of the "C"-Detail Wash, however it is a true "shampoo" and is totally neutral, with lubrication in the product, formulated to complete the total neutralization of the paint film, including the alkaline properties of the "A" and the acidic properties of the "B".

Just a little more "insight" for you regarding the "ABC" system.

Grumpy

[JonFD]

I get those orange rust blooms ALOT here in Chicago. Heavy duty clay takes care of them pretty well. A little more time consuming, but it works.

[togwt]

I get those orange rust blooms ALOT here in Chicago. Heavy duty clay takes care of them pretty well. A little more time consuming, but it works.

Detailer’s clay was originally formulated to remove paint overspray; it is also useful for removing surface contaminants that have bonded to the paint. It gained its reputation as a decontamination method because it was mistakenly believed that it ‘pulled’ brake / rail dust iron particulates from the paint surface. Detailer’s clay contains abrasives that will only shear any brake dust particles leaving what is below the paint surface to remain. Once water and heat (reactivity) is added the corrosion process is started.





See article http://www.autopia.org/forum/autopia...on-system.html

[Wheelzntoys]

I was surprised to see 3D Fallout Remover at the local store, would this help with rust spots since it contains oxalic acid?

[Accumulator]

George, don`t ever just use the "B" product for iron oxide deposits.

Reason is..These acids must be neutralized and removed..All of this is why ValuGard produces a "system", which requires a "process" for the ABC system.

I am aware you are not a fan of the "C"-Detail Wash, however it is a true "shampoo" and is totally neutral, with lubrication in the product, formulated to complete the total neutralization of the paint film, including the alkaline properties of the "A" and the acidic properties of the "B"...

Hey, I`d missed that post!



I *always* precede "B" with "A" (well, OK...sometimes I use FK1119 instead, never had a problem though), and I always follow "B" with a wash, sometimes a slightly alkaline one. I just seldom use "C". Last time, I used Meg`s M62 (note that I should`ve tested it`s ph, but no, I didn`t ).



Q- if "C" is ph-neutral, how can it truly *neutralize* the acids in "B"? I`d think that to affect that you`d have to use something that`s slightly alkaline.

[Ron Ketcham]

The "A", being formulated as it is, "enters" the paint, neutralizing the acids that have entered the paint film.

This causes the paint film to slight swell, as it works, but does not negatively affect the resin system or the pigments below the clearcoat nor the UV blockers, etc.

The "B" has two jobs, one to disolve or loosen the iron oxide particles, and the second is to replace the plastizers that the "A" naturally removes due to it`s alkalinity. The plastizers are part of what creates gloss, elasticity etc of the clear. They must be replaced or renewed. (ever notice how the paint just shines where it is not heavily marred when you rinse off the "B"? That`s the plastizers at work)

The paint system has been subjected to both a alkaline and an acidic products.

The "C" is truly neutral, using coconut diamide for the shampoo part and since the paint is still "slightly" open, it enters the paint film to neutralize what every alkaline or acidic chemicals may still be down there.

Depending on the clear/base on the vehicle, it may take up to an hour for the paint film to level back out as the final evaporation of the water leaves the paint film.

Remeber, as I have presented before, based upon the studies of PPG, DuPont, BASF and Sherwin Williams, the average vehicle`s paint system will absorb up to a pint of water into the substrate when subjected to rain or a car wash.

Which is why wax and sealants that are strongly crosslinked are important in the true protection of the paint system. Beading does NOTHING.

Grumpy

[Accumulator]

Ron Ketcham- Thanks for the added info. Since the decon. kit is fairly priced with all three components, guess I have no reason *not* to just use `em all as directed.



I take it that using "A" by itself, as a "super shampoo" would be a bad idea do to the removal of plastizers, right? What about using FK1119 that way? (Asking since you have inside experience with both lines...)



Oh, good point about the plastizers and gloss- "ABC"ing the Crown Vics did wonders for them even before I started the correction, kinda surprised me actually as they just responded better than any other vehicles I`ve ABCed.

[Ron Ketcham]

FK1119 is just some degreaser in a mix of keosene, not the same as the A.

Just doing the "A" will make the paint appear "flat" due to the plastizer issue, plus it removes any wax, most sealants, etc, so a good safe stripper even if no iron oxides there, it does "deep clean" the pores before buffing.

The "C" Detail Wash is a true shampoo, years ago my daughter in law used it to keep the curls out of my grandaughters kinky, curly hair, left it clean and shiney.

Just got a mail from Beth.

ValuGard is extending the 10% off through the end of June.

Use code T10K to get the discount on all products, not just the ABC System.

Grumpy

[Accumulator]

FK1119 is just some degreaser in a mix of keosene, not the same as the A...

OK, and I knew that it wasn`t your favorite product Did work incredibly well for me on a few trashed beater cars though.

Just doing the "A" will make the paint appear "flat" due to the plastizer issue, plus it removes any wax, most sealants, etc, so a good safe stripper even if no iron oxides there, it does "deep clean" the pores before buffing...

Put a fine point on this one if you don`t mind- Is "A" safe to use, by itself, as a "super shampoo" for heavy-duty cleaning and existing-product stripping?

The "C" Detail Wash is a true shampoo, years ago my daughter in law used it to keep the curls out of my grandaughters kinky, curly hair, left it clean and shiney.

Yeah, I`ve shampooed the Beaucerons with my Griot`s Car Wash, no problems. Good "shampoos" are nice and mild whatever you`re using `em on.



Oh, and I hope that discount is getting AI/VG some business. It`d be nice if their retail end got more widely known.





Oh#3, Beth really is great at the customer interaction thing, right person for that job all right!

Oh#2, that somewhat pricey interior brush you suggested I buy really *is* nice!

[Ron Ketcham]

The "A" strips off lots of things, and yes, you could use it for that.

Grumpy

[Accumulator]

Ron Ketcham- OK, thanks. I didn`t want to keep doing something ill-advised just because it hadn`t bitten me before, never know when one`s luck might run out