Long Throw DA polishers?

[TheSopranos16]

Anyone ever hear of this? I found this information from the CMA website...

BMW and Mercedes-Benz use both dual-action and circular machine polishers on their assembly lines for polishing and defect removal. The trend is moving away from circular polishers toward a new generation of long-throw, dual-action, machines. This is also happening in the U.S. but these new, dual-action machines are totally different from the Porter Cable 7424 that most enthusiasts use. Professional dual-action machines (made by Dynabrade and Festool) have a "throw" of up to 1/2 inch as compared to the "wiggle" of the 7424 polisher. These new machines offer 95% of the defect removal of circular polishers without creating any swirls in the finish. Remember, these are professional machines being used by professional paint technicians on paint right out of the oven.

Anyone ever hear about or use these professional long throw dual action machines? Sounds like a terrific idea, that is, to have the throw of the machine be longer to increase the work it does.

[usdm]

I`ve been giving this a lot of thought as well Maybe it`s time to contact
CMA and see what they`re talking about...

[cwcad]

just a thought here... does a longer throw mean more vibration.? maybe they counteract this with a bigger counter weight.?? is the machine heavier.?? does the longer throw make the polisher wear more or break down sooner.??? my pd vibrates just right and takes a licking and keeps on ticking. it sure has been a consistent preformer. i sure would be interested in finding out more. !!!!

[TheSopranos16]

I believe that by longer throw they mean that each time it vibrates, it moves the pad a greater distance. So instead of vibrating 1/8th of an inch (idk if thats the right number, just hypothetically) with a PC it vibrates 1/2 of an inch, which would do much more work on the paint. Sounds like a great idea, I`d like to get some more information on it...

[brwill2004]

With a rotary polisher, the cut is produced by the heat that the polisher pad creates traveling over the same spot over and over. An orbital reduces the heat and the cut because it oscillates as opposed to rotates. The pad never really goes over the same spot twice. I am not sure how these long throw orbitals create more cut. I use a cyclo, and I am not sure how much more cut can be obtained from an orbital polisher. If more cut is desired, a rotary will provide it.

[TheSopranos16]

Here is one of the buffers that I belive the quote from CMA refers too...
http://www.dynabrade.com/cgi-bin/Aut...0?E2254Mug;;20

Only bad thing is that it doesn`t use electric power. So you have to get a seperate air compressor, which is a PITA.

I believe that these polishers create more cut because they move a greater distance. Just for arguments sake, lets say the PC moves the pad 3/32" and you have it set to 2000 RPM. That means that in 1 minutes of operation, the pad moved a total distance of 187.5 inches. If you increase the throw (or orbit diameter) to 5/8" (which is the orbit diameter of the Dynabuffer) then the total distance increase to 1250 inches. Thats over 6 times as much distance. So, all of that extra "rubbing" of the surface equates to more friction, more cut and thus more work. Its probably still not as effective as a rotary, but I think the idea is that its much better than a PC, and has much less risk than a rotary.

That is my understanding of how these long throw machines improve upon the PC. Everything I just said is theoretical and I really don`t have experience with these polishers. Thats why I`m posting this thread, to find out more

[brwill2004]

I definitely see your point, however, I am not sure if that equates to more shine or more defect removal. I think speed also comes into play. I would think that the higher the OPMs, the more cut can be produced. I also wonder if two heads (cyclo), or more polisher head surface area (Gem)could also produce more polishing action with each oscillation. I will try and ask my pops, he is an engineer by trade.

[usdm]

I had a chance to talk to the folks at Festool USA. As i understand it,
the models in question are also air-driven units. Also Festool USA is
still trying to gain a good foothold on the US woodwoking market, so
they don`t have a real grasp on what is going on in the automotive
scene yet. Even with what they had on hand, they could not
give me a real feel for what would be worth investing in.

Ironically, Festool does offer some machines that have peaked my
interest, and they`re available through (among all places) the Surbuf guys:
http://www.surbuf.com/Festool_Products.htm

Outside of the long throw, what appeals to me is the ability to
vary the opms from as low as 4k opms, to a max 13k opm (depending
on the model you get). They`re not cheap, but they might be the next
purchase for down the road. I like my Makita, but it can only do so
much, and there are times when I really don`t want to pull out
the big gun rotary to do polishing work.

The only thing i wonder about is how well will buffing pads like we
currently use will stand up to something that can whip around at
13k opms.

[jason(england)]

Hiya
Just read your threads ,these are basicly da sanders as used in body shops for as long as I can remember.
Its a da sander with polishing capabilities there an air tool I dont think you will find an electric model .
To use there quite freindly not too much vibration.
Hope this helps.
Jason :tounge