Multiple coats of VMW - a waste of time?

[AndyC]

Exactly as it asks. I`ve now got the paint on my garage queen almost to a point I`m happy with and decided to try multiple coats of VMW.



I`ve done 2 so far - easy as anything using the PC at around #4 (takes about 5 minutes to apply and 5 to buff off) and a relaxing way to end a detailing session IMO.



My question is though am I wasting my time? The shine does appear to be getting glossier and deeper and wetter so I guess that might answer my question!



Anyone else done this and what do you think?

[togwt]

~ One man’s opinion / observations ~



Layering:

By applying more products on top of one that has already cross-linked you can increase its density (up to a point) The thin film of product that`s applied isn`t really another layer.



Each subsequent applications adherence process is that the solvents work their way into the microscopic gaps and valleys of the previous `layer` thereby creating an anchor, and by surface tension, when the paint film surface is level there is little benefit to adding more.



A level paint film surface improves the paint film surface`s desired optical properties (i.e. surface reflectance, clarity, gloss, and depth of shine)



The purpose of applying a protective coating to automotive finishes is to act as a sacrificial barrier against industrial fallout (including acid rain) pollution, dust, dirt and road grime as well as bird excrement, then you can reapply another coating to replenish the wax that has eroded away.







~ Hope this helps ~



Knowledge unshared is experience wasted

justadumbarchitect / so I question everything/ Jon

[AndyC]

WOW - kinda scientific but extremely helpful indeed! This was what I was thinking, albeit in a more basic way, in that a single layer, no matter how carefully applied, would likely have "gaps" and that a second or even third layer would fill these in, thus producing a more smooth, even result and as a result an improved appearance.

[Scottwax]

Vanilla Moose won`t layer because it is a polish (that contains wax), but it will finely polish the paint each time. The improvement you are likely seeing is because the paint is at a higher polished state after each application.

[AndyC]

Thanks Scott I`d figured that actual layering wasn`t possible with VMW in the same way as a synthetic sealant etc.



Truth be told, the improvement with each application isn`t breathtaking as such, just a slightly improved depth of shine & more gloss/wetness. I`ve decided to stop at 3 coats as I reckon it`ll be a cse of dimishing returns after that and a waste of time and product.



Love the Speed Glaze though - used that before the VMW. Did a quick application of DACP, then Speed Glaze than VMW and very pleased with the results.



Pictures will follow as soon as my new digital software loaded onto my laptop.

[lbls1]

Look into getting a pure carnauba wax if you want to layer. I would not in any case put too many layers on at one time. The reason for this is because more than three layers put on at one time is very difficult to settle right, and it will not last as long as a single coat of wax that has been stretched right and given time to dry.



I like to start with the clean and polish process at the beginning of my wax season, and start off with two coats of wax. I follow throughout the season with separate sessions of a coat of wax (two coats if I`m in the moment), all the while keeping the car as dry as possible and giving a good time for the wax coatings to settle and cure.



So far I have been happy with the results, and my carnauba wax resolution has hung in there much longer than many people otherwise would think a carnauba would last. You`d be surprised in how far just a little will actually go.....

[Accumulator]

FWIW, I tried multiple applications of VM (by PC) on my Jag`s very soft ss lacquer. It was previously polished with numerous products and all oxidation/"dead paint" had been removed.



The first application of VM resulted in a fair amount of paint transfer to the pad and to the MFs that I used to remove the VM. Each subsequent application resulted in noticeably *less* transfer. As I proceeded, I tried to be less aggressive each time, using less pressure on the PC, for instance. The finish looked *a little* better each time, and by the last application I was not getting any discernable transfer. It *seemed* that after the first few applications I was only polishing the (previously applied) VM as opposed to polishing the paint.

[imported_pugoman]

So we`re close to seeing some pics at last then Andy? ;)



I`ve been waiting months for this moment! :D

[lpquick]

The Chemist, said something about anything after the second layer is a waste. Seems right to me. Once you have a good foundation (2 layers) what can the product do to attach itself, you most likely end up just removing the layer you applied while buffing it out! Correct me if you think this thinking is wrong.

[Scottwax]

Originally posted by lpquick

The Chemist, said something about anything after the second layer is a waste. Seems right to me. Once you have a good foundation (2 layers) what can the product do to attach itself, you most likely end up just removing the layer you applied while buffing it out! Correct me if you think this thinking is wrong.



This is a little different since VM has cleaners in it and will remove the previous layer. What additional applications of VM will do is continue to finely polish the paint. I would think though, once you have gone over the paint 3-4 times you would get to a point where additional applications won`t improve the paint.



I do agree that with last step products, 2 layers is sufficient.

[ALAN81]

I believe once you have 2 coats of wax on your car any additional wax is a waste of time

[lbls1]

I am not sure whether that fact would apply to pure carnauba wax, but I am open into seeing a study of wax adherence.



There are visible resolution differences between 2, 5, 9, and 12+ coats of a pure wax (It is important, though, that these coatings go on clean paint, and that the previous coatings have been thoroughly buffed prior to adding more wax. It doesn`t hurt to have a little time between the coatings as well......a week or two).

Whether this observation is due to an occurence other than layering will have to be revealed in a study. It should not be, however, due to polishing, or else that would mean that a "pure wax" is not really pure, but containing a cleaning agent.



There are quite a few pure waxes out there, but I have had good results from the proven brands like Mothers, Meguiars and Zai...oops I mean Zymol!!! Just had to throw that little kicker in!:p :up

[lpquick]

Let me redefine my thought, I`m saying that after a base is laid down, all the pours and micro cracks filled in, you have reached a depth level of say 10k, adding more layers may refinish the surface giving different visibilities but your depth if you could accurately measure it, wouldn`t change. Am I making myself better understood? Gives good food for thought!

[imported_NHBFAN]

Originally posted by lbls1

There are quite a few pure waxes out there, but I have had good results from the proven brands like Mothers, Meguiars and Zai...oops I mean Zymol!!!



Ha! Ha!:lol :rofl :lol



Good one:xyxthumbs

[Mr. Chemist]

What Alan81 and Scottwax said......applied properly to a well polished surface, two coats is visually sufficient and 3 just might make you feel better....