Still unhappy with Zaino durability!!!

[66#1]

In May of 2002, I began using Zaino on my `95 Firebird Formula. I switched from Meguiar`s Gold Class. This was my first experience with a higher end detailing product. My main reason for switching was the product`s claimed durability.



I was a little disappointed in the shine at first, but that got better. I loved how the water beaded up, and it did last great. However, my Formula is garaged and not driven in the rain. The few times I`ve been caught in the rain, the road film has seemed to really cut through the Zaino. Last year, we had an extremely heavy rain, and rain blew in on the back of the car. The car did not bead water on the back, and it was not even all the way out in the weather.



Last year, I switched to Zaino on my wife`s `90 Sunbird. It sits outside all the time, and I felt the paint was still in pretty decent condition even for it`s age. After the first rain, there was very,very little water beading. It`s still like that to this day! I followed the Zaino instructions to a "t" for application. I`ve used Z1 and ZFX even, and I still get the same results.



Last July, my wife and I purchased a 2000 Grand Prix GTP in excellent shape. After a month, I applied Zaino. I did 2 coats of ZFX/Z5, then 3 coats of ZFX/Z2 2 weeks later. After the first application, the water beaded beautifully even after some pretty hard rains. About a month after the 2nd application, I did a quick coat of Z2 before we left on a trip. I noticed the water wasn`t beading very good for some reason, especially on the top surfaces. The next time I washed the car, it didn`t bead well at all! I went for 3 coats of ZFX/Z2 a month later, and there was little or no beading before and after.



Since then, I have applied just a regular coat of Z5 or Z2 about every 3 or 4 weeks. I finally decided to strip the Zaino off and try again. I used a 50/50 mix of alcohol/water, and I also clay and dawn washed. Just as an experiment, I used Scratch-X as a polish mainly due to David B`s Zaino article. I also had the Scratch-X on hand, Plus, things had been slow at work and I didn`t want to spend any more than necessary. The Scratch-X and the clay job left the paint feeling very smooth and shiny as well. I applied 2 coats of ZFX/Z5. I would`ve gone for 3 coats, but I ran out of time. The car absolutely gleamed! I was tickled to death. This was about 3 weeks ago. We have had few rainy days, and I have been too busy to wash the car since then. The car has been driven very little in the rain. SInce my wife and I work different schedules, I have been unable to observe the beading action until today.



Needless to say, I`m not happy!! We`ve had some hard rains, but I would say less than 2 inches. I`m still not getting any beading on the top surfaces!! The sides bead incredible until you drive in the rain. You can see right where the road film cuts through the Zaino. Dust and rain cut right through the Zaino. I put product on every 2 to 3 weeks, but that`s not the point. There`s not anybody around here who works harder on making their cars look good. I get tired of my cars looking like they need to be polished/waxed. It`s really hard to swallow when you see the durability claims of other Zaino users!! This is supposed to be some of the most durable stuff around, and it won`t last past the first hard rain? A little dust and a little rain cuts right through it??



I have always followed the Zaino prep instructions to a "t." The Scratch-X deal was just an experiment, but I really thought it was going to work this time. What`s the deal?? My vehicles look incredible with the Z, but this durabilty issue has me about ready to say :wavey



Plus, I have emailed Sal and every other email address on the Z site several times and I have gotten no response!! :down



Here`s some photos that show the "beading.":



http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?p=999&gid=3665668&uid=158118&members=1



The last three photos were taken today. The others were taken a couple of months after I started using Zaino with about 10 coats.



Sorry for the post length! I just wanted to thoroughly describe my situation.

[imported_Yosemite Dan]

Since Zaino has a shelf life of 3 to 5 years from what I`ve read it`s possible that maybe they sent you an old batch or maybe just a bad batch. If the Zaino is not stored in a cool dry place that may also lead to problems.



Since they`re not responding to your queries I would say "screw`em" and go straight to Klasse.

[dternst]

You don`t mention in your post what products were used to prep your automobile`s surface prior to applying Zaino. Most polishes contain oils that need to be removed for Z2 and Z5 to properly adhere to the surface.



Wash with Z7 to remove the oils and then apply your Z5 and Z2.



David

[MattZ28]

If Sal hasn`t responded within 2-3 days, there must be something going on with the e-mails not going through or something, because usually he responds fairly quickly. Try calling....you can talk to him directly on the phone.

[66#1]

Originally posted by Yosemite Dan

Since Zaino has a shelf life of 3 to 5 years from what I`ve read it`s possible that maybe they sent you an old batch or maybe just a bad batch. If the Zaino is not stored in a cool dry place that may also lead to problems.



Since they`re not responding to your queries I would say "screw`em" and go straight to Klasse.



All the Zaino I`ve used is no more than 1.5 years old. It`s kept inside my house @ 78 degrees or so. As a matter of fact, the first Zaino that worked so good on my GTP was the oldest stuff.



As for the queries, I haven`t tried again in several months. I might try again, but I tried the same email 4 or 5 times before.






You don`t mention in your post what products were used to prep your automobile`s surface prior to applying Zaino. Most polishes contain oils that need to be removed for Z2 and Z5 to properly adhere to the surface.



Wash with Z7 to remove the oils and then apply your Z5 and Z2.



I did not use a polish prior to Zaino. The Zaino instructions say to dawn wash and clay, then dawn again. That`s what I`ve always done for the initial prep. They never said anything about polishing! The last time I zaino`d my GTP, I did strip the Zaino with water/alcohol, then I dawned and clayed and dawn washed again. Then I used the Scratch-X, then I Dawn washed again. Again, Sal says to use Dawn. I don`t want to get the Dawn debate raging again, but that`s what it says to do. I do use the Z7 wash, but never to strip oils as you mentioned.



I worked my butt off polishing with the Scratch-X. I was really ticked when it didn`t work. I might try a stronger polish, but if that doesn`t work I`ll really get angry!

[Scottwax]

Do you ever park under trees when it is raining? I have two coats of Poorboy`s EX-P Sealant on my car and we`ve had some torrential rains here in Dallas the past week (more than 5" since June 1st) and when it was raining on Wednesday, I parked my car with about half of it under a tree. The front of my car was not under the tree and it was beading like crazy, however the back end of my car was under the tree and was not beading at all. Once I moved my car and it rained some more, whatever was washing out of the tree and on to my car was rinsed off and the back end was beading again, although not quite as sharply as the rest of my car.



Just a thought. :nixweiss

[dternst]

You may have misinterpreted the instructions. Try this process, prior to giving up on Zaino totally. You may be using Dawn way to much. Dawn should only be used the first time you use Zaino. After the first application you can immediately start with Z6.



Dawn

Claybar

Z7

Polish

Z7

Z5/ZFX (The number of layers is up to you, always follow with Z6)

Z6

Z2/ZFX (The number of layers is up to you, always follow with Z6)

Z6



You may be using Dawn way to much. Dawn should only be used the first time you use Zaino. After the first application you can immediately start with Z6.

[66#1]

Originally posted by dternst

You may have misinterpreted the instructions. Try this process, prior to giving up on Zaino totally. You may be using Dawn way to much. Dawn should only be used the first time you use Zaino. After the first application you can immediately start with Z6.



Dawn

Claybar

Z7

Polish

Z7

Z5/ZFX (The number of layers is up to you, always follow with Z6)

Z6

Z2/ZFX (The number of layers is up to you, always follow with Z6)

Z6



You may be using Dawn way to much. Dawn should only be used the first time you use Zaino. After the first application you can immediately start with Z6.



I`ve only used Dawn on the initial application of Zaino, and after I stripped and started over. I wouldn`t think of using it other than that. I always use Z7 and Z6 too.




Do you ever park under trees when it is raining?

We had two small trees at our house that just got blown over. However, they weren`t tall enough to park under, and the car was never parked by them either. There is a pine tree we have to park close to at my grandparent`s. This is the only time the car is parked close to trees in the rain.



A Z7 wash helps the beading a little, but not much.

[imported_Yosemite Dan]

The only other possible thing that could help is if you have a friend who uses and swears by Zaino and compare methods. If not then like you said it`s time to say :wavey to Zaino.

[imported_Aurora40]

Originally posted by 66#1

Needless to say, I`m not happy!! We`ve had some hard rains, but I would say less than 2 inches. I`m still not getting any beading on the top surfaces!! The sides bead incredible until you drive in the rain. You can see right where the road film cuts through the Zaino. Dust and rain cut right through the Zaino.



Film on the car will temporarily prevent the beading of most any protectant. This is because the top surface is no longer the protectant, but rather the film. A wash should bring the beading back. If you want to rule out the Z7 adding some temporary thing behind that helps the beading, try using a car wash that does not add any gloss, like #00. If the beading returns, it was just the road film on the car that was masking the beading.



This is just one little note, though. You see the car in the rain, I don`t. But it`s something you might consider. However, if a product is not cutting it for you, then you should start shopping around to find something that you like better. If you want extreme beading, then you might consider a carnauba product. :)

[Matt M, PA]

Sorry to hear about your problem. I get very good durability with Zaino on my vehicles.



It`s true that beading will be severely cut down if the surface is dirty. It all is about surface tension, and it the surface is dirty, it won`t bead well.



My Bronco stays outside 24-7 and it beads very well for weeks and weeks. It may not bead well covered with pollen for example, but after wash...it`s back.



I always use ZFX and find that this helps greatly in durability.



A friend of mine complained once about Zaino durability, and I watched his technique. He spreaded his Zaino on very lightly, and spent very little time. I rub mine on thoroughly to ensure a good bond.



Hope this helps, and good luck.



One more thing...if your e-mail are not being answered, (which really surprised me) they`re are probably not being received. I would call the phone number on the website...Sal`s always glad to help out.

[66#1]

I still get beading, but it`s the "fat" odd-shaped beads, The Z7 wash does help a little, but I can still tell the beading has been diminished.



It seems everybody else gets the tight beads like I feel a freshly polished/waxed surface should. It doesn`t matter if I use ZFZX or not either. I`ve tried putting thicker coats on.



I`ve Zainod in the sun and shade and it makes no difference. I just can`t get this stuff to work right. I`ll try contacting Sal again. I contacted him before about this problem with my other vehicles and he did get right back, but I got no response the last time. He`s just going to tell me it`s something I`m doing.



Did anyone look at my pictures??

[adjulian]

What exactly are your expectations of this product? Is it for water to continually bead or something else. Durability seems to be very subjective and open to interpretation. I have used Z for several years along with a number of individuals around here as with documented results and durability. I say if you feel as if you`ve given it a fair chance and it hasn`t delivered on your expectations - move on, try something else and compare. Let us know what happens.

[Corey Bit Spank]

Blackfire? May be difficult to work with (but it`s my understanding that neither Klasse or Zaino are 100% user friendly), you get a good look, you get tight beads, you get very good durability. :)

[Mizzuri]

I have, as well as many others, that the key to Zaino is a few factors.



1) Claying the vehicle prior to any prep polishing

2) Using Polishes that do not have any filling properties. ScratchX does have filling properties. Menzerna does work great with Zaino.

3) Bonding issues. AIO prior to Zaino application has worked 100% of the time for both mine and customers vehicles. This also means that you dont have to dawn wash the vehicle.

4) layer thickness during application.





I have successfully had Zaino (6x Z2 w/ZFX) for 6plus months , with the car outside 24/7.



I havent been able find anything that matches the durability.



Good luck

Tony.