rotary buffer and overlapping passes

[chip douglas]

What happens if one doesn`t overlap each pass by 50% using a rotary buffer ? Does it create holograms ? What would be the proper way to avoid holograms ?

Thank you

[kartoon]

Overlapping allows you to really work the product and the surface. By not doing it you are not getting the results you could/should.

Holograms usually come from improper technique or from very aggressive pad/compound.

[chip douglas]

When you say technique, what would you consider a bad technique ? I ask this because I use Meg`s finishing pad + 3M`s 5937 PI III MG, which is a swirl marks remover and therefore very soft, and I get lots of holograms with that combo. I,ve treid pretty much everything but it doesnt work that much. My car is a metallic clear coated paint.

Any help would be appreciated, really :(

[Boss_429]

Chip,

Yes, you should overlap your strokes slightly to insure the product and area is worked properly. The overlapping shouldn`t be causing the swirls unless you are overlapping when the product has been completely broken down (dry pad).

Usually, buffer swirls are caused by any one of several reason...........

Not priming/feeding the pad properly.
Incorrect buffer speed.
Working the product too far (dry pad).
Not working the product far enough (abrasives haven`t had a chance to break all the way down).
With a foam pad, tilting the pad at an angle can cause swirls/holograms.

I would suspect that you are working the product too far, or you are tilting the pad.

Is the pad "hopping" on you?

[chip douglas]

Nope, I never get the buffer hops, luckily :)

Imagine I used Meg`s polishing pad (6.5 inches) and 3M`s MG 5937, and I get holograms. I always prime the pad prior to starting any buffing job. I keep the pad flat to the surface as humanly possible, and still I get holograms.

I`m starting to wonder if it is possible to get a swirls/hologram free finish using the rotary buffer alone ? By the way I spay the pad/prime with quick detailer beofre I start buffing, but then I seldom spray the pad, as it gets evenly covered with polish/compound.

I work the product, until the paint shines, then I stop, but even then I get holograms.

[Boss_429]

Chip,

Well, I don`t know what to tell you? :( I think you may be working the product a bit too far? Try slowing down the buffer speed, and not working the product until it is completely gone/dry (leave a "wet edge").

I can tell you that it is possible to get a swirl free/hologram free finish using a rotary. There was a time when all we had were rotary buffers and various ply and types of wool pads to get the job done. (No PC`s or foam pads :D )

I will also tell you that some products do tend to leave some hazing, and require a less abrasive product to be used afterwards to remove the hazing.

Hope this helps.

[chip douglas]

Thanks I`ll leave a wet edge as you recommend :)

Also, would you say 3M PI III MG is one that shouldnt leave marks ? I guess it shouldn`t as it is a swirl remover.

Thanks for your help.:)

[Bill D]

Shouldn`t leave marks Chip. Would you be willing to experiment with some other polishes? Menzerna is supposed to be marvelous with the rotary: quick and beautiful shine :bigups

[chip douglas]

I`d definately be willling to try some other polishes, but I`d have to order it online though, cause locally I can`t find it anywhere......I also have lots of Meg`s products ; 83,82 20, 26 etc..

[kartoon]

It`s definately possible to create a hologram-free finish with a rotary.
Make sure you clean the pad (preferrably with a brush of some sort) to remove any gunk that maybe accumulating while you buff.

[stainbuster]

:yeah

Rotary buffer will induce swirls, but they will also take them out.

It is not only possible to produce a swirl-free finish with a rotary, but for many pros it is the Modus Operandi. But it takes practice, skill, and patience (it ain`t gonna happen in one-step)

Question: If one is correcting paint defects using a rotary, and after the first step, there are swirls present, how does one REMOVE the swirls without using the rotary?:dunno

[Bill D]

Even some of the best in the business have spoken about following up with a dual action polisher

[chip douglas]

I think I may have found what I was doing wrong, although not still sure, as the sky was overcast this afternoon.

I think I was not moving the buffer fast enough over the paint surface, and that way it sorta *marked* the finish more. Hopefully, it is that.

[Bill D]

Chip, when I practice I probably do the same too since it has been drilled into me not to move the rotary too fast, as a result I probably go the other way in extreme, too slow, luckily an error easily corrected

[chip douglas]

Bill,

I`ll try it slower and report my results here :)