Oil Additive Treatments? Any Good?

[Spilchy]

Anyone use an oil additive like Slick 50 or ProLong or any other additive?



I have a 96 Civic with only 30,000 miles on it (just had a major tune up). It`s my mint condition grocery getter whose oil I change every 3 months regardless of miles.



It only goes maybe 5 miles a day.



However, I am going to be driving it 37 miles a day (75% highway). It has never had this sustained "wear and tear" on it. I am dropping it off tomorrow for a new timing belt (it`s been 8 years), alignment and brake check.



Will an additive help any? If so, which one? Do you recommend the engine flush treatment plus an additive? Or the engine flush plus a synthetic? If I use a synthetic can I go back to conventional?



I need to keep this car a long time and want to treat it as best as possible.



Also (it`s a wimpy DX model) I have been putting Premium gas in it. From the reading I have doen here, it sounds like I am doing more harm. Is this true? I have used the same Shell Premium gas for years - I do not differ. Honds recoomends like 86 octane but I don`t do that. The extra $1 per fill up doesn`t bother me.



I`m sure there is a lot of debate on the subject so I`m ready for the differing opinions.



Thanks for your help!

[thinksnow]

As far as fuel is concerned--check the owner`s manual and it will probably recommend 87 or 89. Any more and you will be reducing mileage but probably not harming your engine. If the reduced mileage is worth the placebo effect, than it may be worth the extra George Washington. If you are concerned about gas QUALITY, I would recommend (along with others) using Texaco or Chevron gas. Check out BG 44k as a real fuel additive to run through your fuel system every other oil change.



My aged Accord gets nothing but 5-30 Amsoil. She has gotten it from day one (mile 40K) and without a second identical model running dino, I can`t say that the syn oil has given me any advantages. I like running syns in the winter and from what I have always read, the syn oils should be followed by syn oils. Thus, syns in the summer.



Oil additives--teflon additives supposedly doing "good" may clog up oil filter causing engine to work harder. Plus, in the words of a past poster, "the oil companies spend tens of millions of dollars to develop the most effective oils possible--why do chemistry in your garage?"



The grocery getting has been harder on your car than all the highway miles you will ever put on it. Don`t sweat the long stuff...

[Scottwax]

I use premium in my Accord, but I`ve also advanced the initial timing enough that it pings on regular or plus. I don`t get tons of additional power from advancing the timing, but throttle response and off the line is a bit better. My car is pre-OBD so it seems to respond better to mods. Using premium has not adversely affected my mileage. My car is rated at 20/28 and I get 23/31 (and that 31 mpg is at 75-80 mph with the a/c on).



I wouldn`t bother with additives but I would get the fuel system and upper end of the engine serviced. A clean throttle body, injectors and valves can make a noticable improvement on a high mileage car.

[LouisanaJeeper]

Use the lowest octane necessary to stop pinging.



Most of those addative are SNAKE OIL.



You will do more good by simply using high quality oil and filter frequently. (purolator pureone filter are as good as Mobil 1 filters and are pretty cheap) You can switch back and forth between synthetic and dino oil, it wont hurt anything. An occasional spark-plug replacement will help too.



The only addative I do use and recommend is the fuel system cleaners. The only two I have found to be effective is Redline or Chevron Techron cleaner. I usuall change the $5 fuel filter on my junk too after this.



Basically, keep on top of your fluid maintenance and avoid these addatives all together.



Finally, whatever you do DO NOT get the pressurized engine flush from jiffy lube. I have personally met 2 people who got this done (with a healthy engine before the flush) and ended up with more problems a few miles later.

[Scottwax]

Originally posted by LouisanaJeeper

Finally, whatever you do DO NOT get the pressurized engine flush from jiffy lube. I have personally met 2 people who got this done (with a healthy engine before the flush) and ended up with more problems a few miles later.



The upper end/fuel system cleaning that was done on my car was a `drip` into a vacuum line with the engine running for about 15 minutes. My car ran noticably better immediately. I`m guessing it isn`t exactly the same method as Jiffy Lube`s.

[andriver]

I agree with Louisiana Jeeper about Pureone Filters and Redline fuel additive.

[LouisanaJeeper]

I think the one you used, taps into the intake manifold and fills the air in there with a cleaner to remove carbon and stuff in the intake area OR it could be one that taps into the top of the crankcase which would clean all the oil deposits off the lifters and stuff.



JL`s ingenious system, fills your entire oil system up with a DEGREASER in hot water solution which is pumped through your engine with pressure. Then it is redrained and water is pumped through to rinse the system. the water is drained and your filled back up with oil, "good to go".



problem 1- this stirs up sludge like oil deposits in the bottom of the oil pan (which will not cause a problem) and pressurizes them through your system, leaving these sludge like deposits in the upper end of your engine on the lifters... ie. BAD



problem 2- they use a degreaser on an oiling system..huh? anyway, all of the degreaser does not get rinsed out and when they fill you back up with fresh oil, it is soon contaminated with degreser making the oil a very poor lubricant.



I know another guy who actually worked at jiffy lube, he wrote down all the devious stuff they do, i`ll try to find the stuff he wrote and post it for you. but basically JIFFY LUBE = BAD :)

[Scottwax]

:scared



Note to self: Stay away from Jiffy Lube.

[LouisanaJeeper]

not the letter I was looking for, but here is another one off the net i had bookmarked:


Negligence:



At my garage it was normal for my co-workers to use improper fluids in our customers` vehicles. In regards to automatic transmissions, most of them use Dextron/Mercon 3. This was why my co-workers would usually only install this type fluid whether the transmission used it or not. My co-workers, out of laziness and ignorance, would refuse to look in the reference guide to see what kind of fluid it really needed. What was also unfortunate was that the only other type of fluid we stocked was Mopar ATF3. Thus, most new Ford (Mercon 4) transmissions and some European (SLF) transmissions we shouldn`t have serviced anyway because we didn`t even stock their fluid. When it came to servicing automatic transmissions my co-workers were too lazy to replace the gasket and filter. We would only perform the fluid exchange service for $70, or perform a "Drain and Fill" (if the transmission had a drain plug) service for $25. In most cases we used only Dextron/Mercon 3. As these cars left the garage I would hope that the customer`s transmission would fail soon so that the company would be held responsible. However, I speculate that it took several months for these improperly serviced transmissions to break. Sadly in their case, I`m sure the customer had to pay for the repairs out of their own pocket. This was a regular event that occurred at our garage.



It was also normal for my coworkers to use improper fluids in gearboxes. Every differential that I`ve ever serviced used either 80w90 GL5, or 80w90 GL5 L.S. At Jiffy Lube we stocked the GL5 LS, and 80w90 GL4 gear oil. The first problem with our service on differentials was that all of our evacuation pumps where broken. Therefore, we were only capable of evacuating the fluid if the differential had a drain plug. If it did, we would perform the service properly (in the cases where GL5 LS was used) because the old fluid was removed. However, in differentials without a drain plug my co-workers wouldn`t replace the fluid. Instead, they would only top it off and charge the customer for a complete service. There was also an occasion where we ran out of GL5 LS. In that case Ron Garcia ordered us to use the GL4. I`m certain that we serviced at least a dozen differentials with GL4. I hope they didn`t have a drain plug in their case so too much of the improper fluid wouldn`t be added.



Manual transmissions can use every kind of lubricant from engine oil to ATF. Usually if my co-workers were able to sell a service on a standard transmission he would try to determine what fluid the transmission used by examining the old fluid that came out. Unfortunately, it`s difficult to tell the difference between ATF and engine oil. It`s also difficult to tell the difference between GL5 and GL4. The best way to know for sure what kind of fluid the manual transmission uses is to look it up in the book. Of course that never happened. Instead my co-workers would rely on their own limited knowledge and install whatever fluid they thought was best. I witness during my employment that my co-workers consistently used GL5 in all the manual transmission that used gear oil. This was because GL5 was dispensed out of a convenient pneumatic gun. GL4, on the other hand, had to be pumped in manually. Out of laziness they used only GL5. The only times when they used GL4 was when I knew for a fact that the vehicle needed it, and I insisted that they used it.



There were two occasions at my garage where we had a large and dangerous oil spill in the lower bay. We had three bays at my garage. At the end of the night we would run the drain containers to the back of the bay and drain their contents into the main holding tank. However, it is necessary that all three drain containers be connected to the drain manifold when you empty their contents. If you were to only hook two of the drains to the manifold the third bay would get oil spilled on it. Basically the oil from the first two drains would empty out the connection for the third drain and not into the holding tank. Because one of my co-workers neglected to hook up all three drains at the end of the night the next morning when I came in there was at least 15 gallons of used oil all over the lower bay. This happened twice during my employment. In each event the oil spill was never reported. We used all of our rags to soak up the oil. Ron later ordered me to put the rags in the oil filter press to squeeze out the oil. The rags were then sent to the laundry.



The most upsetting aspect of working for Jiffy Lube for me was that Ron continuously neglected to keep hand cleaner and gloves stocked in the garage. In order to reduce the risk of skin cancer it was important to me that I keep my hands clean and wear gloves. At least half the time there wasn`t any hand cleaner in the employee bathroom. Only during the last few weeks of my employment did I see Ron order gloves.





Did our customers really get the Signature Service they paid for?



I really don`t think so. You must question whether or not they are actually getting the correct fluids and the oil filter replaced. Secondly, my experience has been that it is a question whether the customer gets everything else they pay for. Part of the signature service is that we check all the gearboxes. While my co-workers regularly recommended to the customer that they have their gearboxes service, they never actually checked them. This was another attempt to boost ticket average. Also, part of the signature service is that we will grease the suspension when it`s possible. During the course of my employment the only suspensions I ever witnessed get serviced were one`s which I serviced myself. I never once saw my co-workers perform this service.



Jiffy Lube also says they will refill the washer fluid. It was typical that our garage was out of washer fluid concentrate. When customers needed washer fluid added we would just add plain water. We also topped off the coolant reservoir for an added fee. Most of the time when the vehicle used green glycol coolant we did, in fact, add more coolant. However, if the vehicle used the 150,000-mile red silicon coolant my co-workers only added water. The customer was still charged, of course, in order to boost our ticket average.



Conclusions:

It is clear to me that the only way to correct the serious issues I`ve address is if Jiffy Lube begins to hire only skilled mechanics. It would be preferable if they only hired ASE certified mechanics. Most of events of incompetence I witnessed were due to the fact that the employees, out of ignorance, were unaware they were making mistakes. If a mechanic is completly unaware of how an automotive engine runs then it is unlikey he/she will understand why it is so important to have oil in it. I`m certain these are not the kind of people that should be working on peoples cars.



During my employment I worked desperately to be honest, and not take advantage of any Jiffy Lube customers. When I first came to Jiffy Lube my co-workers respected me because of my knowledge. That respect soon faded away when I wasn`t selling nearly as many services as they were. Soon, I became the subject of criticism, both by Ron and Hormos. On two occasions during my employment, Hormos demanded that I sell more services because our ticket average was low. I nervously refused and told him that I would only sell services that needed to be performed. He then angrily ordered me to leave the garage. Hormos later explained to Ron that I wasn`t selling services. Ron also ordered me to starting selling more. I explained to him that I felt he was demanding that I be dishonest. This conflict was never resolved.



It is clear to me that the extreme pressure to sell unnecessary services I experienced during my employment was not isolated to my shop. My co-workers were driven to sell by the company at large. Ron made it clear to us that the company had certain goals we had to meet in regards to sales. This has led me to believe that certain individuals who work in the corporate office of our district are responsible for the enormous pressure both my coworkers and I suffered to sell services.

James Rutledge Colver

425-xxx-xxxx



From:

James C.

Issaquah, WA



http://www.planetfeedback.com/sharedLetters/viewLetter/0,2936,100418-15-0-0-20-0-fb_date-desc-223527-0,00.html (page 1)

http://www.planetfeedback.com/sharedLetters/viewLetter/0,2936,100418-15-0-0-20-0-fb_date-desc-223525-0,00.html (page 2)

[Spilchy]

Wow! I get my oil changed a jiffy lube every 3 months :eek:



I have never had a problem. I guess it`s because I only get the oil done, despite them trying to upsell things. I don`t even let them check the tire pressure, vacuum, clean the windows or put in washer fluid. I just say oil change and NOTHING else!



Firestone offers the engine flush. Are any of you aware of it? Is that one safe? I want to do it, but am hesitant that maybe the wrong shop will mess it up.



I got my fuel injection system cleaned at the 30K mile tune up including new fuel filter.



Thanks for the replies.

[imported_BretFraz]

One other comment about additives:



The makers of both Slick 50 and Prolong have been fined by the FTC for deceptive practices, mainly involving their advertising & promotional claims. Both makers have had to alter their marketing slogans to comply with FTC rulings. Here`s the FTC ruling on Prolong: http://www.ftc.gov/opa/1999/09/prolong.htm



As others have said, there is no need to use an additive to "boost" the effectiveness of modern oil. The benefits simply do not exist. If you feel you need a fuel injection cleaner, the only one`s I know that work decently are Chevron w/ Techron (and only with Techron), Redline`s fuel system cleaner, and BG 44K which is widely understood as the best "pour in the tank" fuel system cleaner on the market.



I`m sure you`ve read the other threads about octane so I won`t repeat all that.



As for engine flushes, most of them do more harm than good as Lou Jeeper said. The only engine cleaner I have confidence in (after research and consultation with experts) is Auto-RX. It`s truly a unique product. www.auto-rx.com

[Scott P]

Oil additives are not needed when you use a quality motor oil. I`ve run Mobil 1, Amsoil and Syntec (The full synthetic made in Germany) in my Grand Prix. I change every six months which is about 6,000 miles.



Bretfaz is correct in his recommendation of Auto-Rx. It is a unique product that truly does work as advertised. It is a bit pricey, but I wouldn`t use anything else in my engines.

[SK2003TypeS]

Oil Additive. I was sold on the Slick 50 back in the day. Used it in my modded `82 280Zx Turbo, found no differences (good or bad). So save your money, it`s a bunch of marketing bla bla bla.

I think you`ll be fine with your normal oil interval changes.



As for fuel additves, I believe in Chevron Techron. If you have a Cheron station by you, fill up there once a month or as often as you feel necessary. Their gas has the Techron in it. I usually put in a black bottle twice a year. I`m also of fan of Redline`s line of products.

I do believe that those professional fuel rail/injection cleaning services are more significant for overall performance and economy compared to these pour in additives. So that was the right move on your part at 30K.



Check the manual for the octane to be used for that car. I think you can get away with 87 or 89. As far as premium "harming" your car, I don`t think it will. I use 93 in mine all the time because that`s what they recommend and that`s what a lot of people driving my car use since it`s a high compression engine.



On the topic of motor oil, has anyone ever done this ? Sounded interesting. Don`t know if I found this link on this or another forum.

http://www.blackstone-labs.com/index.html

[MBZ 500E]

Great answers!! Thanks for all the info and shared experiences.



The Jiffy Lube story blew me away, I will admit I`ve used them a couple of times in the distant past but was never happy with their service. Didn`t expect to read that kind of story though, simply amazing the dishonesty out there.:eek:

[imported_SouthernZ71]

I use SeaFoam in my Oil/Intake/Gas every other oil change (3k miles). Take a bottle of Seafoam and split it into equal parts, dump 1 part into the gas, 1 part into the oil (run for a couple of days and change oil) the rest I let the PCV vac line slurp into the intake.



Seafoam has lessened (almost eliminated) my piston slap that Chevy motors are known for. On my girls Mazda the lifters were tapping, after 2 doses of seafoam/synthetic oil the problem is gone.



Chevron/Redline are great products, but more expensive than Seafoam. As for synthetic, everyone has an opinion. For me, I like the peace of mind.