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View Full Version : What Can a Someone Without a PC Hope to Accomplish?



Tazmo
09-05-2003, 08:59 PM
I’ve been lurking for quite awhile and have read a ton of posts full of wonderful information and tips. I want to thank all the pros as well as the die-hard enthusiasts (to say nothing of the good folks that keep Autopia running) for taking time to contribute.



At first, most of what I read was overwhelming. Maybe it was just information overload or whatever. Finally, however, I’ve slowly been able to formulate a plan of attack for my newly purchased 1994 Lexus LS400. Not exactly in the same class as some of the fine and exotic machinery some of you own, but for me this car is going to be like good psychotherapy as I work to get it into shape.



But to be honest, I have some nagging doubts about my ability to do all that I want to do. For one thing, I’m old enough to remember watching the Beatles first appearance live on the Ed Sullivan Show if that tells you anything. So, you`d think I`d be looking to use all the "labor saving" devices I could. :doh But after some soul searching, I’ve finally decided that a PC is not for me…at least not right off the bat. I figure a tool in the wrong (i.e., inexperienced) hands can do more harm than good. But on the other hand, I wonder if the current state of my exterior would dictate that I really should use one if I expect to get the results I want. And this is where I could use some advice.



I’m not expecting a competition finish, and can actually abide a few minor flaws and imperfections. Still…I would like a finish that will give me pride of ownership and confidence that I’m protecting the vehicle for a long time to come.



Actually, the paint job and clear coat are not in too bad of shape. However, I do have the usual number of scratches and minor dings that one might expect for a car this old and for one that has seen more than it’s share of bad car wash drive-thrus. I also have a few missing paint chips. At this point I’m planning on using a paint marking pen type of product that I saw mentioned instead of touch-up paint (darn it…seems I’ve lost the link to what I’m referring to, so I’m not sure what to call it).



My plans (in order) are to:

1. Dawn wash it

2. Clay it down

3. Use some sort of swirl remover (not too sure if this step is necessary…and not settled as yet on a product if I do decide to do this…ScatchX?).

4. Use some touch-up markers or touch-up paint

5. Apply AIO x 2

6. Apply SG x ?

7. Apply some S100 (just because).



My question (finally)…considering the job I’d be undertaking and the products I plan to use…is this too ambitious a project without the use of a PC? Or should I just bite the bullet and spring for one to tackle such a job? Trouble is, I don’t have a “practice vehicle” to help me gain the experience. At least the color I have to work with won’t be that hard to do…it’s silver with a silver interior (however, if it counts, :D I wanted a black exterior…just couldn’t find one).



Any advice would be appreciated.



-Taz

Deanski
09-05-2003, 09:45 PM
OK, so you want to try to remove swirls and repair the finish by hand first. No problem. Roll up your sleeves and get ready for some work.



After washing/claying, I`d try a chemical cleaner such as Megs Premium Paint Protection Cleaner, as it is really meant for hand use as a swirl and defect remover. It will take maybe several times before it gets better.



As for a PC in wrong hands, there is no such thing, so long as you do not sleep with it running on the finish. It`s fool proof, easy, and gets results with the right polishes.



Or, you can just send it to a detail shop to have them remove all the swirls for you, get the finish back to perfect, then all you have to do is maintain it by hand from that point going forward.



Get some MF towels, an Autopia CBT towel and or a DF Towel for QD work and light hand glazing. The MF work well for the polish/glaze removal and the CBT/DF towels work best for light QD with a spray.



This way, if you see swirls or marks after the detailer does the job, you can touch them up without doing the whole damn car!



So, after the detailer polishes the finish and you request NO WAX, go to the AIO then SG and your top of S100. Maintain with a good QD that has some wax in it to freshen up the S100.



Since you`re a Lexus owner, enjoy the pic of my SC430 in my sig and more in members gallery!



PS, yes I remember seeing the Beatles too, but I was a bit younger then. Just got done watching about Frank and Oceans Eleven making. Great documentary on the Rat Pack!

:p



Regards,

Deanski

Scottwax
09-05-2003, 10:28 PM
Not much I can add to what Deanski said other than I`d use Meguiars Swirl Free Polish over the Meguiars Medallion Paint Cleaner...but you can probably find Medallion more easily. Swirl Remover #9 2.0 is also a terrific product.



I do all my work by hand and I have found that when you are working paint with anything stronger than a glaze or light polish, you get much better results if you use a folded terry cloth towel (folded to 1/8ths size so it forms a thick pad) and work a section at a time until the product looks nearly clear and dry. I start off in a circular motion to spread the product, then swith to back and forth (as the wind flows over the car) to work the product in a break it down (as you have to do with Meguiars Body Shop Pro line since they have buffered abrasives). Make sure you refold the towel for each panel or section of paint you work since dried product will build up and can cause scratching. Using a towel instead of a foam hand pad distributes pressur more evenly and you avoid the occasional surface marring you can get when using foam and excess pressure from one of your fingers is bearing down harder than the others.

Tazmo
09-05-2003, 10:48 PM
Thanks guys...you`ve given me some new alternatives to chew on...not to mention some hope. Especially considering you do your stuff by hand, Scott. And Deanski...ooh, boy! I`m about blinded by your pic. She sure looks sweeet AND clean.



Appreciate the insights,



-Taz

imported_Dave Holmes
09-05-2003, 11:49 PM
Who are the Beatles and Ed Sullivan? And who is Frank (presumably in some sort of mouse group or "Rat Pack")? :)



Deanski, is the Medallion Premium Paint Protection Cleaner really that effective for light swirls by hand? I still have some after Megs #9 (done by hand).



Scottwax, good advice on folding the terry towel instead of a foam applicator. I`ll try that next.



Thanks.



Dave

Lowejackson
09-06-2003, 05:33 AM
A PC is a great tool for everyman, you really have to try hard to do some damage and yes great results can be obtained by hand. In terms of ease of use and quick consistent results a PC is a great device. Perfection by hand requires greater skills. I am more consistent with a PC because I do not have the skills of people like Scottwax.

Deanski
09-06-2003, 06:48 AM
Dave Holmes,



Yes, the Megs MPPC is pretty good, as it was really designed for hand use and is a chemical type cleaner. It can be used with a PC as well.



You may want to PM Mike Phillips on more detail of the MPPC, as he can elaborate on it`s best effective use, but I`ve found it will remove light swilrs.



But then again, Scottwax as you see, does quite a bit by hand and his method also is a sound way as products used. I mostly use #9 or BS SMR with a PC though.



The right towels also have a factor in this as they provide a surface that acts as a cutting/polish pad with the right product due to the fiber size and density. Hell, I`ve seen people use actual cutting pads cut-up to fit the hand to remove swirls instead of a machine. I`ve seen this done at one car show.



Give it a try, and if things are going too slow, well it`s time for a PC or hand it off to a detail shop with the tools and materials.



Thanks Scottwax for your technique.



Thanks "Taz" regarding comment on my SC430! Still not perfect, but almost there!



Regards,

Deanski

Acehole
09-06-2003, 07:10 AM
First of all, a PC is probably the most idiot-proof tool you can imagine. I get great results with it and I can barely change a light bulb. The worst danger is scratching the finsh with the electrical cord if you don`t drape it over your shoulder. The pad does not rotate - you can actually grab it while it`s running without injuring yourself, so how can it harm your paint? (Well, I guess if you use a compound on a dirty car you can) Anyway, if you insist on working by hand, you have to use a product with fillers to do a lot of hiding in conjunction with the slight paint removal action you will get. I have used Griot`s Fine Hand Polish and have found it to work very well under a carnuba wax. Poorboys Polish with Carnuba also leaves a very nice finish and goes a long way to hide flaws. Good luck and enjoy your new ride!

Tazmo
09-06-2003, 04:51 PM
Hmmm…seems to be a consensus that someone without any experience could probably handle a PC just fine. Might have to re-think my plan of attack. But in the event I don’t use one, Scott’s method of using a terry cloth towel to work the paint and product seems sound. Appreciate you sharing that tidbit, Scott.



I did find the link to the touch-up paint product I was looking for. I’m sure many of you know it, but it’s called Autosharpen Pens (http://www.autosharppen.com/benefits.htm) . Basically, it’s paint in a handheld applicator tube.



Quick question though…at what point in the overall process would be best to apply touch-up paint? Right before one uses a swirl remover/polish? Or should it be done after the polish has been applied and buffed? Seems like then you would know what really needs the paint and what doesn’t?



Thanks,



-Taz

JustinR32
09-06-2003, 08:39 PM
I saw the Beatles on Ed Sullivan when I was 10. Get the PC.



Do the touchup after washing and before swirl removal, etc. Don`t rush the job; you have to live with the results for a long time, one more day won`t hurt. I would wash the car and prep the surface late in the day, do the paint touch up, then the next morning I would even up the touchup spots and proceed with the job.



The PC is truly idiot proof. At our age, the muscles give out long before the scratches are removed. The $200 or so (after pads etc) is negligible compared to the time and the weariness it saves. I tried scratch removal by hand with ScratchX and #9 three times before finally getting the PC. And, as you become comfortable with it, your results will improve.



Tom

Tazmo
09-07-2003, 04:58 PM
Originally posted by Mosca

I saw the Beatles on Ed Sullivan when I was 10. Get the PC.



The PC is truly idiot proof. At our age, the muscles give out long before the scratches are removed. The $200 or so (after pads etc) is negligible compared to the time and the weariness it saves.

Tom



I was about that age too when that show aired. Man...how time flies. (Sheesh...sound like my parents!)



After giving the car another really good once-over today(between rain showers), I`ve decided that a PC really is needed to do this job right. If it were just a very few minor scratches that would be one thing, but I`ve got some that would take some serious elbow grease to get out.



Thanks, Tom, for yet another comment on how hard it would be to mess things up with a PC, and also for the advice on how to handle the touch-up paint...makes sense.



Now, if they`ll just let me out of the "home" long enough to go get one :D I`ll be alright.



Thanks again to all who offered advice,



-Taz