what`s the difference between paint decontaminant and paint cleanser ?

[chip douglas]

is a paint decontaminant a mere cleanser ?

Hi all, i was reading some article the other day, and on the page there was pics showing base coat clear coat paint, and those contaminants present on the top layer of paint, etching into the sub layer of paint. The guy whose name slips me right now, said that claying is very good at removing the outter part of contaminants, yet would fail to remove parts that are deeper in the paint finish, so he suggested using a *paint decontaminant* in order to properly remove those, therefore preventing them contaminants to further spread and oxidise the paint.



He mentioned washing the car starting from bottom to top, then applying a stuff(all i know is it was from finish kare), to the paint, not allowing it to dry or haze on the car, but rather let it sit there for about 7 minutes.....................my question is, what is this, is it some kind of acidic substance to open paint pores ? Is it just the same as any paint cleansers like meguiars *deep crystal* cleaner ? I`m asking cause this seems to be a step not much talked about on here, yet this step might just be the same a using any paint clearner outthere, i don`t know.



But since the procedure is somewhat different, i reckon the stuff is not the ordinary paint cleaner some use here.



Is the decontaminant step mandatory, can it hurt the paint ? is it something which would be highly beneficial for me to do , say like on my gf`s car (2000 corolla) ?





Now, i`ll hit the hay as i can barely see what i`m typing



see y`all and thanks



:wavey

[Jngrbrdman]

That sounds like ABC. Do some searches on "ABC" or "autoint" or "valugard" and you`ll get some better info. ShowroomLincoln could explain it much better than I can so maybe he`ll pop in. Those searches will send you in the right direction though. ABC is basicly a 3 step process. This is cut and paste from autoint.com`s website:



Product "A"-Acid Neutralizer removes waxes, storage stains and neutralizes acid deposits. An 8-1 concentrate that dwells for 5-7 minutes before rinsing.



Product "B"-Alkaline Neutralizer, removes alkaline deposits and ferrous metal fallout. Ready to use formula that dwells for 5-7 minutes.



Product "C"-pH 7.0 Surface Conditioner, an excellent 128-1 concentrate vehicle wash for every day use and the third step in our neutralization system. Ensures any chemical residues are neutralized and rinsed away.





Anyway, do some searches or check out autoint.com and that should clear it up for you. Paint decontaminants and cleansers are different indeed.

[chip douglas]

Thanks for such a prompt reply, i appreciate it.





By the way, should i make it part of the detalling steps, or it`s just something most here don`t use ?





Thanks



P.S. this time i`m really off the bed :o

[CharlesW]

Originally posted by Chip Douglas

Is the decontaminant step mandatory, can it hurt the paint ? is it something which would be highly beneficial for me to do , say like on my gf`s car (2000 corolla) ?

Mandatory? No!

Hurt the paint? Probably not, if it is done right.

Highly beneficial? Very unlikely.



You don`t need to wash the car with Dawn, either. Just use a good car shampoo, a paint cleaner like AIO or SEC, a good wax or sealant, and some good MF towels.



You might possibly benefit from a swirl remover, but I wouldn`t recommend that by hand.



Charles

[Jngrbrdman]

An ABC treatment isn`t something you should have to do very often. I doubt that most people here even do it. Its a pretty extreme measure. Clay does the job that people want it to do and that seems to be good enough for most. When you want it really super deep cleaned then ABC comes into play. Its pretty hard core stuff so you wouldn`t included it in your weekly detailing. I`ve done it to my car once and that`s all I care to do it. Use clay and a good cleaner product and you should be fine. Do the research on it and choose for yourself though. It may be something you want to look into.

[shaf]

The majority of people don`t even know about AutoInt`s ABC. The vast majority of people simply clay then polish. Between these two steps you can usually get out any contamination on the paint.



BTW, pretty much all the products you see on store shelves called pre-wax cleaners, cleansers, and other names that suggest they`re for cleaning are actually mildly abrasive polishes and don`t clean like soap or things like ABC. They will remove stains and the tiny stuff that clay can`t pull out, but that`s by dissolving it and/or grinding it away.

[imported_BretFraz]

What the ABC system WILL do is stop the damage from acid rain or similar fallout. That`s why its called a "decontamination".



When you paint has acid rain damage, the acids that caused the problem still exist. Every time water gets on the paint the acids are reactiviated, making the problem worse. Simple car shampoo isn`t going to cut it and neither is Dawn. The acids need to be neutralized from the substrate upward.



ABC will also neutralize rusting caused by rail dust or other steel/iron fallout. Clay is not enough to remove the steel filings and it won`t dissolve the rust caused by them.



ABC also helps with the removal of tree sap, bird and bug poop, paint overspray, and other nasty airborne contaminents. Clay removes some of that but with ABC the clay step can be eliminated.

[chip douglas]

there must be other companies making such products, that`s for sure, and among them, does 3m, meguiars, or any reliable company ?



Down here i can get all meguiars and 3m`s products, so that`s why i`m asking........if anyone has had good experience with a formula from some company above mention or could point out to one made by the above companies, i`d be real greatlful.





P.S. can those decontaminants fade the paint or anything unpleasant as a side effect ?



Thanks for you time ......best regards :up

[imported_Jon P. Nusbaum]

I have used Valugard`s ABC Neutralization System (more info at www.autoint.com). For most cars that have been well cared for, especially up to Autopian standards, it is unecessary, but for neglected cars it is a helpful system. It is a three-step deep cleaning system as others have said. A search will result in some good discussions. I do remember good ol` Ron Ketcham(sp?) (do a search if your interested in him) say that if ABC is used on a non-clearcoted paint job, then it will fade it and can be restored with a rotary polisher.



The ABC system is a combination of liquids, not like a polish in a lotion or cream type consistency.



There is not a similar system from either Meguiar`s or 3M. You can order 1 gallon of each from www.autoint.com. The A & B parts are the acid and alkaline neutralizers. The C is a pH balanced car wash shampoo which can be used as a weekly wash. It has good lubrication and sudsing properties, and is a cool neon green color. If you get 1 gallon of each you will be able to do quite a few cars, I don`t remember the exact number. I know it is over 10, maybe even over 20. So you might want to find some interested friends.



Hope this helps a bit.



~Bob S.



edit: Oh yeah, also be careful around black plastic trim. I have never had a problem, but remember some others having a problem with fading.

[chip douglas]

Thanks a lot for such a detailled reply, i really appreciate your input Bob.:xyxthumbs





P.S. i wonder if washing one`s car with baking soda would neutralize one`s paint ?

[Accumulator]

Originally posted by Chip Douglas

...

P.S. i wonder if washing one`s car with baking soda would neutralize one`s paint ?



I sorta doubt it, and if it didn`t dissolve completely you`d have swirls galore. Dawn is more base-ph than regular car wash, if you want to try that. But note that it`s the ACID step that does a lot of the good, dissolving the ferrous deposits that can bloom into rust spots. BTW, vinegar is NOT the same. ABC is truly a unique product, and I`m guessing that it`s base/acid components are about as strong as you would want to use, even though they were milder than I expected. I was a little nervous about trying it on my new S8, but it was fine.



If you have a new, light colored car (white, silver, etc.) I STRONGLY encourage you to try ABC. It works very well for me- no more permanent rust blooms. I DID NOT take any special precautions around MY black trim- no problems. But there`s no real reason to get the stuff on plastic trim or on your glass if you can help it. You could just wipe such areas with a damp cloth to dilute the product. BTW, clay during the "B" step!

[imported_Jon P. Nusbaum]

I agree, ABC is especially helpful on white and light colored cars where you can see all the little black and brown specks of tar and who knows what else. When I don`t use ABC I find that once I get a white car "clean" from a regular wash I see little discoloration spots that ABC and clay would have removed.

[imported_phareous]

Where can I get ABC? I don`t see any ordering option on autoint.com...just a list of distributors. Anybody know any retailers? My car has bad acid rain etching. In retrospect I think it has gotten worse over time and if I had known about this I could have stopped those spots as soon as I saw them.

[imported_BretFraz]

Why not just call them and order over the phone? Their number is toll free.