Never too old to learn -- Sealants vs. wax, etc.

[tguil]

This forum has raised more questions in my mind about detailing than I care to think about. I’ve been messing with detailing since 1961 – Blue Coral on a very nice Corvair Monza. I moved on to using Meguiar’s products in 1970 on a black Olds Cutlass at the recommendation of a body shop tech and have stuck with Mequiar’s ever since. I have also used 3M polishes to fix paint blemishes. Since 1990 I have used these products either by hand or with a Waxmaster orbital buffer. My orbital buffer finally wore out and I checked around and bought a Porter Cable dual action polisher after seeing them recommended on the Meguiar’s website. I was referred to Autopia after asking a detailing question on a Dodge truck website.



I now own a black 2003 Dodge Ram 1500 Quad Cab. It is a heck of a lot of truck to detail. I also drive on 10 miles on gravel road daily. I want a durable, easy to maintain finish that will always look at least as good as the results that I can get with the Meguiar’s three step process. Something that is less work to apply and can be applied less often.



Somehow in all of my website meandering and numerous phone calls to both Mequiar’s and Classic Motoring Accessories, I ended up ordering a Blackfire polish and sealant kit from CMA. Now what?



I went back to my detailing manuals from the early 1990’s and was reminded that these polysealants might not be all that good for car finishes in the long run. How good are the newer sealants? How safe are they? And how do I remove Blackfire or any other sealant if I decide that I do not like the results?



By the way, I have two black Harley Davidsons and use S100 products exclusively in detailing them.



Sorry to have rambled so much. We old guys sometimes get carried away. The good thing is that I actually remember what my questions were.

:)

[Michael H]

What next? Use the blackfire and if you want to improve the shine top with a carnauba wax. I find the combination of a polymer and a carnauba wax gives a great shine and has durability. You may wish to try the Blackfire alone first to see if it meets your needs. You can always add a wax topper later.

[Patrick]

I agree with MichaelH, completely....I have used BF II for quite some time now and am thoroughly and completely satisfied with it....I think some of your reservations about acrylics or polymers may have stemmed form products containing Teflon ? Dupont Co. doesnt even recommend Teflon as an additive to sealants, so go figure.....


I now own a black 2003 Dodge Ram 1500 Quad Cab. Totally envious !! I have a 99 Driftwood Quad, love the truck, (would really like the Calif. Hemi edition)and like you said, its a bear to detail because of its metal mass, but rest assured, theres much bigger !! I use BF on mine, I think im up to 3 coats, but its time to strip her down for summer and give it a clay, SMR, IHG, BFGEP, and 2x BFPP, and last but not least, a coat or two of S100 (not for added color or clarity, just to assist in alleviating dust buildup).



I freeeekin LOVE my truck !!!!!

[huggybear]

After going to Klasse i became very educated about sealants. HeH



IMO The twins are very safe. Klasse All-In-One and High Gloss Sealant Glaze are definatley in the top ten all around favorite sealants. People have gotten great results with a product called Poorboy`s EX, although i have not tried it. Also if you like the saran wrap look you can always go with Zaino.



You can remove Blackfire with any polish. S100 shine enhancing cleanser, i believe, would do it.



My gal`s car gets 2 passes of AIO and 6 coats of SG every six months topped with S100 bi-weekly. If i don`t feel like putting in that much work i just do coats of Megs #26 paste every month topped with S100. Polish & clay as needed inbetween those; as well as going over the car almost every day with EF clear pearl are the other parts of the routine.



I have a pretty basic routine unless i get new "toys" in.



Sorry for the long post. I am very bored

[OUCH]

Originally posted by tguil

I now own a black 2003 Dodge Ram 1500 Quad Cab. It is a heck of a lot of truck to detail. I also drive on 10 miles on gravel road daily. I want a durable, easy to maintain finish that will always look at least as good as the results that I can get with the Meguiar’s three step process. Something that is less work to apply and can be applied less often.



Somehow in all of my website meandering and numerous phone calls to both Mequiar’s and Classic Motoring Accessories, I ended up ordering a Blackfire polish and sealant kit from CMA. Now what?



I went back to my detailing manuals from the early 1990’s and was reminded that these polysealants might not be all that good for car finishes in the long run. How good are the newer sealants? How safe are they? And how do I remove Blackfire or any other sealant if I decide that I do not like the results?





:welcome Hello and welcome to Autopia. I`m a newbie here but I`ve read a lot topics so I think I`ve accumulated enough to help..



Blackfire products are very safe, not only are they safe but they can last for upto 180 days, maybe 120 days for daily drivers like yours and they look GREAT on black cars.. If for some reason you end up not liking it and you decide to remove it then any Paint Cleaner or Polisher will do the job. I heard those Blackfire Sealants II are a bit hard to buff off though but then most sealants are..

[Accumulator]

tguil - Nice to see someone here who`s done it the "old school" way, welcome aboard. The BF will be FINE on your paint. Any "sealants are bad" stuff you might hear is absolute BS. Really.



About the ONLY reason you might not like the BF is if you get smearing. As in, it never quite seems to dry all the way. Some of us get it, some of us don`t (Patrick, who NEVER does, is probably shaking his head about this ;)). If you do get it, it will probably go away after a wash or two. Or, as Michael H. said, top it with a good carnauba, that fixes it too. BF can last a long time, I bet you`ll like it. But if you don`t, what OUCH said for removal.



Get the finish swirl-free BEFORE applying the BF polish, it doesn`t really fill/hide/remove swirls. Put the BF sealant on VERY VERY thin. A few thin coats instead of a thick one (much thinner coats than most would do with a wax). Maybe something like one coat each time you wash the truck until you have about three coats on. Topped with wax or not, that`ll look great and last for months.

[JasonC8301]

Welcome to the forum! Nice to see you`ve been detailing for soooo long. Well before I was born.



The advice given in above posts is good to follow by. BF II won`t couse you any paint problems. Remember about 10 years ago when this certain polymer sealant messed up finishes big time. Blue Coral Touchless Acrylic sealant. This stuff pretty much caused most people to bad mouth polymer/acrylic sealants. I have seen this stuff in action and it pretty much is junk. But the sealants we talk about on the forum often (Blackfire, Platinum, Klasse, Zaino, Poorboys, Meguiar`s #20, did I forget any?) are safe for your paint.



If you use S100, I recommend their paste wax. Looks good on cars and trucks too. Only $15 a can.



I also recommend the e-book at the autopia store from David B. this will introduce you into the 21st century of detailing. The printed books on detailing from the 90`s is a bit outdated IMHO. Sure some techniques still are used, but new products and new techniques are here. I would think the most useful product invention are the microfiber towels.



Happy Detailing :)

Jason

[tguil]

What should I use to get the swirl free finish before the BF polish? The truck only has 4000 miles on it. Because it was in pretty rough shape at delivery the dealer`s body shop had to buff out some surface scratches with a rotary buffer and did a nice job. They buffed the whole truck. There are very few swirls -- only those that I put in it from washing the truck in less than ideal conditons. We had pretty crummy weather in Nebraska and I had to use a coin operated carwash to get off lots of crud. This caused a few very light swirls on the sides -- not the hood or top. I have a good supply of Mequiar`s #9 on hand. Would this be too abrasive? I`d use my new PC polisher.

[Accumulator]

tguil - You`re on the right track. If anything, the #9 won`t be aggressive ENOUGH. Give it a try with the PC, but be prepared to use something stronger if necessary. Nice to see you`re being cautious about this.