How to a achieve a flawless, mirror finish using Meguiar`s M105 and a DA polisher

[Todd@RUPES]

So many so called experts have said to prime with water when 105 dries out to reactivate the compound. Sounds like you need to add just a little more polish instead, is this correct?

Adding water to M105 (on a DA using a foam pad) can cause some unwanted effects. The abrasives can clump together causing the finish quality to degrade.

Water can be used as a supplmental watering agent when used on a rotary polisher, and will increase the cutting power, but will sacrafice some finishing ability. If your goal is to finish with M105, then adding water would be counter productive. However if you need a more cutting power, a light mist to the panel (not the pad) will help out.

[Todd@RUPES]

In the chatroom last night, Kevin Brown said the priming principle can apply to most any polish.

What I read that is really a new technique is where you do not buff with the polishing pad until it is dry but work it enough then switch to a finishing pad to complete the panel.

Also, I assume that cleaning the pad does not really "unprime" the pad so you can follow the "few blobs" addition for each panel.

How many panels do you do before changing pads?

There is a red 360 Ferrari that I polished with just an orange power pad, a PC-XP, and M105. If I polished on speed 6 until the defects where dry, then wiped away the residue, I would have very faint micromarring (as expected).

However if polished until the defects where removed, then brushed my pad out well (until the dust stopped flying off), then went back over the area on speed 3-4 for 10-15 seconds, I had a flawless (by all accounts) finish.

Cleaning the pad out (by brushing, running against a towel, or air compressor) will not not unprime the pad, but remove abraded paint and abrasives that have become coated with contaiminaton for the most part.

Instead of adding a few blobs, and some well spaced `dots`, and rub them in with your thumbs if there is too much concentrated in one area.

I change the cutting pad when I notice that no matter how well I clean it I am loosing cutting ability or really starting to degrade the finish. I would say about 3-4 pads per car.

I change the finishing pad when I notice a degradation in the finish after cleaning it, or when I have to clean it after every little area to maintain the finish. I would say 2 pads on an average car.

Hope this helps,

Todd

[Leadfootluke]

Great writeup Todd! I really appreciate all of your pioneering. I look forward to trying this out shortly, sounds like a great way to simplify polishing.

Any thoughts on using a LC Cyan h2o pad versus a Tangerine h2o pad? Or do you feel the Cyan would not be able to finish down as well.

[Todd@RUPES]

Great writeup Todd! I really appreciate all of your pioneering. I look forward to trying this out shortly, sounds like a great way to simplify polishing.

Any thoughts on using a LC Cyan h2o pad versus a Tangerine h2o pad? Or do you feel the Cyan would not be able to finish down as well.

Your welcome Luke.

That is a great question about the pads. Here is the difference in finishing between the Cyan and Crimson pads using the same technique on a Bentley Flying Spur.

However I had to admit I was not as adament in keeping the pad clean as I perhaps should have been; there was very very fine micromarring.

I would try with the Cyan just to see how it reacts to the paint, you might get lucky, however you will more then likely see a benefit from a softer pad. As such the Tangerine makes a great 1-step pad on most paints.

Cyan:

http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x121/tropicaldetailing/JWcars/fs3.jpg

Crimson:

http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x121/tropicaldetailing/JWcars/fs4.jpg

Also I must give credit to Kevin Brown for his innovation, and patiently tutoring me.

[Leadfootluke]

He gets credit when he finishes that book thingy he`s workin on :D

Just kidding, a lot of great ideas from both of you guys.

I have the Cyan, Tangerine, and Crimsons in the 4" size for my PCXP. I would think with this method Cutting with Cyan and finishing with Crimson would prove to be more effective than cutting [polishing] with tangerine and finishing with crimson. Just because of the finishing ability of M105, it would appear the crimson with M105 would be able to perfect what the Cyan left behind.

But then again, I can try out for myself and find out what works best!

[Dave1]

Amazing........


Finishing with a compound with a cut that rates a scale of 12.............


Who`da thunk that.......?



Everything indeed is changing.......

[Legacy99]

Adding water to M105 (on a DA using a foam pad) can cause some unwanted effects. The abrasives can clump together causing the finish quality to degrade.

Water can be used as a supplmental watering agent when used on a rotary polisher, and will increase the cutting power, but will sacrafice some finishing ability. If your goal is to finish with M105, then adding water would be counter productive. However if you need a more cutting power, a light mist to the panel (not the pad) will help out.

Thanks Todd for the reply. I will try your method, so should I put 205 on the shelf. Or should I use it the same way as 105 on softer paint or paint that is lightly marred.

[Legacy99]

Adding water to M105 (on a DA using a foam pad) can cause some unwanted effects. The abrasives can clump together causing the finish quality to degrade.

Water can be used as a supplmental watering agent when used on a rotary polisher, and will increase the cutting power, but will sacrafice some finishing ability. If your goal is to finish with M105, then adding water would be counter productive. However if you need a more cutting power, a light mist to the panel (not the pad) will help out.

Thanks Todd for the reply. I will try your method, so should I put 205 on the shelf. Or should I use it the same way as 105 on softer paint or paint that is lightly marred?

[imported_juliom2]

sometimes I get a thin residue of polish left on the paint that tends to be a little hard to remove; is that cause by improper placement of the pad?(polishing at an angle). Over saturated pad? or a hot surface?

[DirtsAway]

Thanks for the write up Todd. Quick question about priming, I`ve always been told to lightly moisen the pads before adding product to make the absorbtion more uniform. What are your thoughts? Is this why you are letting the pads sit for a few minutes?

[Legacy99]

Thanks for the write up Todd. Quick question about priming, I`ve always been told to lightly moisen the pads before adding product to make the absorbtion more uniform. What are your thoughts? Is this why you are letting the pads sit for a few minutes?I`m not Todd, but he did say if you need to use H2O spray the panel and not the pad. I was wondering the same thing about letting the pad sit. I`ll wait for Todd`s answer. Sorry didn`t mean to butt in, but was just bored so I thought I`d chime in with my 2 cents.

[Todd@RUPES]

sometimes I get a thin residue of polish left on the paint that tends to be a little hard to remove; is that cause by improper placement of the pad?(polishing at an angle). Over saturated pad? or a hot surface?

Julio, mi amigo, por lo general tienen ese problema cuando tengo demasiado producto y el trabajo es demasiado largo. El l?quido se evapora dejando tras de s? una gran cantidad de producto en polvo que se qued? atorado ..

Trate de usar esmalte de un poco menos. La humedad puede causar esto tambi?n.

[Todd@RUPES]

Thanks for the write up Todd. Quick question about priming, I`ve always been told to lightly moisen the pads before adding product to make the absorbtion more uniform. What are your thoughts? Is this why you are letting the pads sit for a few minutes?

Meguar`s recommends priming the products with M34 Final Inspection before applying your polish. Kevin Brown says no... We say something in the middle.

IF you are going to add a supplement wetting agent, do it prior to priming the pad with product. However for the best results (but also the most product usuage) you generally will want to prime the pad with product and stay away from additional product.

The reason to let the product sit on the pad for a couple minutes (during priming) is to ensure that it permeates the pours and is completely uniform. There is no wrong way so try which ever method works best for you. :D

[Todd@RUPES]

Thanks Todd for the reply. I will try your method, so should I put 205 on the shelf. Or should I use it the same way as 105 on softer paint or paint that is lightly marred.

I generally get the best results from M205 when using (for finishing) in a method similar to the one I have written. Prime pad, short work time, allow the pad to slowly spin (at low speed) over the paint. There are times when I just plain get a better finish from M105, even on softer paints, so there are to many variables where I feel comfortable making any concrete statements.

This isn`t the only way I finish paint, but rather just another tool in the tool box :D

[Junebug]

There have been several threads on how to use M105, this however, is the one that cleared it up for me. I tried M105 several times with fair results and I decided to search - reread this thread and BINGO - I realized I was doing it wrong. Since following Todd`s technique, my details have been so much better, faster and a whole lot less dusty! I`ve mentioned this thread on a couple other detailing forums and have received PM`s asking where and how to get to it. So today, I want to first thank Mr. Helme and second - bump this thread to the front so others can read it - even if you have before, it`s still worth looking it over again!

JB