Jewel...... M85rd

[YoSteve]

I think we should poll on this thread (if it`s about detailing) :)

anyways here`s an OT from me

http://autopia-carport.com/forum/showthread.php3?s=&threadid=5128 (`http://autopia-carport.com/forum/showthread.php3?s=&threadid=5128`)

Bye :cool:

[RonPirate]

Ok .... Advice... Please.

After all the hard work and you get it where you want it.... and you are going to take it one step more. Equip is DA Polisher. Menz. 85rd. What is the technique to jewel it. IE... Speeds... PADs.... Etc. any help ...:thumbup:

Morgan

[Todd@RUPES]

your hand on a sponge (like a dishwashing sponge) and do little hand circles (wax on/wax off) you will notice that the top of the sponge (where you are touching it) moves with your hand/ the part of the sponge touching the counter will not move at all. The sponge will jiggle on itself like a bowl of Jell-O. If you press a little harder on the sponge you will (not hard, but firm) be able to slide the sponge across the counter top with your hand.

We want to the orbital motion of the DA to transfer in full to the paint, so even when final polishing, we want to use enough pressure to take of the slack in the pad, and cause it to lightly polish the paint.

Secondly, when you increase the pad`s rotational speed (by reducing pressure) on an orbital, you cause it to create a tighter patter of curly cue`s across the paint. This is a little harder to conceptualize, but as the Random Orbital works, it orbits and rotates at the same time. This causes the pad to move across the paint in a unique, curly cue pattern. The faster the rotation of the paint, the sharper the turn of the curly cue. Instead of looking like curly cue the pattern more resembles a V. This sharp turn of the pad is like digging your heel into the ground and pivoting 270 degrees. Only in the case of polishing paint it is an abrasive particle that has attached itself to the polishing pad.

The difference between slow pad speed (gray) and fast pad speed (red) is illustrated in my quick sketch below.

http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x121/tropicaldetailing/truth/Untitled-1.jpg

Thirdly, reducing pressure causes the pad to engage the paint unevenly. As the pad jiggles around (in our sponge example above) different areas of the pad are pressed into the paint with greater force then other areas. These areas are constantly changing. You see the true secret of creating gloss to level the paint as smooth as possible by `cutting` it evenly. Reducing pressure is like wet sanding with a block vs. with your finger tips. A sanding block evenly disturbs the force across the entire sure resulting in a smooth finish. Sanding with your fingertips, however, will cause gouging and a very uneven surface. The same theory applies in creating a smooth, high gloss, `jeweled` paint finish.

I wish I could take credit for the above, but I am fortunate to know DA polishing wizard Kevin Brown, who has patiently tutored me on DA polishing and has taken my skill with the tool to a much higher level. For a long time many detailer`s conceded that a Random Orbital Polisher couldn`t create the same gloss as a rotary polisher (which very evenly applies pressure to the paint and creates a very level surface). I was solidly in that boat as well, guilty of disagreeing with people who said they could get a great finish with a Random Orbital.

However since listening to Kevin I feel I can get as good, if not a better finish with a Random Orbital. I know of many high end detailers, all who built their reputations with the gloss they could create with a rotary, who know almost all finish exclusively with a Random Orbital. :thumbs:

When finishing polishing with a Random Orbital I would encourage you to try this technique.

Begin polishing as normal, using firm pressure and speed 4-5. By firm pressure I don`t me hard, but rather enough to compress the foam fully, allowing it to transfer the motion of the machine completely, and engage the paint evenly. It will take a little experience, so play around with.

After a couple of passes (enough to notice a change in the appearance in the polishing film on the paint) reduce speed (not pressure) to about 3.5 and make 1-2 more passes over the area. You make have to reduce pressure slightly (to keep the pad`s rotational speed the same) but should still be pressing the pad firmly across the paint. You do not want fast rotational speed for the reasons above.
That`s it.

While I truly understand that most people, myself included, were taught different finishing techniques for a random orbital and many people have gotten great results doing it a variety of way, I have found that reducing pressure has reduced the gloss that I can get. Results may vary, but it may be worth trying.

As far as pad selection, the softer the pad you use, the harder you will have to press the pad in compress it. I find on all but the softest paint`s, a Lake Country white foam will produce the most even, high gloss finish. You can do a section side by side with a softer pad (black for example) and see if you notice any difference in appearance (good or bad). Because of the infinite variables in detailing, and because of personal preference, the best advice I could give is try a couple different combinations and techniques and find what works best for you! :) [/COLOR]
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[imported_akimel]

Todd, I only have M205 and Megs` pads yellow (polishing) and black (finishing) pads. If I am using the 205 for burnishing purposes, what pad and speed do you recommend? Or should I invest in the 85rd?

[Todd@RUPES]

Todd, I only have M205 and Megs` pads yellow (polishing) and black (finishing) pads. If I am using the 205 for burnishing purposes, what pad and speed do you recommend? Or should I invest in the 85rd?

M205 will usually finish perfect (on most paint`s) with a Meg`s finishing pad although on occasion I have gotten a better finish with the yellow pad. There is way to many variables to make a definitive statement other then try a couple of combinations and see what works best for you.

On some paint`s PO85rd will finish out better.

[Legacy99]

Todd, would reducing the rpm on a rotary for the final buff give better results? I`m using Ultrafina with a 3m blue pad and the instructions say 1800 rpm. Would reducing the rpm help any?

[Todd@RUPES]

Todd, would reducing the rpm on a rotary for the final buff give better results? I`m using Ultrafina with a 3m blue pad and the instructions say 1800 rpm. Would reducing the rpm help any?

IIRC, the instructions for Ultrafina (Ultra Fine) where to buff at 1800 RPM with pressure for the first couple of passes then reduce pressure and RPM for the last couple of passes, I believe to 1000 RPM.

I am not sure how much RPM has to do with marring being left behind..

If you where to spin the pad a 1 rpm, then the abrasives would still be leaving marks in the paint. What if you spun the pad at 10,000 RPM (assuming that there is enough lubrication)? The abrasives would still leave the same marks in the paint, I`m not sure how traveling faster would cause them to dig deeper.

I have final polished (with a rotary) plenty of cars at 1500-2000 RPM and never saw an increase in hologramming. As long as the abrasives/pad are creating a smooth finish and the lubricant is not being overwhelmed by the increased speed, I`m not really sure that abrasive speed will effect the finish.