Super-soft clearcoat problem - SOLVED!

[imported_nihoole]

Just looking for power tools and saw this 7424 PC $114.00 thought it was pretty good deal. http://www.southwestfastener.com/cgi-bin/VirtualCatalog/CatalogMgr.pl (`http://www.southwestfastener.com/cgi-bin/VirtualCatalog/CatalogMgr.pl`)

[Dolphin463]

I was in Lowe`s (comparable to Home Depot) last night and found a PC model number 7336 that was exactly like the 7424. The unit was described as a "sander/polisher" and came with a sanding plate and sanding discs as well as the same worthless polishing pad that the 7424 comes with. The specs are identical to the 7424 and it sold for $109.00. Anyone know if there is any difference between these two models?

[jkochis]

From CoastalTool...



"The 7335 5" and 7336 6" Random Orbit Sanders (along with the sander kits, 97355 & 97366 respectively), and the 7424 6" Random Orbit Polisher.



These tools are essentially identical in that the all use the same body. The difference lies in how these tools are outfitted. Therefore, if you own any one of the above models you have the capability to convert it into either a 5" or 6" sander/polisher. But before you can proceed you must understand that depending on the pad size a different counterweight is used. "

[Dolphin463]

Thanks for the clarification. I assumed this but wanted to be sure of the facts.

[imported_TLMitchell]

SUCCESS! :Dancing Dot:

It looks like I`ve finally stumbled on the right combination of products and techniques to correct the dreaded super-soft Harley Vivid Black clearcoat. In addition to gleaning pointers for working with soft clear on every detailing Forum under the sun I`d been spending some time on a few Harley-related Forums. Most of these guys don`t have a clue how to even wash anything properly but I ran across one guy that I see on detailing Forums as well. He offered the usual hints and tips that we all know and use, however, he pointed me to a product I`d never heard of called Glare Pro Polish. Says he doesn`t use it on everything but it has a special place in his detailing cabinet for soft problem finishes. He said the product description sounds like snake oil but he was skeptical when he tried it and was amazed how well it works and it seems to resist swirling somewhat.

The Glare Web site makes a lot of claims that I was skeptical of. One part caught my attention:

GLARE PROFESSIONAL POLISH will bond to your vehicle?s paint through a covalent chemical bond which is not possible with any other product currently available in the world?s market. The chemical reaction that occurs between GLARE and the paint literally transforms the chemical structure of the vehicle?s paint to now share the properties of both the original paint and glass. Micro scratches, swirls, and oxidation are all removed permanently. The end result is a newly created type of paint/glass hybrid ?SUPER PAINT? that is harder and more resilient then before. The GLARE treated paint has a much higher surface tension and causes water to sheet off instead of beading.


EDIT: link to product site removed by OP, Google "Glare Pro Polish" if you`re interested. - TL

I`ve been doing some test spots by hand with Glare and having mixed results. The stuff works as a diminishing abrasive compound on moderate swirls but I was putting some marring back in with the pad. I was using new, lightly QD misted Meg`s yellow foam applicators. And under the Brinkmann I could see I was leaving marring in the direction I was rubbing. Then I was seeing more slight marring when I wiped with my softest, plushest microfiber. Man, if you can`t wipe it down with microfiber without leaving marks what are ya gonna do?!?

I sat around and thought about this whole situation for a while. I eventually went all the way back to square one.

I had some unopened microfiber applicators I picked up at Autozone. I usually only use MF applicators to spread 845IW and some sealants, I usually favor the light blue ones seen various places because not only are they soft, they seem to get softer the more you wash them. These Autozone jobs were a 4-pack, 2 orange and 2 gray. What I hadn`t realized when I bought `em was that the orange ones were fully brushed producing a flannel-like surface. Think I`ll give these a try.

I lightly misted the pad just enough no dry spots would ever touch paint. Then I attempted a Kevin Brown hand-job... I primed the whole surface of the pad and wiped off the excess and hit the tank with Ultimate Compound. I was going to start with M105 but that`d be overkill. I use UC by hand to remove ring and fingernail marks around door handles and like the way it finishes by hand. I rubbed my keister off with heavy pressure and when I was ready to wipe it off I was thinking to myself, "Self (that`s what I call `me` when I talk to myself)... what difference is the UC going to make if the nicest MF you have leaves marring"? Then I thought about something softer... I got a couple of Cobra waffle weave microfiber towels for Christmas. Good thing because I sure wouldn`t pay what they want for these things! I lightly misted the tank with QD for lubrication and the waffle weave removed the polish residue without leaving a mark! Hurray! Progress!!! However, under the Brinkmann, which is almost as tough a critic as direct sun, the gloss was a bit lacking and somewhat hazy. So I broke out the M205 and primed a fresh flannel-like MF pad and rubbed the bejeezus out of it again. Once again, even better results.

I`d recently read an article on AGO by Mike Phillips where he was talking about polishing vintage cars and how different it is working with old, delicate paint. Instead of using abrasives he used multiple applications of good old Meg`s #7 to restore the finish of a `73 Lincoln using the pure polish to bring it to it`s potential without the risk of damage. I figured if it`s excellent for delicate paint lets give it a go with the softest finish I`ve ever seen. I flipped over one of the super-soft, flannel-like MF applicators and hit the tank with #7 and once again wiped off the residue with the waffle weave. And I was rewarded with an even deeper, richer, marr-free finish. Eureka! I`ve found the magic formula! :Dancing Dot::Dancing Dot::Dancing Dot::Dancing Dot:

I then used the last clean side of one of the super-soft applicators to give the tank the Glare treatment. Used as directed it imparted a great shine with no marring. The finish turned out so good I could now see defects in the finish that were part of the paint as it came from the factory. D`OH! :banghead: What are ya gonna do?

OK, now I know how to get this soft clearcoat perfect. From now on nothing but WW microfiber on the tank and we`ll see what wiping light dust off with a QD does tomorrow. Yeah, I`m still gonna be seeing recurring marks, it`s unavoidable whenever I rub my leg on the tank or splat a bug. But at least now I can correct it. Maybe I ought to quit while I`m ahead and just throw a cover over it so it`ll stay perfect. Naw... I think I`ll ride the wheels off it instead and clean it up when the wheels aren`t turning.

It`ll be interesting to see if Glare imparts any swirl resistant characteristics. One thing I know it does... or rather, doesn`t do, it doesn`t burn off the pipes like any polish, wax or sealant I`ve used. We`ll see what we`ll see... Then it`s off to Autozone to buy a truckload of those super-soft applicators. We all know that when you find something you really like it`ll be discontinued or join the ranks of unobtainium!

Hopefully when the Korean microfiber worms settle their strike and Jack gets some Little Blues headed my way I`ll find them as soft as the Cobras! :clap:

TL

[Puckman]

GREAT writeup on a unique problem and I`m happy your perserverance paid off TL.

Some great info right there boys and girls. That`s a good example of paying attention to what`s going on and stopping to think about what might work. Sometimes I`m in a rush to deliver to the customer and I have to force myself to actually stop and think!

[rockymountaindetail]

Happy for the Hog! I actually worked with Glare a little during my Attention To Details detailing training and was very impressed with it. If I remember correctly that was the product Renny used on his own cars and they looked awesome.

[imported_TLMitchell]

GREAT writeup on a unique problem and I`m happy your perserverance paid off TL.

Perseverence? 3rd Vivid Black Harley since 2004 and I finally figured it out. Now I can quit trading `em in when the paint looks like crap. :biggrin: Now if I could just figure out how to keep the odometer from heading towards the 6-digit range...

TL

[imported_TLMitchell]

Happy for the Hog! I actually worked with Glare a little during my Attention To Details detailing training and was very impressed with it. If I remember correctly that was the product Renny used on his own cars and they looked awesome.

And you`ve been keeping it a secret? Oh, for shame. :toetap05: They need to work on their promo, some of the claims probably scare people away. Think I`ll run out and get some Nu Finish now so I`ll never have to wax again. :biggrin:

TL

[imported_Luster]

Great tips TL!!! :Dancing Dot: I would love to run into some "soft" clearcoat some time. I always get stuck with that super-rock-hard stuff!:out:

[imported_TLMitchell]

I would love to run into some "soft" clearcoat some time.

Go buy yourself a Vivid Black hog... and be careful what you wish for. :cornut:

TL

[Tuck91]

Why is it that almolst every Harley I have detailed, the wheels are pitted and corroded?

Is keeping them sealed or waxed from the start the only way to solve this problem?

How are yours?

[imported_TLMitchell]

Why is it that almolst every Harley I have detailed, the wheels are pitted and corroded?

Uncoated aluminum is soft, brake dust is corrosive, people don`t keep `em clean. Rear wheels on baggers are the worst, out of sight, out of mind, tough to reach. Plus most people would rather ride `em than clean `em.


Is keeping them sealed or waxed from the start the only way to solve this problem?

Eggzactly, even then it can be a challenge. Do any of the new 28-spoke polished aluminum `09/`10 dresser wheels yet? A real knucklebusting treat. :cursing:


How are yours?

Polished, sealed and perfect, thank you. :biggrin: 12 miles home from the dealer, wheels were off, polished and sealed before the bike cooled down. Once they get cruddy you can never get `em back. There`s no cure for pitting. Chrome is the only answer and they still take a bit of work.

I`ve had good luck with P21S/S100 polishing soap, Meg`s Hot Rims Mag & Aluminum Polish and red Wenol. Powerballs, cones etc are of limited value IME. Doing it the hard way with old throwaway wash rags & bath towels gets the best results. MF gloves are a bonus, OptiSeal on a rag is the easiest way to seal `em. ARO, toothbrush and or Brillo/SOS works nice on white walls, avoid Westley`s Bleche White like the plague! Get it on the uncoated aluminum and you`re going to be polishing for a long, long time. :banghead: Don`t even bother with wire spokes if they`re not the optional chrome, they`re cadmium plated and once they unpreventably lose their luster the only thing you`ll do is polish the cadmium off.

Having spares so you can polish `em off the bike is the way the obsessive-compulsives do it. Scarfed this one off eBay a month before the new dresser came in. Thank God for people that convert new dressers to trikes and sell rear end parts cheap! :Dancing Dot:


http://i730.photobucket.com/albums/ww304/tlmitchell99/Misc/Photo_071409_002Small.jpg


Try getting yer paw in all those places with the wheel on the bike. :cursing: The edges of the spokes have a pretty decent edge to slice you if you get too aggressive. :(


Of course, having a spare bike to ride while you`ve got the wheels off #1 to polish is a bonus too. :w00t: The red bike is an `86, wheels look new because nobody rode it. It was in storage for 12+ years and I found it 7 years ago with a paltry 5900 miles on it. :biggrin: Geeez, I`ve got more miles than that on the 7 month old `10 dresser!

TL <-- you can`t have too many polishers, waxes or motorcycles

[imported_TLMitchell]

Beautiful day in Ohio, mid-80s, low humidity, blue sky. Pretty rare for a day off! Grass is cut, weeds are whacked, nothing pressing that can`t wait. No plan and nowhere I have to be. Oh, what to do, what to do....?

So I`m all ready to throw the bags back on the bike and get it off the lift where it`s been sitting since I started my polishing escapades. There`s definitely too much tread on the tires and that needs to be remedied immediately! :hurray:

While I`m leaning over to mount a saddlebag I look at the rear wheel. It`s clean but lost some of it`s luster. Big deal, I`ll give it a polish & seal next time it`s due for a thorough nooks n crannies cleaning... And then some haunting words pop into my mind from nowhere:


Why is it that almost every Harley I have detailed, the wheels are pitted and corroded?

D`OH! :cursing: Just couldn`t leave well enough alone.

http://i730.photobucket.com/albums/ww304/tlmitchell99/Misc/IMG_0491Medium.jpg

Thanks, Nick. Like I didn`t have anything better to do this morning. :banghead:

Geeez, while I`m at it maybe I oughta do the wheels on that old claptrap `86 too....


http://i730.photobucket.com/albums/ww304/tlmitchell99/Misc/IMG_0493Medium.jpg


I guess not. :D

Think I`ll run by the dealer and suck down free coffee and look at dirty, cruddy wheels in the parking lot. :drool5:

TL <----- OCD is a curse, it`s a curse I tell ya!!!

[Tuck91]

Some of my Harley clients need to read this thread. Some good reading here. Sorry I got a little off topic though , lol.

Glad to here everything is going good for you now , TL.