Glases, LSPs, sealers, OH MY!

[theRIAA]

ok.. im think im just about done knowing everything there is to know about detailing (har har), but i still cant understand this:

right now im using NXT liquid wax, and thats it. I wax alot because well, i like it, but i dont know if ill like it in a couple months. all this talk about sealents and glases makes me feel stupid, am i sposed to "seal" the wax with something? i see some guys list of products and they have like a 4-5 step wax and sealing procedure and all the products are manditory. do you guys recomend a wax/sealent combo? is sealent even necisary (anal wise)?

[Jngrbrdman]

You seal your paint; not your wax. If you use a wax then it should be the last product you put on the car. A sealant won`t bond to the oils in a glaze or a wax. Sealants are more durable than waxes, but when it comes down to it, it is all personal preference. Choose a glaze, a sealant, or a wax. They are all LSPs and all have different purposes. If you are going for looks then you might go for a wax or a glaze. If you are going for durability then you might go for a sealant. They aren`t mandatory and they aren`t all to be used at the same time. Some people choose to top their sealant with a wax, but that is just personal preference. It isn`t necessary.

[Bobcat]

Jngrbrdman, you said a glaze, a sealant or a wax are all last step products. OK, so if I wash, clay, and polish - I can skip the glaze if I`m using a sealant. Right?

[Jen@autogeek]

Let me just add to what Jngrbrdman already said so well. A wax, whether it contains natural carnauba and oils or synthetic polymers, is applied to the paint`s surface and then buffed off and the paint is left with a layer of protection.

a sealant is applied to the paint`s surface and left there to cross link. Cross linking occurs when the polymers in the sealant link together to form a barrier all over the paint`s surface. A paint sealant needs at least 30-45 minutes to cross link on the paint`s surface before removal and then an additional 12-24 hours to completely cure for the paint protection to be complete. These times may very according to the sealant used of course.

Glazes are tricky because there is no set parameter to strictly define what a glaze is. Some glazes have mostly oils and fillers in them and are used to fill in swirls in order to mask their appearance and to beautify the paint before being topped with a quality wax. Some glazes have abrasives in them and are more like a finishing polish. Some glazes have cleaners in them. Glazes are not LSP`s but rather they would be the product that would come before your LSP whether it be a sealant or a wax. I hope this helps you. :)

[Brenton]

btw, NXT Tech Wax is a polymer sealant, not a natural wax.

[Jngrbrdman]

Don`t get too caught up in terminologies. Some people call a sealant a wax just like they call a bandage a `band aid` or a tissue a `Kleenex`. People will call waxes glazes and glazes waxes just for lack of a better term. NXT Tech Wax has no wax in it, but it is easier to market it to consumers if you don`t have to explain what a sealant is. Klasse Sealant Glaze doesn`t have any oils or fillers like most glazes because it is actually a sealant and not a traditional glaze. There are some glazes that are good LSPs such as Meguiar`s #7 and then there are glazes like Meguiar`s #81 that look better when they are topped with a wax. Like I said, don`t get caught up in the names. Knowing what the product actually is and what it does is more important than what people call it.

[theRIAA]

sooo..... you can top a sealent witch has to cure on the paint for 30 minnues off with a wax, unless its not a wax, or the wax messes up the sealent. glases are kind of like waxes but they remove swirls better... sometimes... and sometimes you should top them off with wax, but you always can. and you never really know what a product is because all companies call things diffrent names...

[Beercan31]

ok.. I`m think I`m just about done knowing everything there is to know about detailing (har har), but i still cant understand this:

That`s ok We have all said the same thing in the past and had to eat these words, but still it`s ok.


right now I`m using NXT liquid wax, and that`s it. I wax a lot because well, i like it, but i don`t know if ill like it in a couple months. all this talk about sealants and glazes makes me feel stupid,

Your not stupid, you just showed all of us that you can and do ask question, that in it self is not stupid.
"the only question that is stupid is the one not asked" (author unknown)
What is it your looking for?
Anything on your paint is considered "protection" wether it`s a wax, sealant or a glaze, and you don`t need to jump in to the never ending argument of wether NXT is a sealant or a wax.... who cares.... it works...and it works well.


am i supposed to "seal" the wax with something?
Well said:

You seal your paint; not your wax. If you use a wax then it should be the last product you put on the car. A sealant won`t bond to the oils in a glaze or a wax.
you can look up some topics on "bonding issues" between wax and synthetic sealants to get more of your moneys worth on this subject.

i see some guys list of products and they have like a 4-5 step wax and sealing procedure and all the products are mandatory.

These products are referred as boutique products and here lies another battle that will not be won ever.these products are expensive and there never has been a test study done to compare these product to the consumer products that totally eliminated bias. it all come down to user preference.

what you are using is a good product and by what you write, you use it often and it does what you want. stick with what works for you, it lessens the complications in the end.


do you guys recommend a wax/sealant combo? is sealant even necessary (anal wise)?

Here again it comes down to user preference. it`s not what I want on your veh, it`s what you like, nothing more nothing less. there are many time product "A" works better for me then product "B" others fine the total opposite.

My preference is a 2 fold out come.
I like a synthetic sealant toped with a carnauba wax.
Why you asked... glad you did.
First of all a synthetic sealant beads water differently, the beads are larger before they run off the surface, as to where a carnauba wax has a smaller bead. so when I see water beading getting larger it`s time to reapply wax... most of the time I can get away with 2-3 coats of wax before reapplying a sealant.
the second fold to this equation is a sealant will give dark colors a "glow" meaning the reflection will have a silver(ish) shine to it and topping with a carnauba wax will gives me the wet look.

doing this 2 step method your NOT getting the best of both worlds, it`s a happy medium, one I like... again user preference.
just remember it`s only wax.... not rocket science like most think it is.

With all this being said most of us still experiment with products, this is the fun part of the hobby it excites the mind and creativity and if you ask the great question
"Out of all the products in your collection how many go with out use in a year"... damn near all of will say at least 40-50%
How deep are your pocketts?

[Beercan31]

OOOH Jeezz i think I`m long winded:yay

[AL-53]

BC...That is a very good post....as you said..it is all what looks good and works for you...

Al

[budman3]

sooo..... you can top a sealent witch has to cure on the paint for 30 minnues off with a wax, unless its not a wax, or the wax messes up the sealent. glases are kind of like waxes but they remove swirls better... sometimes... and sometimes you should top them off with wax, but you always can. and you never really know what a product is because all companies call things diffrent names...

Ohhh boy...

Good post BC... thats pretty straight forward IMO.

Anyways back to the quote.... Why don`t you reread what`s been said here already.

From Jen about Topping sealants:

A paint sealant needs at least 30-45 minutes to cross link on the paint`s surface before removal and then an additional 12-24 hours to completely cure for the paint protection to be complete
After the sealant is cured (12-24hours) you can then top with a carnauba wax.

From Jen again about glazes:

Some glazes have mostly oils and fillers in them and are used to fill in swirls in order to mask their appearance and to beautify the paint
Glazes hide some swirls...they do not remove them. They hide better than sealants and waxes most of the time. Some sealant`s won`t bond to glazes because of the oils in them so be careful about that (Like Klasse SG likes a clean surface).

Yes the wording is confusing but once you understand how they work the words won`t mean a thing.

[Bobcat]

OK - somebody needs to write a book on what works with what. I`ll give 20 bucks for the first editon!

[mongo]

Let me just add to what Jngrbrdman already said so well. A wax, whether it contains natural carnauba and oils or synthetic polymers, is applied to the paint`s surface and then buffed off and the paint is left with a layer of protection.

a sealant is applied to the paint`s surface and left there to cross link. Cross linking occurs when the polymers in the sealant link together to form a barrier all over the paint`s surface. A paint sealant needs at least 30-45 minutes to cross link on the paint`s surface before removal and then an additional 12-24 hours to completely cure for the paint protection to be complete. These times may very according to the sealant used of course.

Glazes are tricky because there is no set parameter to strictly define what a glaze is. Some glazes have mostly oils and fillers in them and are used to fill in swirls in order to mask their appearance and to beautify the paint before being topped with a quality wax. Some glazes have abrasives in them and are more like a finishing polish. Some glazes have cleaners in them. Glazes are not LSP`s but rather they would be the product that would come before your LSP whether it be a sealant or a wax. I hope this helps you. :)

+1:rockon

[Bags]

Id like to see one that has what works with what on what ie hard or soft clear coat and what colors. Someone should start a data base.

[Jen@autogeek]

Id like to see one that has what works with what on what ie hard or soft clear coat and what colors. Someone should start a data base.

That is a good idea!:yay