Meguiar`s Ultimate Liquid Wax Questions

[DraKhen99]

Hi all,



First, a little background: A couple of months ago I received a Griot`s Garage 6" DA buffer as a gift, along with their Wax & Polish kit. I`ve been waxing by hand for years, and the carpal tunnel (from my day job as a software engineer) really hurts after waxing my vehicles.



I started with the GG "Best in Show" wax, and while I didn`t mind working with it, other than being a PITA to buff off by hand, I`ve done a ton of research and realized that for my daily driver, perhaps a synthetic wax was better suited, versus the carnauba wax I`ve been using (Meguiars Deep Crystal, liquid).



So I switched to Meguiar`s ULW because of good reviews by people I know and online, and although I really like the protection and water sheeting, it sure is hard to put on, because it just evaporates. I did a 2nd coat this past saturday (I like to get a few coats of whatever wax I`m using on my truck to protect the paint during the salty winter months as best I can), and when I went to buff it off, it took around 5 minutes, because there was really no visible residue left, and the truck was really shiny. The first time, it took almost a half hour, because of a few areas where it actually hardened up. I left the wax on there for about 30 minutes each time, and in low-humidity, 70-degree temps.



Which brings me to my question - is this normal? Am I putting it on too thin? Not letting it cure? Why did it have no residue the second time? If I really soak my foam GG wax pad, I can get a more carnauba-like haze, but is that too thick? I have gotten 4 waxes (2 on my truck, 2 on other cars) out of the one bottle of Meg`s ULW, and have enough to do my truck again.



And, while we`re at it - is there a comparably-protective wax that I can pick up locally (I prefer not having to order online, especially if I need more and can`t wait for online orders to show up), which works and behaves like the ULW, but hazes more like carnauba? It can be really hard to tell where the ULW is!



I`m new to DAs and appreciate anyone and everyone`s advice - I got great results polishing and waxing my 1992 BMW 525i, but don`t want to mess up anything!



Thanks,



-John

[pwaug]

Seems like you`re doing things right. You may have applied it a little to thick the first time and that`s why you were able to see it better. When applying sealants with a DA I only use 1 to 1.5 ozs per coat per car. Only 3 or 4 pea sized drops at a time on the pad. Thin, Thin coats are all that`s needed and it is sometimes difficult to see where the sealant is and is not. This will be the case with any sealant applied properly thin so I don`t think changing to something else for that reason is needed.



If your looking for something else with good long term winter protection you might want to consider Collinite 476 and Finish Kare 1000p as alternatives but they are hard to find locally. Another one is Duragloss 105 carried locally by most CarQuests.



I changed the backing plate on my GG DA to a 5" so I can use 5.5" Buff and Shine flat pads--I find them easier to use, more selection and less expensive. Their red foam applicator pad has very dense pores so very little product is absorbed by the pad.

[Accumulator]

DraKen99- The way you described the second application (little visible dried/flashed/hazed product to buff off) is the way LSPs are supposed to be applied. The "clearly visible coating of dried wax waiting to be buffed off" that most people associate with a proper appliction is actually *MUCH* too much excess product, no matter what type of LSP you`re using.



You might think of it as the LSP bonding to the paint at the molecular level; the miniscule amount of LSP that is actually left behind when you`re all finished all that needs to be applied, and that is far less than most would ever imagine; any additional product that gets buffed off is "excess". And it`s not just about wasting product (and effort) because excess product is also more likely to cause certain issues such as solvent-action of the "like removes like" variety when trying to layer. Of course, using too *little* product can cause issues too, but I bet that 99.999% of people are applying way too much and virtually nobody applies too little.

[Accumulator]

DraKen99- The way you described the second application (little visible dried/flashed/hazed product to buff off) is the way LSPs are supposed to be applied. The "clearly visible coating of dried wax waiting to be buffed off" that most people associate with a proper appliction is actually *MUCH* too much excess product, no matter what type of LSP you`re using.



You might think of it as the LSP bonding to the paint at the molecular level; the miniscule amount of LSP that is actually left behind when you`re all finished all that needs to be applied, and that is far less than most would ever imagine; any additional product that gets buffed off is "excess". And it`s not just about wasting product (and effort) because excess product is also more likely to cause certain issues such as solvent-action of the "like removes like" variety when trying to layer. Of course, using too *little* product can cause issues too, but I bet that 99.999% of people are applying way too much and virtually nobody applies too little.



Since you`re talking liquids, consider that when I use a liquid wax (let alone a synthetic sealant, which I apply even more thinly) I use *FAR* less than one ounce to do even the largest vehicles, including doorjambs/etc.

[DraKhen99]

Wow, so I guess I`m doing *something* right for once!



How far can you spread the ULW or other LSPs out? I know with the Best in Show wax, or even GG MP3, I spread it out until I couldn`t see much product, if that makes sense. I haven`t had any marring issues (that I know of or can see), so I guess I`m not thinning stuff out too bad, right?



Thanks!



-John

[Junebug]

I`ve just started using this wax and so far - really like it. I apply with a red LC pad on my PCXP, around speed 3, I really work it in the paint and I know I use more than I need, guess what? I don`t care. I spread it, takes about 5-10 minutes to do a car and then start back wiping it off. No issues, on par with BFWD and looks great. I`m watching a car now to see how durable it is. If it lasts 2 months it`s worth having for the price, looks and ease of use. Plus, it smells like candy corn - ya`ll remember, that candy you always see around Halloween.

[DraKhen99]

I`ve just started using this wax and so far - really like it. I apply with a red LC pad on my PCXP, around speed 3, I really work it in the paint and I know I use more than I need, guess what? I don`t care. I spread it, takes about 5-10 minutes to do a car and then start back wiping it off. No issues, on par with BFWD and looks great. I`m watching a car now to see how durable it is. If it lasts 2 months it`s worth having for the price, looks and ease of use. Plus, it smells like candy corn - ya`ll remember, that candy you always see around Halloween.



5-10 mins to do a car? Wow, it takes me almost 45 to do my truck (2011 F-150). It took about 30 mins to do a Chrysler 200 S. How are you doing it so quickly? I probably make 4-6 crosshatch patterns on a section before moving on, really working it into the paint.



I know what you mean about using too much - if you squeeze the GG red wax pad when I`m done, the surface of it gets wet again with wax, haha. I`d rather use too much than too little and take a chance marring the paint.



-John

[Dan]

. If it lasts 2 months it`s worth having for the price, looks and ease of use.



Two months???? Lol, it`ll go six no problem, even with harsh detergents.

[jfelbab]

I think I recall Meguiar`s describing this product a a "Thin Film" sealant in that the coating is so thin it is sort of difficult to see where it has been applied yet the results in shine and beading put aside any fears.

[Inzane]

5-10 mins to do a car? Wow, it takes me almost 45 to do my truck (2011 F-150). It took about 30 mins to do a Chrysler 200 S. How are you doing it so quickly?



45 minutes to apply wax/sealant by machine?? I haven`t exactly timed myself, but I would bet that I too am in the ~ 10 minutes or less category if applying a liquid wax/sealant with my PC (applying to whole car, wiping off later).



I think even applying an LSP by hand, I`d still be under 30 minutes.




I probably make 4-6 crosshatch patterns on a section before moving on, really working it into the paint.



That might be the issue right there. Do we really need to "work" an LSP into the paint? I`ve never thought so. :nixweiss

[Junebug]

I make overlapping passes with a 5.5 pad, I move slow enough where I can see where it`s been. Then it seems to dry into the paint and it`s harder to see. But, it is SO easy to wipe off! Nice stuff.

[DraKhen99]

45 minutes to apply wax/sealant by machine?? I haven`t exactly timed myself, but I would bet that I too am in the ~ 10 minutes or less category if applying a liquid wax/sealant with my PC (applying to whole car, wiping off later).



I think even applying an LSP by hand, I`d still be under 30 minutes.







That might be the issue right there. Do we really need to "work" an LSP into the paint? I`ve never thought so. :nixweiss



Yup, that might be the issue - I`ll try and speed it up next time!



I can`t recall quite where I heard that you should "work" the LSPs into paint, but it`s something I`ve been doing with my GG DA.



-John

[jfelbab]

Since I don`t need to keep ULW off of trim, that saves a lot of time. I actually do the trim with it as it looks as good and lasts as long as other dedicated trim detailers I`ve used. Once the pad is saturated it goes very fast. I guess it takes me less than 15 min to apply and remove UW on a SUV. I also do D156 (UQW) after each wash by hand and that also takes only about 10 minutes.

[E-Jag]

And this stuff compares favorably to 845 in appearance?

[Accumulator]

Wow, so I guess I`m doing *something* right for once!



How far can you spread the ULW or other LSPs out?..



Until you`re not getting sufficient/uniform coverage. Yeah, I know..that`s not much of an answer since if you can pull that off you don`t have to ask, huh?



"Experience" is the answer here. Try going by feel; the LSPed areas will have a different feel (even through the machine) as they`ll be more slick. The polisher will "glide more smoothly", but yeah it`s subtle hence the scare-quotes.




I know with the Best in Show wax, or even GG MP3, I spread it out until I couldn`t see much product..



Good for the BOS, maybe not so good for the MP3 if you want the latter to do any cutting (not that it does much).




.. if you squeeze the GG red wax pad when I`m done, the surface of it gets wet again with wax, haha. I`d rather use too much than too little and take a chance marring the paint.



See, too much product ;) I`d squeeze it rather than keep adding more wax.



The LSPing pad shouldn`t be at risk of marring, so I wouldn`t worry about that. More a case of it won`t "float smoothly" across the paint if it has insufficient product on it; it`ll be prone to skipping/etc.




45 minutes to apply wax/sealant by machine?? I haven`t exactly timed myself, but I would bet that I too am in the ~ 10 minutes or less category if applying a liquid wax/sealant with my PC (applying to whole car, wiping off later).



I think even applying an LSP by hand, I`d still be under 30 minutes.



Sometimes I do a whole car in a few minutes, other times I`ll do a similar-size one (or even the same one) in a good hour or so! Just depends....




Do we really need to "work" an LSP into the paint? I`ve never thought so.



Generally, no; you`re putting the LSP on top of the paint and it`ll bond or it won`t. BUT....



The "but" here is that often paint isn`t a perfectly smooth film; it often has pits and microfissures in addition to the usual pores. Under magnification that "perfectly smooth, well-polished" paint might look very different. To really get the LSP everywhere it oughta be can take a bit of "working".



It`s another of those "just depends..." things. When I FK1000P the newer Crown Vic, or UPP the S8, I pretty much just wipe the stuff on. When I FK1000P the older Crown Vic or Collinite/M16 the other Audis, I *WORK* that stuff as much as I feel I can without compromising the previously-applied coat.