Flyer Distribution Times

[rdorman]

Flyer`s on the car tick me off and are instantly discarded (touch my car and you might as well touch my wife or children). Flyer`s in the door at home tick me off and are instantly discarded (little known trick of a house thief is to leave a flyer on the door and see if it disappears, if it does, some one is home...). Yellow pages, have thrown them away for years and do not use them. Everyone I have hired is from referals, forums such as these or a referal service such as Angie`s List. I won`t even have a store front work on my car without looking into them.



What a pro charges to do a correction the masses do not understand. Even if they where made to understand, many would still not do it. It is a finite market for correction, a larger market for a thorough detail (less correction) and a larger yet market for a good basic wash and wax. Still, those three make up the minority of the car owning public as they are DIY`ing or running through the whirl and swirl. Most look at it like, looks great today, rains tomorrow.



Fortuniately, there are some consumers that `get it`. Being one, I still often DIY but learn from those more experienced such as many here. Some times I pay to have some on do it for me but that is more of a curiosity or a convenience type situation.



Bottom line is what a pro is looking for is a small market segment. Identify who they are in your community and how to get to them!



Just a customers $0.02

[WAS]

Flyer`s on the car tick me off and are instantly discarded (touch my car and you might as well touch my wife or children). Flyer`s in the door at home tick me off and are instantly discarded (little known trick of a house thief is to leave a flyer on the door and see if it disappears, if it does, some one is home...). Yellow pages, have thrown them away for years and do not use them. Everyone I have hired is from referals, forums such as these or a referal service such as Angie`s List. I won`t even have a store front work on my car without looking into them.



Just a customers $0.02

Not trying to be an *** here, but you`re a very difficult "customer", and you certainly don`t reflect the majority of the population out there. You won`t hire ANYONE unless you`ve been personally referred. You won`t take your vehicle to a single shop for any type of service without doing some decent background searches on them. I`m not saying this wrong or is a bad practice, but let`s be honest, 99% of the population doesn`t do this. In a lot of cases, it isn`t even necessary. But, the fact is, flyers left on cars or hung on doorknobs DO work, and they WILL get you customers. At what return rate is a different question, but they will still bring customers in.

[rdorman]

Not trying to be an *** here, but you`re a very difficult "customer", and you certainly don`t reflect the majority of the population out there. You won`t hire ANYONE unless you`ve been personally referred. You won`t take your vehicle to a single shop for any type of service without doing some decent background searches on them. I`m not saying this wrong or is a bad practice, but let`s be honest, 99% of the population doesn`t do this. In a lot of cases, it isn`t even necessary. But, the fact is, flyers left on cars or hung on doorknobs DO work, and they WILL get you customers. At what return rate is a different question, but they will still bring customers in.



No offense taken. I am a demanding customer and pay for what I expect. If demanding = difficult then so be it. People on this forum have done work for me, ask them. Once I find a service that will live up to their word, and my expectations, I will go out of my way to refer them and even introduce them to unknown business opportunities with no gain to myself aside from a good business relationship.



WAY off on the 99% unless you think that only 1% looks for referrals, does research and compares services. I am sure the BBB, Consumer Reports/Research, JD Powers, Angie`s List, makers of business cards, etc will find that statistic disheartening.



I never said that flyer`s do not work, I was speaking for myself, I pitch them with out so much as glance. Kind of the marketing equivalent to standing on the freeway exit looking for a handout in my book. Difference is, I always give those folks a handout.



I am, and always have been, in service related businesses. And, I always try to exceed the customers expectations. When it comes to business, only those that are unwilling to strive for excellence have ever labeled me `difficult`.

[WAS]

No offense taken. I am a demanding customer and pay for what I expect. If demanding = difficult then so be it. People on this forum have done work for me, ask them. Once I find a service that will live up to their word, and my expectations, I will go out of my way to refer them and even introduce them to unknown business opportunities with no gain to myself aside from a good business relationship.



WAY off on the 99% unless you think that only 1% looks for referrals, does research and compares services. I am sure the BBB, Consumer Reports/Research, JD Powers, Angie`s List, makers of business cards, etc will find that statistic disheartening.



I never said that flyer`s do not work, I was speaking for myself, I pitch them with out so much as glance. Kind of the marketing equivalent to standing on the freeway exit looking for a handout in my book. Difference is, I always give those folks a handout.



I am, and always have been, in service related businesses. And, I always try to exceed the customers expectations. When it comes to business, only those that are unwilling to strive for excellence have ever labeled me `difficult`.

Demanding is one thing. Expecting more than what you pay for is something completely different. Someone who expects a 4 day concours detail for $200 is demanding, yet also unreasonable.



I didn`t say that 1% of the population uses the BBB or other such type services. I said that 99% of the population does not go to the extent that you do (based on what you`ve said). If someone needs an oil change on their car, they aren`t going to spend 3 hours looking up reviews on their nearest Mr. Lube along with asking every single one of their friends on their opinions, they`re simply going to go there, get the oil change, and leave. Likewise, if someone`s car needs $2000 in repairs at their dealership (me for example, if my Dodge truck needed work at my local Dodge dealership where I bought it), they don`t BBB scan either. A VERY small percentage of the population would go to that extent of background investigation. Realistically, most people just don`t have the time.



Out of sheer curiosity, why would you give a random person a handout of money, yet completely ignore advertising ?



I know you speak for yourself, but in the bigger picture, flyers work fairly well. I`m just making sure that the point gets across that flyers do work, and you`re representing the minority of customers. And again, some customers just have unreal expectations. There are some customers you just can`t please, no matter how much you "strive for excellence".

[rdorman]

Demanding is one thing. Expecting more than what you pay for is something completely different. Someone who expects a 4 day concours detail for $200 is demanding, yet also unreasonable.



Completely agree. The only fool in that scenerio is the one getting $200! As you may recall, I pay for my expectations to be met. No handouts required from the business. Hire the best and pay the rate.




I didn`t say that 1% of the population uses the BBB or other such type services. I said that 99% of the population does not go to the extent that you do (based on what you`ve said). If someone needs an oil change on their car, they aren`t going to spend 3 hours looking up reviews on their nearest Mr. Lube along with asking every single one of their friends on their opinions, they`re simply going to go there, get the oil change, and leave. Likewise, if someone`s car needs $2000 in repairs at their dealership (me for example, if my Dodge truck needed work at my local Dodge dealership where I bought it), they don`t BBB scan either. A VERY small percentage of the population would go to that extent of background investigation. Realistically, most people just don`t have the time.



Very true that I really enjoy doing to research to make sure I am getting the best bang for the buck. I have spent little to no time researching lube joints. Rarely use them and am not a big fan. When I do have my car serviced, I take it to the places that I do business with and have already researched in the past. I was interested to get an idea on your perspective so I looked up your location. You live in an area with a little over 20,000 people and as I recall, you have one new car Dodge dealer in the immediate area. You choice is one of a lack of options especially when dealing with warranty. I live in an area well north of 1,000,000 and have dozens upon dozens of options. I want the best one, so more research. I currently have four vehicles (sold the fifth last year). When I gave my Wife a new car a couple of years back for Christmas, once I narrowed down to the exact car I wanted, I have about 10 dealers to choose from. Without a bit of research there is no guarentee I get a good one.




Out of sheer curiosity, why would you give a random person a handout of money, yet completely ignore advertising ?.



When I run across someone looking for a handout, I don`t know why they need a handout but I do know what it would take to get me to do the same thing. Empathy.




I know you speak for yourself, but in the bigger picture, flyers work fairly well. I`m just making sure that the point gets across that flyers do work, and you`re representing the minority of customers. And again, some customers just have unreal expectations. There are some customers you just can`t please, no matter how much you "strive for excellence".



Perhaps they do where you live. Small communities have different dynamics then larger ones. Overall, even direct mailing has a success rate of about 1-3%, flyers less. The ROI isn`t good particuarlly when you take into account opportunity costs. If the OP wants to distribute flyers, and lives in a larger community, then he would be better off with targeted direct mailing or using one of the many similar services available and spend his time more productively. I absolutely hear you when you say that some customers just can not be pleased! Boy have I run into a few of them. I am not one of them. I also know that pleasing a demanding customer can be very rewarding intrinsically.

[davidgehlen]

Flyer`s on the car tick me off and are instantly discarded (touch my car and you might as well touch my wife or children). Flyer`s in the door at home tick me off and are instantly discarded (little known trick of a house thief is to leave a flyer on the door and see if it disappears, if it does, some one is home...). Yellow pages, have thrown them away for years and do not use them. Everyone I have hired is from referals, forums such as these or a referal service such as Angie`s List. I won`t even have a store front work on my car without looking into them.



What a pro charges to do a correction the masses do not understand. Even if they where made to understand, many would still not do it. It is a finite market for correction, a larger market for a thorough detail (less correction) and a larger yet market for a good basic wash and wax. Still, those three make up the minority of the car owning public as they are DIY`ing or running through the whirl and swirl. Most look at it like, looks great today, rains tomorrow.



Fortuniately, there are some consumers that `get it`. Being one, I still often DIY but learn from those more experienced such as many here. Some times I pay to have some on do it for me but that is more of a curiosity or a convenience type situation.



Bottom line is what a pro is looking for is a small market segment. Identify who they are in your community and how to get to them!



Just a customers $0.02









man, you sound like a very poor man..... very poor....... God Bless You!

[rdorman]

man, you sound like a very poor man..... very poor....... God Bless You!



First post and that was it. I don`t expect an answer so I won`t ask what you mean!

[WAS]

I was interested to get an idea on your perspective so I looked up your location. You live in an area with a little over 20,000 people and as I recall, you have one new car Dodge dealer in the immediate area. You choice is one of a lack of options especially when dealing with warranty. I live in an area well north of 1,000,000 and have dozens upon dozens of options. I want the best one, so more research. I currently have four vehicles (sold the fifth last year). When I gave my Wife a new car a couple of years back for Christmas, once I narrowed down to the exact car I wanted, I have about 10 dealers to choose from. Without a bit of research there is no guarentee I get a good one.



Perhaps they do where you live. Small communities have different dynamics then larger ones. Overall, even direct mailing has a success rate of about 1-3%, flyers less. The ROI isn`t good particuarlly when you take into account opportunity costs. If the OP wants to distribute flyers, and lives in a larger community, then he would be better off with targeted direct mailing or using one of the many similar services available and spend his time more productively. I absolutely hear you when you say that some customers just can not be pleased! Boy have I run into a few of them. I am not one of them. I also know that pleasing a demanding customer can be very rewarding intrinsically.

You are correct in that my market area is much smaller than that of a metropolitan city. I still think there`s less research (BBB and otherwise) going on that you think there is, but none the less, I do agree that (to some extent) a small city vs a large city is very different.



If ROI is 1% to 3% on flyers (or direct mail, or anything for that matter), then what`s the best way to market, in your opinion ? I`m curious what someone in a larger metropolitan area has better luck with.

[rdorman]

I don`t envy small, geographically locked businesses, been there. Tough job you pros do in many ways. Again, just a consumer here.... demanding one of course! But.... never stop netoworking, team up with other businesses, offer services that bring in money not just the glory (without diluting your product), sponsor sports teams (my daugher STILL wears some companies t-shirt from little league softball, years of cheap advertising), get in with the chamber, be transparent, host educational seminars (don`t teach them to be you, teach them what to do between coming to you and you could even use this to sell product if it fits into your business plan), maintain relationships, know thyself, stay in contact with clients, coupon it in slow times, give a customer a refreral discount on their next service, know your most profitable demographics and target them, establish brand identity, put yourself above your competition in such a way that you never even have to mention them but it is obvious and get the news out there, reach out to the media (like a expert radio interview but you are not paying...), get involved with local charity (walk-a-thons are great, sure there are some hoops to jump through (getting in good with the chamber helps) but they are cheap, media eats up people raising money(you have to go to the media, they don`t come to you) for some local kid with XYZ decease, they are very pubilc and everyone will wear that darn t-shirt with your name on it until it turns to dust... plus, you write it off as an advertising expense... no need to mention that part of course!), market every waking hour (in what you drive, how it looks, what you wear, how you present yourself... every moment outside of the home) .... just some high level thoughts.

[WAS]

Some interesting thoughts there for sure ! One nice thing about being in a smaller population market is that there is definitely less competition out there, compared to a big city. None the less, some very good suggestions there.

[rdorman]

Some interesting thoughts there for sure ! One nice thing about being in a smaller population market is that there is definitely less competition out there, compared to a big city. None the less, some very good suggestions there.



Thanks man. I was trying to think of `free` or cheap things. Most people want to deal with reputable, honest, friendly, knowledgeable businesses. Being an optimist here, I think that describes most small business owners. So it is key to differentiate your business from the rest.



If I may expand on a few things...



Marketing all the time. Every moment you drive the company branded vehicle, wear the company `uniform`, every moment in public you and your employees are marketing. Be sure they do it right (no partying in company logo wear!). Look the part. Detailers by name are supposed to be detail oriented! Scruffing looking employees, vehicles and shops don`t give the image of a pro. Always have business cards on hand. Any mention by someone when out and about better land a card in their hand. Encourage employees to get into the game by offering rewards for a new customer that comes mentioning their name. One time reward, teach them to work with the public correctly not like a bunch of canvasing predators!



Community involvement can not be overempasized. Be it the sports teams, local charities, chamber of commerce. Even in a large market, there is a radius in which most of your customers will be drawn from. A buddy of mine spends well over $10,000 a year in sports sponsorships. He gets multiples of that back in business. $10,000 is probably overkill for the typical detailer but you get the idea!



Staying in contact. In this web enabled world this is so easy. Remember those thank you cards your Mom made you right for friends and relatives thanking them for gifts at your birthday party as a kid? Well they work in business as well. Have one `out the door` within 48 hours.



Monthly newsletters are another way to stay in contact. Product and service features, specials (these can be used to team up with other business as well and capitalize on their marketing just be sure it is a win-win for both businesses and value to the customer), customer referral programs, how-to`s. Email them off to your database of customers monthly. Make them interesting and of value to the customer. Be sure to give them an easy way to opt-out.



Feedback. Part of the staying in contact and thank you`s. SO important. Good OR bad. Use the good feedback on your website of course :clap2: I will give you an example. For years I helped run what became a five day automotive event that was attended internationally. This thread references that event: http://www.autopia.org/forum/hot-tub/134934-win-cobra.html When I took over, I started a feedback program from the Vendors, participants and host city (London Ohio). I compiled all that feedback and made changes accordingly. One of the big changes I made was Radio Advertising. The city and the vendors wanted more public. They are the ones that really allow the event to occur and `pay the bills`. I did my research (there I go again!!!) and struck a deal. Live broadcasts, on air interviews, contests the works. Cost us about $6,000 for each event as I recall but the cost was passed onto the vendors (they want it, they can pay for it!). They sell BIG ticket items so a car or two and the trip pays for itself. It worked. Vendors where thrilled, city saw huge gains in public attendance, participant attendance grew (they like rubbing elbows with the vendors in a personal way and building those relationships with the owners), the charity beneficiaries where elated. Event swelled over 300% in no time flat. BUT, the event organizers where exhausted to nearly the point of burnout. Victim of our own success if you will. In a market of nearly 2,000,000 it isn`t that hard to overwhelm an all volunteer group! They worked long and hard. I retired :rockon1:



The point is that gathering feedback and applying it works for any business. Be sure there is a quick and easy form on your website and encourage customers to use it. And most of all, listen to their needs!