Problem using Menzerna IP with a PC

[Bruce B]

Good afternoon,

Well, I decided to try out my new PC with Orange LC CCS pad/5" bpl and Menzerna IP to remove swirls and scratches on the hood of my 02 330i. Car had 2 coats of NXT and hood was warm from recent drive. The IP didn`t want to spread very well (mach off), turned on PC to 3.5 to spread by machine. It kept flashing off/drying (pad lubed with BB spray). It was a royal pita. The Menz Final polish with white pad was fine. Was it the NXT, hood temp, or what ? It also dusted a lot. I seem to recall it worked better when I did the trunk a couple of weeks ago.

Anybody else have this problem ?



Bruce B.

[SShine]

SIP/IP likes a stripped surface, so no wax/sealants should be on the paint.

[Bruce B]

Thanks for the reply SShine.

So what do you use to strip/remove sealants before polishing ? Would Prepsol work ?

[SShine]

I usually just add a little APC to my wash and it works fine. others have different methods.

[m4gician]

I usually just add a little APC to my wash and it works fine. others have different methods.



if you have the time, clay that area with a milder clay.

[evolutionwc3]

What was the temperature like outside? I used SIP/Orange CCS via rotary this last weekend in an unheated garage (~40-45F outside) and the polish was giving me fits. It caked up on the pad, flashed suddenly, and would disperse from the pad in globs. I moved the halogens closer to heat up the close proximity and the panels and it was much easier. Also, I believe it’s been noted that a few spritz of distilled water to prime the pad works better than a QD with Menz polishes. I also agree with Menz liking a clean surface as SShine stated.

[Junebug]

I agree with the clean surface and warm temps - at least above 60. I found that by PC, use the low profile 5.5" orange LC pad. Mist with water to control the dust. Beemers do have hard clears so be ready to work a while.

[Bruce B]

Thanks all for the replies.

Garage is unheated (under the house) temp 50 deg, rel humidity about 50, hood was warm. Tried the BB pad lube, distilled water spray, more product. Nothing seemed to help. Must have been the 2 layers of NXT because the FP II was fine. Guess I will pick up some Prep-Sol.



Another day closer to spring !

[Junebug]

Hey Bruce, if you`re going to spend time in the garage, get a propane heater - I got the 2 head unit from Lowes for 89 dollars. It mounts to a 20 or 40 pound tank. It really makes a difference.

[Rickrack]

I don`t use a PC, but you may want to try adding a touch of either Optimum polish or some RMG to the IP which which will enable you work it in a little easier and cut down the dusting. First I would srtip off the NXT with some prep-sol or alcohol.

[Alfisti]

Bruce, here`s my tuppence worth.



IP doesn`t like warm surfaces, as in warm to the touch...unless your hands are cold, then it`s ok. :chuckle: Between 15-25oC is the sweet-spot. Not sure what that is in the old money. :o



I know that many say to spritz your pad but *my* experience says that leads to dusting problems. The inbuilt lubricants in IP work quite well when you get the application quantity right. Adding water/QD dilutes the lubricants and lowers their flash-point, causing the lube to evapourate and dusting. That has been *my* experience.



I use to use QD in the hope that it extended the work-time. All I got was lots of dusting. The penny, eventually, dropped and I stopped this practice. I learnt to adjust the dusting by adjusting the amount of polish on the pad and spurring the pad often.



For what it`s worth, here`s what I do, as best as I can explain it:

First use - I *don`t* spray the clean pad with anything. Remember, it just dilutes IP`s lubricating oils...bad start. They work quite well when not diluted. I apply a decent ring of IP onto the pad to prime it for first use.



After the first passes and the polish is used up I apply *half* as much IP for the following passes, as it should now be primed. *If* it dusts, you`ve used too much or too little polish.



If you`ve used too much you`ll know because you`ll get a build-up of large polish flakes on the outer edge of you pad...these thing dust and marr the paint. Spur the pad to remove them. Apply less IP next time and spur often.



If you`ve used too little you`ll know because it`ll dust and the pad will be dry and fairly clean of polish. Use a *bit* more next time.



*I* find that when it dusts too much for me, most of the time I`ve used too *much* or the surface is too warm. Erring on the "less" side tends to work best with IP.



If you learn to *read* the pad and use IP in the correct temp range, you`ll learn to love it.



When I get it right - which is most of the time now after much frustration and :wall - with the right amount of polish, adjusted as I go along, regular spurring and not too warm panel, I get very little dusting and a polish that plays nice and a pleasure to use. :bigups



(Oh! Menzerna says their polishes hate silicon on the surface so any siloxane-based LSP is a no-no. eg, NXT)

[Alfisti]

What was the temperature like outside? I used SIP/Orange CCS via rotary this last weekend in an unheated garage (~40-45F outside) and the polish was giving me fits. It caked up on the pad, flashed suddenly, and would disperse from the pad in globs. I moved the halogens closer to heat up the close proximity and the panels and it was much easier. Also, I believe it’s been noted that a few spritz of distilled water to prime the pad works better than a QD with Menz polishes. I also agree with Menz liking a clean surface as SShine stated.

This would suggest to me that you used too much given the ambient temp. Outside the temp sweet-spot and it`s finicky.



Rule of thumb: If it`s warmer use a *tad* more. If it`s cooler use a *tad* less.



By moving the halogens closer to warm the surface you brought the temp up to match the *polish quantity*.



You could`ve achieved a similar result by lowering the polish quantity to match the *surface temp*.



Not sure if I`m explaining myself properly. :hm

[Bruce B]

Thanks for the info Paul.



Do you "spur" the pad with the machine on (in my case, a PC) or off ? I was using a stiff brush (mach off) to remove the cake and it didn`t come off as easily as I thought it would .



Cheers

[Alfisti]

With the machine *on*, using one of these: Duo Spur Wool & Foam Pad Cleaning Tool: Scrub dirty pads clean with this multi-pupose cleaning tool! (http://www.autogeek.net/spur100.html)

[Bruce B]

Great ! thanks Paul.

BTW what is that car under your tag ?