View Full Version : Is single stage paint still being used?
David Fermani
12-11-2007, 08:01 AM
How many people think that vehicles manufactured recently have been painted without clearcoat (single stage)? These vehicles have a greater tendancy to fade over time from the lack of UV protection and not having a clearcoat of paint over the base color coat. One of the ways we can confirm single stage is when buffing, there is paint transfer (not dirt) on our buffing pads that is the same color as the vehicle we are working on. What does everyone think?
Twista616
12-11-2007, 08:24 AM
If there are any, its not many!! Thats for sure...what I have stumbled upon and learned in my automotive painting days is that, people are starting to "tint" clear coats. Meaning when they mix clear coat to spray they add a couple drops of base coat paint into the clear, so it slightly changes to the same color of the car. Gives it more of a deeper look and it helps reduce layers of base coat. If you ever come upon polishing out a daul/tri stage paint and your polish pad changes colors, thats more or less the reason why. A ton of custom paint shops usethis method, not sure if the manufac. are doing it yet( prob not bc they are trying to produce the cheapest)
Setec Astronomy
12-11-2007, 08:32 AM
...people are starting to "tint" clear coats. ...A ton of custom paint shops usethis method, not sure if the manufac. are doing it yet( prob not bc they are trying to produce the cheapest)
Sure they are, the new Caddy CTS red color that they are showing in the ads is called "Crystal Red (Tintcoat)" on their website. I seem to recall someone here talking about a Corvette that was tinted, as well, unless that was custom, and I think there are others.
Twista616
12-11-2007, 09:33 AM
Setec Astronomy: Thanks for the confirmation, I figured the higher end vehicles would induce the "tint coat"...I haven`t repainted a car in a couple years so I`m not up to date on what manufacturer uses what steps/stages...
imported_weekendwarrior
12-11-2007, 09:36 AM
I think I heard that Mitsubishi was doing single stage on some of the recent EVOs in order to save weight (save the weight of the clear). I have never detailed on, so I can`t confirm.
imported_Yal
12-11-2007, 09:55 AM
Lexus obsidian black I believe is single stage. Do a search someone did a detail on an LS recently and posted some pics of it.
Here you go....
http://autopia.org/forum/click-brag/84390-2006-black-lexus-ls460-l.html?highlight=lexus+single+stage
Its seems to vary from year to year with Lexus and certain manufacturers and colors (red, white, black). But Lexus Obsidian is SS to the surprise of many Lexus owners on the Lexus forums :)
Scottwax
12-11-2007, 10:16 AM
I detailed a white `03 Toyota Sequioa a couple months ago that was single stage. Same deal with a white `04 Honda Accord.
stiffdogg06
12-11-2007, 12:31 PM
I did a red EVO VIII and it was single stage.
MattB
12-11-2007, 12:50 PM
Lexus obsidian black I believe is single stage. Do a search someone did a detail on an LS recently and posted some pics of it.
Here you go....
http://autopia.org/forum/click-brag/84390-2006-black-lexus-ls460-l.html?highlight=lexus+single+stage
Its seems to vary from year to year with Lexus and certain manufacturers and colors (red, white, black). But Lexus Obsidian is SS to the surprise of many Lexus owners on the Lexus forums :)
I`d be unhappy if I paid that much for a car and found out it was single stage paint.
todd@bsaw
12-11-2007, 04:02 PM
I`d be unhappy if I paid that much for a car and found out it was single stage paint.
The Lexus Obsidian Black is an amazing color when treated properly. :up
I believe the manufacturer does this more for the appearance of the color, as adding a clearcoat to it changes the look. Usually on today`s single stage paint jobs the color coat is applied much thicker to compensate for the lack of a clearcoat.
brwill2005
12-11-2007, 04:27 PM
David, I believe you already know the answer to this question. On previous threads, you have argued that single stage paint was completely eliminated in the 90`s.
toby tyke
12-11-2007, 04:46 PM
David,
I agree with your thoughts, I had loads of trouble with my 2006 Lexus IS220 D, its Astral Black. After applying some wax the other day the pad was stained black suggesting this was not a true clear coat, your guys told me this colour is a nightmare to detail!.
Regards toby tyke, UK
Setec Astronomy
12-11-2007, 05:32 PM
Usually on today`s single stage paint jobs the color coat is applied much thicker to compensate for the lack of a clearcoat.
That`s kind of a funny way of looking at it. I don`t think the total film-build is much different between BC/CC and single stage, but of course the color coat is much thicker on SS because most of the non-primer film-build of BC/CC is CC.
David Fermani
12-11-2007, 08:35 PM
David, I believe you already know the answer to this question. On previous threads, you have argued that single stage paint was completely eliminated in the 90`s.
You are correct. At that time, I got my information from several painters as well as a paint reseller that all claimed that single stage paint was discontinued in the late 90`s. They were all wrong!
I just inspected a 2006 White Honda Accord where the owner made a comprehensive insurance claim that someone poured something on their vehicle to fade the paint. After inspecting it at the Honda dealer, their Body Shop Manager insisted (but couldn`t prove) that this vehicle was repainted with single stage paint and wasn`t painted at the factory this way! We then called Honda`s dealer technical department and they confirmed that they did in fact paint 2006 white Accords in single stage paint and that they will warranty this person a complete refinish. I can`t believe that this vehicle`s finish became destroyed after just 2 years/13,000 miles. Just goes to show you that clear can and is a good thing to have. I didn`t have the opportunity to pick this person`s brain to find out what other colors/vehicles didn`t have clearcoat. Funny thing is that both bumpers are painted with clearcoat because they weren`t painted at the factory, but at a supplier. Check out the pictures of this car:
http://i119.photobucket.com/albums/o157/dfermani/06Accord-White001.jpg
http://i119.photobucket.com/albums/o157/dfermani/06Accord-White002.jpg
http://i119.photobucket.com/albums/o157/dfermani/06Accord-White003.jpg
http://i119.photobucket.com/albums/o157/dfermani/06Accord-White004.jpg
http://i119.photobucket.com/albums/o157/dfermani/06Accord-White005.jpg
http://i119.photobucket.com/albums/o157/dfermani/06Accord-White006.jpg
http://i119.photobucket.com/albums/o157/dfermani/06Accord-White007.jpg
http://i119.photobucket.com/albums/o157/dfermani/06Accord-White008.jpg
http://i119.photobucket.com/albums/o157/dfermani/06Accord-White009.jpg
http://i119.photobucket.com/albums/o157/dfermani/06Accord-White011.jpg
http://i119.photobucket.com/albums/o157/dfermani/06Accord-White013.jpg
http://i119.photobucket.com/albums/o157/dfermani/06Accord-White014.jpg
Sure they are, the new Caddy CTS red color that they are showing in the ads is called "Crystal Red (Tintcoat)" on their website. I seem to recall someone here talking about a Corvette that was tinted, as well, unless that was custom, and I think there are others.
Cadillac has been using tinted clears since *at least* 1994 with the color they called "pearl red", later changing the shade a bit in 1998 and calling it "crimson pearl". I have no painting experience to quote before that.
Crystal Red is the latest iteration of that color family for the division.