Why are my swirls re-appearing? Blackfire SRC FP?

[jbraswell]

Haven`t really posted on here much, just lurked for the most part. But I`ve been having some problems of late, and was wondering if anyone here could help me out.



I recently had the front of my car (bmw e34 535i) painted and I`ve been having some problems with swirls recently. The car was painted about a month and a half ago. Last week I wetsanded the hood and fenders with 2000 grit. I had some trouble removing the sand scratches, due to the cheap, rock hard clear that was used. But I finally got them out with 3M extra cut and a white 3M pad. After that I went over it with Menzerna IP with a white 3M pad to remove the marring that the extra cut left. After the IP I used Blackfire SRC FP with a gray 3M pad and a coat of Blackfire wet diamond. It looked great, I`ve got a halogen set up in my garage, so I`m positive there were no defects. 3 days later, the car was sitting outside my work in direct sunlight and I noticed some pretty obvious swirls. This pissed me off pretty bad so I took the car home that night and went over it with some 3M perfect-it ultrafina. This eliminated the swirls again, and I topped it with the blackfire wet diamond. Followed by another application of wet diamond 24 hours later. Everything looked great, no swirls under the halogens or in direct sunlight. Well today I took the car out for a drive (70 degrees and sunny) and took it up to the shop to spray it off. I sprayed it off and dried it with compressed air. But when I get back to my house, there they are.. Fine, but obvious swirls AGAIN.



So what gives? I know the 3M is a pretty oily polish, and I thought that might have caused the blackfire to not bond.. but that still doesn`t explain the same results after the blackfire/blackfire combo. Anyone have any ideas? Sorry for the novel



btw.. this is all done with a rotary

[sspeer]

I`d do a rubbing alcohol wipdown on some spots after the polishing to see if the swirls reappear

[imported_GregCavi]

IMHO, with any 3m polish, or any polish for that matter, do an IPA wipe down immediately after application. I know body shops that use 3m and they paint looks great but after 1 IPA wipe down, the truth is revealed.



Greg

[jbraswell]

Yeah I knew that the 3M was loaded with fillers... but is the blackfire as well? How much should I dilute the rubbing alchohol before applying the sealant?

[sspeer]

1:1 alcohol:water should be fine

[jbraswell]

So does anyone know what I may have been doing wrong? I am thinking that not wiping the car after polish could have caused the sealant to not bond. But I was under the impression that blackfire actually removed swirls a bit more than this leads me to believe. Any thoughts?

[Setec Astronomy]

Are you sure you aren`t putting the swirls back in after polishing with your application/removal of the Wet Diamond? Poor/contaminated applicator or buffing cloth?

[jbraswell]

No they were definitely rotary swirls. Looked like from the IP, as the extra cut swirls were much deeper marring

[Scottwax]

Could they be under the clear and polishing is only hiding them? Do they look exactly the same as before?

[ZoranC]

Can you do a test section with SRC FP and rotary without applying anything afterwards?



And if that doesn`t bring results can you go over same section with PC, 4" pad, and SRC FP, again not applying anything afterwards?

[imported_Bence]

3M states that the Ultrafina eliminates swirls, but what is not eliminated it will be filled...



(And you use the correct amount when you get an oily splatter everywhere... just watch their video on their site.)



:geez :chuckle: :grinno: :secret :rolleyes:

[Accumulator]

jbraswell- Sorry to hear you`re going through all this, must be frustrating.



IMO a) the 3M did some concealing, b) the BF wet Diamond probably did a little concealing too, c) there *might* have been bonding issues between those two products (dunno, never used them), and d) some of the marring might`ve escaped your notice under the halogens only to be more obvious under different lighting conditions (I never trust my halogens for final inspections, I`ve had too many unpleasant surprises later).



I too would try to get things as perfect as possible with just the SRC FP. IF the repaint is less than three-four months old it`s still too fresh for LSPing anyhow so I`d just glaze it with something like Meg`s #5. IF the paint is older than that and has finished outgassing, then sure, apply the BF WD, but only after you`ve ascertained that the finish is truly marring free.



If the halogen is all you have to inspect by, be sure to turn out any other lights so the shop is dark except for that one light. Move it around and also vary your viewing angle/distance. Inspecting in such a way that you don`t get surprises under different lighting conditions can be tough.

[jbraswell]

Solved my problem... went back and polished the car with the SRC FP, followed that with a mild wax and grease remover wipedown. This may have been a bit excessive.. but I applied one coat of sealant and haven`t had any problems. I`ve washed the car once since (due to rain), sprayed it off twice and it has sat outside in direct sunlight every day.. No swirls! Thanks for the advice

[stilez]

Blackfire SRC FP has fillers in it... An IPA wipedown is imperative.

[SpoiledMan]

Blackfire SRC FP has fillers in it... An IPA wipedown is imperative.



Are you saying it`s NOT the same as 106ff?