PC 7336 and light to medium swirls. Uggg

[studville]

First of all, I`d like to say it`s a TOTALLY different ballgame when you`re working on a black car.



So today, I decided to put the PC to use on my Black 06 Acura TSX. Keep in mind, this is my 2nd time ever using a PC. Ugg what a PIA. I started off with a Orange erasure and optimum compound. It did a semi-descent job in removing some of the swirls, however, I can still see some fine swirl marks in the sun. I`m guessing my next step is xyz product on a white pad?



Also, there are a few medium scratches on my car (just a few sporadic ones), that just won`t come out using the combo above. I know supposedly they`re suppose to come out as long as you can run your fingernail over it and it doesn`t catch. How the heck am I suppose to get those out. they`re not really TOO noticeable, but they`re there. Should I bump it up to a yellow pad?



Picture of said scratches here..

http://img267.imageshack.us/img267/1364/scratchhx2.jpg



And finally *** is up with the optimum compound I`m using. The stuff just doesn`t friggin break down. According to the videos I watched before I started, "Work the compound for ~3-5 minutes until broken down, and do not exceed 4500 rpm blah blah blah."

Dual Action Orbital Polisher Guide: how to remove swirls, scratches, & oxidation with an orbital buffer. Porter Cable 7424, foam pads, backing plate, (http://www.autogeek.net/dual-action-polisher.html)



The stuff just doesn`t break down. I worked it for like 10 minutes and it was still somewhat "wet." It`s not like I`m using a crap ton either. I just put an `X` on my pad per door panel.



I`m at the point where I just want to cash in all my chips and pay someone to do this ****

[imported_themightytimmah]

Optimum is a slow-breaking compound - try kicking the PC up to speed 6, using moderate pressure on the pad, and moving it really slowly. Don`t go bigger than 2x2 at a time, instead of using an X per panel use a dime-sized drop for a 2x2 area. Your problem sounds like a "too much polish" issue - different brands of polish require different amounts, an X is just a general idea (it works for Poorboy`s real well, I find that I use less for Optimum and *way* less for ZPC). You should be able to feel warmth on the panel when you`re done.



To get the big scratches out, I`d do it by hand personally. Usually when I`ve got a car with a few isolated big scratches and I`m not using the rotary, I`ll knock em out with a folded MF towel and a strong compound. This will leave a mess of micromarring that the PC will take out along with the swirls.



To finish, you`ll want to use another polish on a white pad. Zaino Z-PC is good if you`re going to use Zaino as a LSP, if you`re going with a carnuba-based LSP on black a polish with minimal filling properties will make the process easier until you get polishing down completely - Meguiar`s #80 or 1z MP to name a few. If you want to learn the hard way, go with Blackfire SRC - it contains no filling agents, and if you can finish out perfect with it, you`ve got the PC down.



You`re probably going to want to glaze too. I like Chemical Guys Acrylic on a blue pad. Top with your wax or sealant of choice.

[studville]

I really appreciate your response, themightytimmah. Maybe I`ll drop it down to dime size per 2x2. Then again as Patrick over at excedetail said, Optimum tends to have a lot of "lubracity."



Anyhow my step 2 for now is Megs Deep Crystal System Paint cleaner (#1) then #2. I realize that there`s filling agents, but until I get the hang of things I figured I`d use something easier. I`m assuming after I do this step, there should be very minimal swirls (when looking at the car at ALL angles) correct?



As for the bigger scratches, you said you went with a folded MF. I`m wondering.. if my PC can`t do it with a cutting pad and compound, if I do it by hand using a MF am I merely "filling/hiding" the area rather than getting rid of it? I`m thinking Megs Scratch X????







Uggg black is a nightmare. The silver car I worked on just the other day was a piece of cake.



PS My final step is Klasse Sealant Glaze.

[wannafbody]

try thin criss-crossed lines on the pad-it sounds as if you`re using too much product

[ron231]

Uggg black is a nightmare. The silver car I worked on just the other day was a piece of cake.





My car is black :( and its INCREDIBLY difficult to keep clean, I drive it for a mile and BAM dust like you cant believe, even though fk425 says its anti static, apparantly not enough for my car.



And any little micro tiny swirls or marring show up like someone is standing there ith a magnifying glass saying LOOK AT ME I AM AN IMPERFECTION IN YOUR CLEAR COAT

[a.k.a. Patrick]

Stud, Im tellin ya, dont worry about corrections until you get use to the machine. Remember in the other post you have some rules you have to follow i.e. machine, product, pad, and then the combo of all of it put together.....You`ll get it, just be patient, and yes, black is a different ball game amigo!

[Accumulator]

Anyhow my step 2 for now is Megs Deep Crystal System Paint cleaner (#1) then #2. I realize that there`s filling agents, but until I get the hang of things I figured I`d use something easier. I`m assuming after I do this step, there should be very minimal swirls (when looking at the car at ALL angles) correct?



[Note that Accumulator has never used OHC...]



The DC#1 is such mild stuff that IMO it`s a waste of time to use it after the OHC. Go over it with something else that has a little cut to it or don`t bother. I hate to see people waste time and effort ;)



If you try to just fill in imperfections I bet you`ll still see them to some extent under some conditions. Not a problem unless they bug you.




As for the bigger scratches, you said you went with a folded MF. I`m wondering.. if my PC can`t do it with a cutting pad and compound, if I do it by hand using a MF am I merely "filling/hiding" the area rather than getting rid of it? I`m thinking Megs Scratch X????



Scratch-x is OK but it`s awfully mild stuff. The idea behind doing something by hand (good question BTW, how *can* it compete with all those orbits-per-minute?!?) is the way the force is applied: you`re pressing down (perhaps forcefully) on a small surface area, the effort is concentrated on a small spot. Also, you can`t apply much pressure with the PC unless you`re using 4" pads because it`ll bog down and just "jiggle". So sometimes you can put more into it by hand when doing small areas. Might take a while though, and I don`t mean just ten minutes (which is an eternity if you`re working on one little spot).



I switched from black to silver, but *not* because of the marring issue...clearcoat is clearcoat. Silver cars are usually all marred up too, just that most people don`t see it as readily under most conditions. What bugs me about black is that it looks dirty unless you wash it every other day. But yeah, the way every flaw is clearly visible on dark colors can make it hard to reach the "basically OK under most conditions" point.



Given that, you might rethink the KSG plan. I only use KSG on finishes that I can get *and keep* basically perfect. KSG shows every little flaw and that might not be the best thing on a *color* that also shows flaws..I`d consider a heavy wax like Collinite 476S instead. And some polishes that both correct *and* fill, stuff like 1Z, might make this whole thing a lot easier for you.



Oh, and Welcome to Autopia!





Uggg black is a nightmare. The silver car I worked on just the other day was a piece of cake.



PS My final step is Klasse Sealant Glaze.[/QUOTE]

[Grimm]

Did you use just the Compound, or Hyper Compound? Might want to step up to OHC. I used an orange pad and Hyper Compound on my black car, and had to go over the car twice, and I still had light scratches like you have here and there. I decided to live with it rather than go nuts trying to fix them. Like has been said, you`ll get more scratches as you drive the car, so you have to live with some of it or risk thinning the clear too much after several polishing sessions. I also ordered a yellow pad to see if I can make one pass with that instead of two with the orange.

[imported_JoshVette]

Try some 3M rubbing compound, you can get it at autozone of pepboys or whatever, it breaks down a lot faster and I always get great results with it using my PC. Try perfect it II.

[studville]

Thanks for the responses. I really appreciate them. So I was sick and tired of my swirls on my black car so I was like F-it, and I bumped it up to a yellow pad :soscared: with Optimum Coupound (NOT hyper). It seemed to work a lot better. I also realized that my expectations were a little high. I don`t know if the PC is capable of a 100% micro mirco micro scratch finish. (still a newbie). I pulled it out in some bright sunlight and those really really light swirls I was so anal about aren`t really visible unless you really hit the right angle. I figured, why fight it. And left it.



Anyhow, now my only problem is I`m finishing up everything with Megs Deep Crystal Polish (step #2) however the residue of the the Optimum compound is still on there. After polishing a panel, I noticed greasy marks. And I really didn`t want to go to town with my microfiber and risk more microscratches, so I mixed up a bottle of 50:50 Alcohol:Water and it seemed to do the trick. Is this counter productive??



Maybe a good buffing bonnet would be better instead???





Cliffnotes:

--Bumped it up to a yellow pad

--Greasy Optimum Compound left behind, so used 50:50 OH/H20 to remove

--Is this counterproductive?

[Accumulator]

.. now my only problem is I`m finishing up everything with Megs Deep Crystal Polish (step #2) however the residue of the the Optimum compound is still on there. After polishing a panel, I noticed greasy marks. And I really didn`t want to go to town with my microfiber and risk more microscratches, so I mixed up a bottle of 50:50 Alcohol:Water and it seemed to do the trick. Is this counter productive??



Maybe a good buffing bonnet would be better instead???





Cliffnotes:

--Bumped it up to a yellow pad

--Greasy Optimum Compound left behind, so used 50:50 OH/H20 to remove

--Is this counterproductive?



Glad to hear you`re making progress, that`s gotta make things a bit less frustrating.



What you`re gonna need to do is get a milder (abrasive) polish, something like regular Optimum Car Polish, used with a mild polishing pad. That oughta remove the micro marring that the compound and the yellow pad have left behind. Until then, the DC #2 might hide things a little.



Maybe the DC#2 will effect a solvent-action on the residue so that you can apply the DC#2 over the existing residue and then buff it all off :nixweiss



Using the alcohol/water mix shouldn`t do anything counterproductive, but you might see the micromarring a bit more.



IMO it all gets back to your need for a mild polish and pad to use after the compound and the yellow, neither of which is generally expected to leave a ready-to-wax finish.



Nah, I wouldn`t consider machine buffing to be a solution; I never got great results removing polish/compound residue by machine and I`m the kind of guy who does everything by machine...well, everything that works out OK ;)

[Thomas Dekany]

first you need very little polish on the pad, especially with the pc.



The residue is normal. alcohol is ok to remove.



Never understood why "anal" people purchase dark cars



Try the new OHC with a yellow pad and see what happens.