Menzerna FMJ not durable?

[crew219]

This is my first time using the Menzerna products. Prior to menzerna, I used the 3m professional line with Blitz wax . . . then Klasse twins (old school high VOC stuff) + Blitz wax . . . and the Zaino line with Z2pro. Last detail was in October of 2005 with Zaino Z2 and the car was still beading / sheeting off water & paint still felt smooth up until I detailed 2 days ago.



Today . . . was grabbing lunch & a bird shat on the paint. Was inside for maybe 30-45 minutes and the car was parked in semi-shade . . . . came out, saw the poop and immediately grabbed the MF and bottle of detail spray from my trunk. Bird poop wiped off with some force (even after I let the detail spray sit for a few seconds) and there were nice fat etch marks.



Additional QD & wiping didn`t help.



Went home and washed the area with soap + baking soda, let the baking soda sit & then proceeded to use some FPII. FPII didn`t do a thing . . . . IP helped a bit, but I didn`t want to work the area too much.



Now I`m left with a nice splatter mark on the hood about 1.5 sq inches in diameter and am really not sure what to say about Menzerna FMJ. This is not my first time with sealants. I only used Menzerna products and distilled water during the polishing & application. Plenty of times a bird has crapped on my cars with Zaino, Klasse & just straight up wax but it has never ate through/etched like this.



Thoughts? Am I using a bad product? The Menzerna appears to be "fresh" as it has a production date of 3/06 marked on the bottle. Anything I can do to help remove the mark?



Extremely displeased with this product right now . . .



Dave

[TigerMike]

Keep in mind that no product can truly protect from bird bombs. I`ve seen bird poo eat through everything from caranuba wax to Zaino to Klasse, etc.... If the poo can etch paint quickly, then no sealant or wax is going to stand a chance....since the paint itself it stronger and more durable than any wax or sealant out there. Sometimes it depends on what the bird ate, as to how bad and acidic it will be. I don`t know of any product out there that would protect from the worst of bird bombs. Don`t blame the product, blame the bird. ;)

[imported_Picus]

It`s not the product, it`s luck. Some bird craps are worse than others; I`ve had some sit for days without an issue and some etch in minutes. TigerMike is right, chalk it up to luck and blame the bird. :)

[crew219]

Keep in mind that no product can truly protect from bird bombs. I`ve seen bird poo eat through everything from caranuba wax to Zaino to Klasse, etc.... If the poo can etch paint quickly, then no sealant or wax is going to stand a chance....since the paint itself it stronger and more durable than any wax or sealant out there. Sometimes it depends on what the bird ate, as to how bad and acidic it will be. I don`t know of any product out there that would protect from the worst of bird bombs. Don`t blame the product, blame the bird. ;)



I hear ya . . . . Audi also switched to a new waterbased paint for the 2006 models and I originally noticed from the beginning that tree sap & etc etched into the paint if it wasn`t washed off within a few days . . . hence why I carry around one MF + bottle of detail spray and water in the hatch.



Tried taking photos of the damage, but the shine kept on interfering with the focus sensor on my SD450.



Here`s a pic of the other splat the bird left on the car . . .

http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d9/dmakca/bird1.jpg



And a zoomed out shot of the hood (one of the picture tries)



http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d9/dmakca/bird2.jpg



Stuff like this really kills the weekend . . . .



Anyways, back to the durability issue, is there anything else I could be doing to boost the durability of FMJ? On the day that I detailed I polished with IP, FPII and topped off with FTG. Then applied two layers of FMJ back to back . . . . the 3rd layer didn`t seem to want to really stick to the paint, so I waited a day later and dusted and applied a 3rd layer of FMJ. Perhaps a topper of a good polymer wax or maybe use SG underneath the FMG?



Love the FMJ look, but this still seriously puts the durability in question.



This shot was taken 7 months after zaino Z2pro (5 coats) + one salty NE winter

http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d9/dmakca/Photoshoot3-29med/Library-755.jpg



Almost am tempted to go back to zaino and use FMJ purely as a topper.



Dave

[SnipeJDM]

Yeah I wouldn`t blame FMJ. Bird sh!t ranges in acidity and some can eat through anything topped on your paint. Meat eating birds are the worst.

[TigerMike]

I do believe Zaino to be more durable/protective than FMJ, but it`s up to you really. :)

[imported_Amused]

3 coats of FMJ lasted me an entire New England winter. I don`t think it`s the product`s durability. If the bird ate some seriously acidic berries or whatnot, its poop will eat through any protection in a matter of minutes.

[AL-53]

I had these weeds near my yard called poke berries..they are a deep purple...and very acidic...when the birds eat these they sh!t like grape jelly..and it stains bad..when I had my other truck ..it got bombed with purple crap...it actually stained the clearcoat...and ate it up fast...nothing took the stains out....at the time I had Klasse twins and about 3 coats of collinite and it ate thru it ...I spent about 3 weeks getting rid of the weeds....it cost me about 50.00 in round-up ..but they are gone now...



the power of bird sh!t is powerful...



by the way...the bird bomb on your windshield looks like that bird had it`s daily fiber intake...



any ways sorry to hear about the mess you have ...



AL

[imported_Grouse]

I hear ya . . . . Audi also switched to a new waterbased paint for the 2006 models and I originally noticed from the beginning that tree sap & etc etched into the paint if it wasn`t washed off within a few days



where did you hear audi switched? If did they switch the paint and not the clear coat, or vice versus.

[crew219]

where did you hear audi switched? If did they switch the paint and not the clear coat, or vice versus.



It was actually on a service bulletin. A certain week of A3s had a defective paint job and it was mentioned in there. I was 2 weeks off of the defective week . . . who knows, some of it might have trickled over.



Dave

[crew219]

3 coats of FMJ lasted me an entire New England winter. I don`t think it`s the product`s durability. If the bird ate some seriously acidic berries or whatnot, its poop will eat through any protection in a matter of minutes.



You are spot on . . . . upon cleaning off the mess off my windshield, it looked as it there were partially digested berries of some sort.



Good to hear about the durability as well.



Dave

[imported_Grouse]

It was actually on a service bulletin. A certain week of A3s had a defective paint job and it was mentioned in there. I was 2 weeks off of the defective week . . . who knows, some of it might have trickled over.



Dave





If you get the tsb number i would like to read it. Thanks.

[crew219]

Well thanks everyone for restoring my faith in Menzerna. Truely just a stroke of bad luck.



The polishes were excellent and far better than anything I`ve used, most recent being the Sonus SFX series. Didn`t run into the issue with the product drying out and dusting as i`ve read on the forums. Maybe because I used the Sonus SFX 6" pads, or because I was diligent in keeping the surface misted with a light coat of distilled.



FMJ is definitely the slickest, brightest sealant / topper I`ve used so far. Really makes the red stand out. When compared to zaino, zaino seemed to have more of a deeper wetter glow, whereas FMJ made the paint appear one shade brighter and gives the paint an insane glare. Hopefully I can get 6 good months out of the FMJ. Salt is not my friend.



Any recommendations on a quick detailer that works well with FMJ? I can`t really justify the more expensive acrylic QDs (Menzerna, Sonus, Blackfire), but was looking at the chemicalguys QDs sold by the gallon. Any input is welcome.



Thanks



Dave

[crew219]

If you get the tsb number i would like to read it. Thanks.



I do not have the TSB# nor am I 100% sure it was a TSB . . . . could have just been a notice issued to the dealers making them aware of the issue.



This was one of the threads on AW.



http://forums.audiworld.com/a3/msgs/32908.phtml



I inquired about it at my dealer and he showed me a fax detailing the problem . . . just wanted to make sure that my car wasn`t affected.



Dave

[74 thing]

As others have stated it is more likely the acidity from the bird droppings then the FMJ. I mean it will eat through the clear coat in some instances if left on for a long time, so no matter what topper you have on you car it will not stand up.



I think Menzerna has a spray protection to extend the life of FMJ. I think properautocare.com carries it. I have been using FMJ for a while and am pleased with the durability, and I do have the spray as well but have switched to the OCW made by Optimum when I want to use a spray after washing. After washing and drying I just spray a little on a panel and buff on and off lightly with a microfiber and it looks fantastic and only take a few minutes to do the whole car.



Oh and you may want to try a chemical cleaner or keep a some handy in your trunk with a foam applicator and a microfiber so when the bird droppings appear you can use your QD to remove the dropping then hit it with the chemical cleaner on the foam pad so that etching will be eliminated. Better to stop the etching and have to deal with a little marring if you ask me. I have tried the P21S and the Meguiars chemical cleaners (I think they are DC and cleaner/wax), and they both work well.



Good luck.