No-Bama Care ?????

[Accumulator]

Ronkh- Oh, the stuff thats being "taught" to the upcoming generation...sigh...

And yeah...I guess I sometimes need the [sarcasm]...[/sarcasm] to correctly interpret...eh, I oughta recognize stuff thats not really so subtle as to be inscrutible given the source

That ...[we have to pass it to..." ]..was the stupidest statement I have ever heard...

Heh heh, "stupid" wasnt exactly the word I thought of, *especially* considering whence it came. "Insulting" was more my take on it. I read it as "We can say that and the Sheeple will accept it". Just the willingness to release such a statement speaks volumes IMO.

[Ronkh]

Heh heh, "stupid" wasnt exactly the word I thought of, *especially* considering whence it came. "Insulting" was more my take on it. I read it as "We can say that and the Sheeple will accept it". Just the willingness to release such a statement speaks volumes IMO.

Gross, will full, wanton negligence . A breach of oath, a breach of fiduciary responsibility.......... And the people of this country went and re elected most of em. So yeah, the sheeple accepted it with open arms.

[Bunky]

When I see the thread title my first thought is Crimson Tide.

[Ronkh]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GObKpWdwJA4

[rlmccarty2000]

The VA has been fixed more times than an MGs brake system. Now the thinking is to dismantle it, though it being a government organization I doubt that will ever happen. Too many civilian jobs lost, not that I care. The VA was set up to take care of Veterans, not give civilians jobs. I went through the BRAC stuff and listened to everyone that was affected by a base closing scream at the top of their lungs how it would be the end of the world because of the job loss for the surrounding town. Uh, who cares? Sometimes things dont make sense or over time no longer make sense. We still have a Marine base in the middle of South Georgia(dumb). We dont need a huge Navy anymore or for that matter a huge standing Army. Im for a military reduction, but a politician cannot say this without committing political suicide. Bill Clinton made huge cuts in the military (most people dont remember) now everyone loves him. We should take the savings from a smaller military and put them to fixing the crumbling infrastructure or just give the money back to the taxpayer (not happening).

[Ronkh]

Liquidation begins for failed Obamacare insurer

Hospitals and other providers may get a small portion of the money they are owed


Liquidation begins for failed Obamacare insurer Health Republic | Crain`s New York Business

[Ronkh]

Obamacare sticker shock: Price hikes are on the way

[Ronkh]

Obamacare sticker shock: Price hikes are on the way

And you know it`s gotta be worse since it`s msnbc reporting.

[BlkToy14]

I only read through part of the posts. Obamacare is a joke. Can`t believe Obama was re-elected after that.
A result of Obamacare. My employer provided affordable insurance for us. Cost him a bunch. It`s great insurance too.
Only problem is... Our doctors here, don`t want to do anything. It`s bad. Am sure the result of Obamacare.

I had an accident in jan of 15. Immediately no big injury. In the days after. Things developed. I had bad lower back pain that caused me to vomit. Not a good indicator. Doctors did nothing. I`ve had bad leg pain. In two different ways. Get nothing out of them. Chiropractor did help. Am just now getting closer to almost well.
I saw two doctors over that. Here I could just barely maintain walking is about all. I need to work. I`m semi retired. One idiot told me I`m just getting old. I`m only 57. Both exploited the visits to prescribe medication for cholesterol, and high blood pressure. Those two, along with a pain killer that would not put me to sleep. Result was almost having a heart attack. I dumped them. Haven`t taken any drugs since. Don`t like drugs. Haven`t seen any doctor since. Although I do have a reference to a doctor whom the person claims is actually good. I haven`t called him yet.
Needing to detail my car has helped. I just go out there. Enjoy myself. If I have to stop from pain. I do. Then continue. Last weekend. I was in a hurry. Rushed through, washing at car wash, rinseless wash, quick spray on wax. I was happy I actually rushed straight though all that. Didn`t have to stop because of pain.
I almost died from diabetes, 12 years ago. Type II. I cured it with lifestyle. Professionals here would look at me strange and say: Lifestyle? What do you mean? .... The diabetes was causing weight loss. Doctors have no treatment for it. Either it stops, or you die. I lost a total of 120 pounds before it stopped.
As a result of that. I looked into much alternative medicine. There is much out there that is common horse sense. It cures. It`s simple. Our medical world is about making money, not helping others.
We could start a thread on alternative medicine? I know of something that might help with the cluster headaches. I know it cured sinus headaches for me. Something you would think is nothing, won`t do anything. But it`s amazing in it`s basic common horse sense and treating you from the ground up.

[Ronkh]

Glad you`re feeling better

[tenblade2001]

W-O-W
Being a physician AND someone who has thoroughly vetted this topic (heck, at one time I thought a single-payer system was good at one point and I`ve actually read The Affordable Care Act), I believe I can contribute to the topic. Lets start from the beginning:
(1) The basic premise, and the justification put forth by supporters of The Affordable Care Act is that health care is a basic right. Q: Is that true? Even if one ignores the fact that this "right" is never mentioned in our Constitution nor The Bill of Rights, you have to acknowledge that EVERY right has an implied responsibility and failure to meet that responsibility means forfeiture of the right i.e. right to free speech but can`t yell fire in a theater . So if one has the right to healthcare, what is the implied responsibility? You have to take of yourself. But if you don`t, if there a penalty...NOPE. In fact, the physicians are penalized (thought satisfaction scores, "compliance" and "quality control" metrics). So, is there a "right" if there is no implied responsibility? The answer is no. To have one, you must have the other.
(2) "The cost of healthcare is skyrocketing due to (insert favorite villain...greedy doctors, big pharma, insurance companies).. eehh, a smidgen of truth, but mostly false. Healthcare cost are rising, but its mostly due to (a) increased cost of malpractice insurance. There is no penalty for a meritless lawsuit. So, it has become a game. The plaintiff`s attorney sues knowing that the hospital and malpractice insurance company will likely settle b/c it is cheaper than going to trial. If you question this, look at states like Tx and TN which have med-mal reform (vs. WV). Their operating cost are much lower. Secondly, meritless lawsuits have lead to "defensive" medicine. You order more test and more expensive test as a CYA (b) more "indigent" patients (... I use quotes b/c someone with a new iPhone than I have and $200 jeans is not indigent. They have other items they have deemed more valuable than health insurance) (c) more bureaucracy i.e. Joint Commission/JHCO. Hospitals and private practices have to hire "compliance officers" and spend a boat load of money to meet ever-changing "standards", moving goal post set in place by bureaucrats. When everyone meets the goal, the goal is changed. Why? b/c otherwise the bureaucrats would be out of a job. Another example...electronic medical records. A HUGE expense and little to no benefit to the patient. Nurses and physicians have to spend more time charting and less time taking care of patients. In addition, b/c the physician is overloaded they have to hire physician extenders i.e. physician assistants and nurse practitioners (d) increased cost of doing business i.e. having to hire multiple billing and collection people. When I perform a surgery, I have to get it precertified, then when I`m done submit a bill to the insurance company. Even if I have the precertification, they company will look and find any reason they can not to pay or pay less. In detailing terms, it would be a a customer coming in, you agree on a price for a two-stage correction and coating, but when they pick up the car, the pay you for a single stage...AND THERE`S NOTHING YOU CAN DO TO FIGHT IT...you just have to hand over the keys. This isn`t just the private companies, the worst offender is Medicare. (e) we have the capability to treat many conditions that used to be fatal but that treatment is expensive. Also, we have rising elderly population, who require more and more resources. In short, the cost of healthcare is rising, but its often due to the byproducts of government interference and frivolous lawsuits.
(3) The healthcare provided by single payer systems is just as good as the U.S. system- Again, there is a smidgen of truth. If you are young and relatively healthy...yes. Otherwise, not even close. All one has to do is look at the VA, the Canadian Health System or the British Health Service and you will see how bad a single payer system is. Look at the wait times for even "common surgeries" like hernia repairs or cardiac bypass....months. You know where most of the cardiac bypass patients come from in Mizzou Montana??? Canada. Healthcare IS rationed. In the UK, hospitals are given a certain amount of spinal fixation instruments.When they use it up, guess what? The surgery is either delayed or the patient is placed in traction; a treatment we haven`t used here in DECADES. If you have a skin cancer, your primary doctor can not directly refer you to a plastic surgeon or MOHs surgeon. They must refer to a dermatologist first (months to get appointment) who then refers to MOHs or plastic surgeon..several more months. In that amount of the time the skin cancer grows and turns what could have been a small operation into a major undertaking. OR time is rationed. There are only a set number of cases that will be done...period. Ask any surgeon that has spent a significant amount of time in a VA and they will all have a story about trying to get an emergency case done and encountering a significant delay vs. not getting to do it till the next day. So, why is a single payer system attractive? b/c the gov can control the cost of care AND NOT BE SUED. It is EXTREMELY hard to sue the VA and next to impossible to sue the UK system. The burden of proof is much higher AND in the UK, looser pays both attorney`s fees. Med-Mal or ambulance chasing is not the cottage industry that it is here.
(4) There are over 25 million uninsured Americans and they need coverage- Again, there is a smidgen of truth. Yes, there is an estimated 25 million people without coverage BUT that number includes (a) illegal aliens and (b) younger Americans that CHOOSE not to buy insurance.

Are there any benefits to The Affordable Care Act? Yes. The pre-existing conditions is a much needed reform but pretty much everything else sucks and it`s only going to get worse. I agree with many of the post; the system is broke. What will it take to fix it? (a) reduced bureaucracy (b) less but meaningful, data driven reform and policies/quality measures (c) med-mal reform (THIS IS HUGE...if you look at states with med-mal reform, like TX vs. physician hostile states like WV, there is no comparison in the quality of care and its delivered for much less) (d) increased competition...allow insurance companies to sell across state lines (e) health savings accounts: if people are paying for their healthcare there will be better stewards of their health AND they will insist on the best value.

Obamacare is a Trojan Horse. It`s purpose is to push and already broke system to the point of no return. At which point, the government will step in and take it over.

[Bunky]

I am still waiting for viable alternatives by those opposed to it. Many of the actions mention in the post do not require completely abolishing Obamacare and go back to the GOP No care method. The party of opposition never proposed any health care initiatives (just blame) so they got Obamacare and Trump...

[Ronkh]

I am still waiting for viable alternatives by those opposed to it. Many of the actions mention in the post do not require completely abolishing Obamacare and go back to the GOP No care method. The party of opposition never proposed any health care initiatives (just blame) so they got Obamacare and Trump...

The party of no ?!?!?!?!?!

Al, use your navel as a periscope..........

When Ocare was done, there was absolutely NO republican involvement.... Not due to the Republicans, but due to a super majority of Dems (ya know those guys that didn`t read what they were passing.......) Maybe, just maybe if any Republican had been involved we might have had an alternative..

As far as anyone putting forth an alternative since, well it would not even be entertained as dirty harry and his gang would scuttle it as well as the ego maniac O would veto it.........

It may help you to understand if you opened your mind and eyes instead of spouting the party line.

just a thought.

[tenblade2001]

I am still waiting for viable alternatives by those opposed to it. Many of the actions mention in the post do not require completely abolishing Obamacare and go back to the GOP No care method. The party of opposition never proposed any health care initiatives (just blame) so they got Obamacare and Trump...

Several alternatives were listed: (1) repeal all but a select few provision of the ACA (2) allow insurance companies to sell across state lines (3) Med-meal reform (4) HSA
nearly all the promises of the ACA have proven false 1) you can not keep your plan or your doctor if you like them... Saying you can but have to pay more is lawyer-ese ie bending the truth. It`s not your plan , if you`re paying 2-3X what you did before (2) having the ACA plans do not guarantee you will be seen. MANY doctors are not accepting the plans (3) it is not saving more but costing SIGNIFICANTLY more... See the latest CBO projections.

The "part of no" is a pretty tired and worn out stereotype. Alternatives have been presented but they are not as palatable as the "insurance " uber ales crowd.

[Ronkh]

But I can get birth control pills..............................