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Which steam cleaner do you recommend - Daimer vs Dupray Tosca vs VX5000?


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#1 mleun481

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Posted 21 March 2012 - 07:58 AM

I'm considering a steam cleaner for detailing my car and also for household use. I'm not a professional detailer but am willing to spend the money for quality. As of today, they all offer free shipping. Given the prices and quality of each one, which one is the best value? Any other brands/models that should be short listed? Thanks

VX5000 ($795)
Steam Cleaner - Steam Cleaners - Vapor Cleaner - Commercial Steam Cleaners

Daimer KleenJet Pro Plus 200S ($887)
Commercial Vapor Steam Cleaners - Daimer KleenJet PRO PLUS 250S

Dupray Tosca Steam Cleaner ($996)
Tosca Commercial Strength Vapor Steam Cleaner from Dupray

#2 C. Charles Hahn

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Posted 21 March 2012 - 08:24 AM

I just recently picked up a Dupray Hill Injection and after using it a few times now I have to say, it's an absolutely FANTASTIC machine. Worth every penny, and a huge departure from the typical consumer grade steamers on the market.

That being the case, I wouldn't hesitate to jump on the Tosca if you're on a tighter budget.
Charlie
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http://www.cchautoappearance.com/

#3 Accumulator

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Posted 21 March 2012 - 08:41 AM

Huh, the "Steam Box" model from Dupray appears to be absolutely identical to the Daimer 1500C that I have, but Tosca lists a *very* much higher output pressure :think:

mleun481- Welcome to Autopia!

Whatever you go with, I'd get one with higher specs that you think you'll ever need (voice of experience ;) ).

No complaints with Daimer, though the customer service rep I've spoken with had a mighty thick (Eastern European) accent and wasn't exactly the most humble guy I've ever spoken with (that's OK, I'm not either ;) ).
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#4 mleun481

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Posted 21 March 2012 - 10:26 AM

I definitely want to avoid the consumer grade steams. I'll be using it for the car but being able to use it in the house is a plus. I've read from a few places that you should not use a steam cleaner on alloy wheels. That can't be true - can it?

#5 D&D Auto Detail

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Posted 21 March 2012 - 04:26 PM

I have the Tosca from Dupray. While I love the machine, their customer service is terrible. I will not buy another product from them. The specs of the Diamer machine looks exactly the same, and for $100 cheaper.

#6 C. Charles Hahn

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Posted 21 March 2012 - 05:03 PM

I have the Tosca from Dupray. While I love the machine, their customer service is terrible. I will not buy another product from them. The specs of the Diamer machine looks exactly the same, and for $100 cheaper.


Interesting, what sort of problems have you had with Dupray customer service? My machine is only a couple weeks old and performing perfectly at this point so I haven't had to deal with them post-sale at all yet.
Charlie
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http://www.cchautoappearance.com/

#7 Accumulator

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Posted 22 March 2012 - 08:23 AM

I definitely want to avoid the consumer grade steams. I'll be using it for the car but being able to use it in the house is a plus. I've read from a few places that you should not use a steam cleaner on alloy wheels. That can't be true - can it?


I've used steamers on alloy wheels with zero problems, in fact it wasn't potent enough so I used other methods. Just be careful if the finish is compromised/flaking/etc. To be honest, I don't see how people use 'em on wheels with great results; I have a potent steamer and my wheels are never all that nasty, but it just doesn't work out for me.

You just have to be a little careful working on wheels or anything else, and remember that a lot of the caveats are just CYA-type advice. Reminds me of how tire manufacturers said you shouldn't use a pressure washer to clean wheels because it can mess up the tire beads; that is true, but it's easy enough to avoid an "oops!" and get away with it if you're careful. Heh heh, you can get away with a whole lot of ill-advised steamer applications if you're careful (and maybe a little lucky).

I *have* used a steamer with good results on (cad plated) brake calipers, funny that it worked on them but not on the wheels, huh? :nixweiss

BTW, it was those calipers that convinced me to get the good Daimer steamer (model 1500C). My other one has only *slightly* lower specs but it just couldn't do the job. Incredible diff between the two machines, espeically considering how close those specs are!

And ya know..when somebody says they had awful customer service from a steamer company, I'd stay away! Steamers can have issues, issues that you'll want to DIY instead of shipping it off, and I'd sure want to deal with OK folks when that happens. The guy at Daimer might be kinda full of himself, but that was OK by me; he *is* the expert and his advice was spot-on. Hey, I can be full of myself too :chuckle:
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#8 Greg Gellas

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Posted 22 March 2012 - 09:08 AM

I don't know of any other detailers using them but I have a Polti steamer basically its the 2085 just an older version. It has never failed me, and it takes a beating too. Might look into one of them :D

#9 DaVinciAutoSpa

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Posted 04 April 2012 - 07:59 AM

OP, why do you want to avoid comsumer grade steamers?

I have a Wagner unit that I paid $99 for and it does a great job. Granted, not as fast as those big commercial units, but you mentioned it's for your car and house. Am I missing something, seems like overkill.

#10 Accumulator

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Posted 04 April 2012 - 08:07 AM

OP, why do you want to avoid comsumer grade steamers?

I have a Wagner unit that I paid $99 for and it does a great job. Granted, not as fast as those big commercial units, but you mentioned it's for your car and house. Am I missing something, seems like overkill.


The reasons why I try to steer people away from consumer-grade steamers are:

-I've had them fail in ways that resulted in scalding of the user
-I've had them fail in the middle of jobs where the steamer was utterly essential
-I've encountered numerous situations where a steamer of low/moderate power simply couldn't do the job regardless of how long it was employed

All that said, I'll hop over to the other side of the fence and say that:

-As you're saying, they can work great for some people, satisfaction with a steamer depends on a lot of things
-My father had a little Steam Buggy unit that he was utterly thrilled with, and it never let him down
-If somebody's never gonna spend big bucks on a steamer, a less expensive one can sure be better than no steamer at all
The most interesting man in all of Autopia Land. (<--I didn't enter that!)

#11 mleun481

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Posted 04 April 2012 - 08:22 AM

For me, I've had less expensive steamers (forgot the brand) that didn't really have the power to me. If theres a steamer thats good enough for the professional detailer and affordable, then it should be good enough for me. I am not running a detailing business but like many others, I take my detailing seriously and just want the best that I can get. If I get a consumer grade steamer and then post that its not meeting my expectations, I will bet someone will say thats what you get for getting a consumer grade steamer. Or, why would you expect a consumer grade product to be the same as an industrial grade one. (or something to that effect).

#12 chefwong

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Posted 13 April 2012 - 08:54 AM

Can't really compose my thoughts, but here goes.
Had the VX.
Have the Hill Injection.
Love alot of things about the hill injection.
Some things seem like a afterthought like their *bumper rubber* that is on the unit.
Water Injection is pretty badass - I just used it on my Miele laundry washer...
I actually bought it cause I LOVED at 1st sight their floor mop attachment. It's AMAZING on wood floors and that one was def. a industrial/commerical spec design. Less plastic, more metal

#13 bobwires

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Posted 05 May 2012 - 03:30 PM

I have noticed in the specs that the industrial units, say an Optima, have a lot higher pressure. When you go from 72 to 145 psi, how big of a difference is that in time-per-vehicle?

Is the $5000 industrial unit worth it in time saved compared to the $1000 commercial models?

#14 Accumulator

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Posted 06 May 2012 - 11:54 AM

I have noticed in the specs that the industrial units, say an Optima, have a lot higher pressure. When you go from 72 to 145 psi, how big of a difference is that in time-per-vehicle?



That'd be a huge difference! Just going from ~75 to ~90 was enough of a diff to move from "can't do the job" to "works really well".

Is the $5000 industrial unit worth it in time saved compared to the $1000 commercial models?


Eh, not sure how anybody can anwer that one for you :think: What are you planning to do with it?
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#15 bobwires

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Posted 06 May 2012 - 05:13 PM

We detail a couple cars a day at the busiest time of year. It's a small part of my overall business. $5k a month or so

We have TONS of road tar, and run out of water sometimes. I think a steamer will be the way to go.

#16 Kevin Brown

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Posted 06 May 2012 - 06:30 PM

As we discussed a while back on the phone, Accumulator... the Rule of 18 is VERY important when cleaning with water.

It states that for every 18 degrees of increased temperature OVER 118 degrees, the energy instilled into water doubles.

Therefore, the cleaning potential of the water essentially doubles, too. Not exactly due to losses, but easy to remember.

118 to 136 = 2x cleaning power
136 to 154 = 2x cleaning power
154 to 172 = 2x cleaning power
172 to 190 = 2x cleaning power
208 to 226 = 2x cleaning power
226 to 244 = 2x cleaning power

And so on.

Don't ask me what happens if we start at something like 120 degrees. I don't do LONG arithmetic. YOU deal with it.

#17 JPostal

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Posted 06 May 2012 - 08:50 PM

I bought a used Daimer but called Dupray to order some attachments since they are in Canada and shipping would be more convenient for me. The rep at Dupray told me the machines come out of the same factory in Italy and are pretty much identical. The customer service at Dupray was not gre due to the language barrier (french Canadian), but the folks at Daimer did not even respond to my request for info.
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#18 C. Charles Hahn

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Posted 06 May 2012 - 11:09 PM

I have noticed in the specs that the industrial units, say an Optima, have a lot higher pressure. When you go from 72 to 145 psi, how big of a difference is that in time-per-vehicle?

Is the $5000 industrial unit worth it in time saved compared to the $1000 commercial models?


The main advantage where higher pressure is concerned is the amount of effective penetration the steam will have. The super-fine atomized water that steamers generate cools very quickly as it gets farther away from the tip of the tool's nozzle. The higher the pressure output from the machine, the farther the steam can travel before it cools to a point where it is no longer effective for cleaning tasks. As it remains effective for a longer period of time, it makes the emulsification and extraction of dirt and other grime much easier, requiring fewer passes to get the same job done.

As far as the cost justifying the savings, that all depends on exactly how much you're going to be relying on the steamer to do as opposed to cleaning via other means. Keep in mind that while steam is an excellent and highly effective tool in a great many situations, there are also just as many times where it's not necessarily the best/safest choice.

That said, you can get pretty close to the high pressure levels of an industrial unit with a higher end commercial unit like the Dupray Hill Injection (which I have) that puts out 121psi. And the price tag is about half of what the $5000 industrial unit would set you back.
Charlie
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http://www.cchautoappearance.com/

#19 Accumulator

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Posted 07 May 2012 - 10:37 AM

Kevin Brown- Speaking of "you do the math"...we never did figure out if/how the Rule of 18 applies to the *pressure* diffs did we?!? That's what really got my attention with regard to the unit bobwires was looking at.

Hey, did you ever decide on a steamer for yourself? As we were discussing, note what JPostal posted about those two units coming from the same factory.

JPostal- Aha, I just *knew* those "Steambox Mini" machines had to be related! What I can't figure out is why the specs are so different with (this is from memory, so give me some latitude here...) the Daimer being rated so much lower in the PSI department :confused:
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#20 JPostal

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Posted 07 May 2012 - 07:29 PM

Kevin Brown- Speaking of "you do the math"...we never did figure out if/how the Rule of 18 applies to the *pressure* diffs did we?!? That's what really got my attention with regard to the unit bobwires was looking at.

Hey, did you ever decide on a steamer for yourself? As we were discussing, note what JPostal posted about those two units coming from the same factory.

JPostal- Aha, I just *knew* those "Steambox Mini" machines had to be related! What I can't figure out is why the specs are so different with (this is from memory, so give me some latitude here...) the Daimer being rated so much lower in the PSI department :confused:


There may be the odd tweak but from what I can tell the machines are identical. Dupray does have a wider selection of attachments though. Check out this little beauty I got in the mail today..."Extraction" handpiece that works with the KleenJet 5000 steam vac. Can't wait to try it out.

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