Quick Detailing, Wholesale Detailing, Fleet Detailing - Underrepresented Here?

[DutrowLLC]

This is exactly the kind of thing I am talking about. It is extremely challenging to figure out exactly what a customer's needs are and provide a job that fits their needs. If you do too much, they are paying more than they are comfortable with. If don't do enough, they are angry because you did a bad job. It was really hard for me to figure out how to handle this type of situation.

This detail shop that did cheap work, but did it badly, I agree, that is bad business. You don't want customers to walk away dissatisfied, you want customers to walk away feeling like they got a good deal, more than they bargained for.

It is a whole different skill set to be able to do work that is inexpensive but still holds a lot of value. There is a challenge to striking that perfect balance between price and quality to produce optimal value. And that is a big challenge that people like me face.

* Is there a way to do it almost as good but three times as fast?
* Is there a product that works just as well but costs 1/4 as much?
* etc...

As far as the either/or of doing Premium Work vs. Inexpensive work. My top if the line detail is around $300, its a nice package. But I draw the line at heavy scratch removal with a rotary, removing wheels to do the inside, etc. because I've found that I make less money and spend more time on the really high end customers because there arebn't many of them and they come with a whole different set of needs, a different business system. I like to keep things simple, it reduces my risk. And I've had to turn away almost 0 customers because they wanted more than what I was willing to do.

Originally Posted by Accumulator

DutrowLLC- I can see your point and IMO there are different levels of detailing, suitable to different types of clientele.

Indeed, a lot of folks/companies just want the vehicle(s) to look better "after" than the do "before" and I don't see a point in begrudging those customers what they want. IMO getting those vehicles ~perfect would be pointless as they'll just get marred up again and before long you'd have to quit correcting the paint anyhow as you'd run out of clear. To some people cars are just appliances- and IMO there's nothing wrong with that. And there's nothing wrong with wanting an appliance to look decent.

And there's nothing wrong with wanting to make money at your chosen profession, which depends on giving your customers what they want at a price they'll pay.

There have been a few members here who have operated along the lines that you described, but it seems that they are no longer active here. Too bad IMO, as I'd like for Autopia to offer something to *anyone* involved in detailing at any level, not just those of us who strive for perfection.

I can't help but see a parallel to individual car owners who want advice along the lines of "clay and cleaner-wax" levels of involvement. I sure don't want to just blow those folks off and tell 'em it's either concours-level or nothing.

OTOH, A detail shop in my area started out doing what I considered shoddy, production-line work (their "afters" looked worse than any of my "befores"). I've noticed that these days they seem to be turning out some *very* nice jobs on some vehicles (at least they look a lot better than they used to when I drive by). It's the same company, but they're sure doing a different level of work on *some* of the vehicles they do. I would think this is the sort of thing that can evolve if the market warrants it, so I do think it pays to keep an open mind. What if you could do what you're doing now, and also make money doing great work on a few cars for people who want the best? Guess I don't see it as an either/or type of thing.

[jeteast99]

I have a few questions. Do you run the business out of a shop or are you mobile? Whats the majority of the work, wash and waxes?

[DutrowLLC]

Originally Posted by NCZ13

i dont feel that its the same level of work alot of us do here.

i find it impossible that having a car washed, clayed, compounded, polished, sealed, vacced and QD on the interior can be done right in 3 hours.

in my opinion its businesses like yours that give us enthusiasts and weekend warriors a hard time. they wont come to us and pay us the amount of money it takes to get the car done right, when they can go to you for significantly cheaper thinking they are getting the same level of work alot of us do.

again its great that your making money off of this, but for alot of us it isnt about making money. its an addiction, its a passion.

I totally agree, these are different services. I have a whole method of cummunicating to customers what they can expect from each service. If you mess this up, you're screwed.

And you're right, you'll lost some customers to people like me. Thats what competition is. But there is a reason why competative economies work and non-competative ones don't. Because without innovation and adaption, there is no progress. People like me also open up the market to more customers. I take some customers who would rather pay less and get less, but if given the choice between all or nothing, will take all. But I also make customers out of people who want the cheaper stuff and if given a choice between all or nothing, would take nothing. I create options for people.

I laughed the first time a car dealer asked me to detail a car for $120. Now I know how to do them for $85 and make a tidy profit.

And the $30 details? This was a gift from the company to its employees. People who make average wages. Most of these people would never have the means to pay for a detail. But they got a great service for a great price all while they worked at their desks. And I agree that these high-end details are impressive feats. But what about getting 10 day laborers to do a good, fast, and efficient job on 70 vehicles their first day on the job? Is this not worth discussing?

Though I think my impact on the retail end is exagerrated. I don't drive to cusomer's houses for cheap details. The cheapest full detail I do is $160 and I avoid scheduling those. I have an exterior only for $100. I HATE scheduling those. But when things get dry, they keep my guys busy and paid. My average cost for a detailing is $220.

[DutrowLLC]

Originally Posted by jeteast99

I have a few questions. Do you run the business out of a shop or are you mobile? Whats the majority of the work, wash and waxes?

I run it out f my house. We are 100% mobile.

About half is retail work. Average cost: $220. (Things are expensive in the DC Metro)

I started out with all retail, but have slowly been learning the wholesale side and found it to be more consistent and more profitable, just not as straight forward to learn.

[David Fermani]

From direct experience, Volume/wholesale detailing & Autopian style of detail are complete polar opposites. Personally, if you desire to make an unlimited amount of income, owning a successful volume operation is the only way!

[getcha]

I see both sides, and with this people autopia, I think for the most of us here our work borders compulsion and perfection.

I think pretty much the bottom line is, if you want to put yourself in business as far as clean/detailing cars you have to offer what the "market" and i use that lightly, will go for.

For one person who might say to himself "I'm only doing concours level work, nothing else", he might get a great $600+ once a year detail thats great however if nobody else wants that I hope he has a second business.... On the flip side, if it would never be worth your time to do anything other than top dollar concours type work, then thats great for that guy too.

That being said, I work only by word of mouth/ referrals, and some of the referrals even from people who pay hundreds more than I could ever justify(fortunatly I am my own detailer), these customers I periodically get calls from want your simple wash/wax/vac/wipedown style as above. Am I going to say no eventhough the majority of my customers pay 10x what that would cost this person? Hell no. I have bills to pay, graduate school tuition to pay, rapport to build with customers and a quality unrivalled service to provide.

You go to where the market is. Depending on the situation if you don't you might be broke or offer unsellable services.

That being said, it's Saturday night my friends...I'll holler.

[NSXTASY]

IMO, I think your looking for the tunnel wash forum, there is one, however, I dont recall the URL.

PM Deanski, he knows the name.

[themightytimmah]

Originally Posted by David Fermani

From direct experience, Volume/wholesale detailing & Autopian style of detail are complete polar opposites. Personally, if you desire to make an unlimited amount of income, owning a successful volume operation is the only way!

Different games. Customers are the headaches in high-end work, employees are the headache in volume work.

Tell 'em the screwdriver story Dave .

[JuneBug]

I see both sides too. My regular job is selling service contracts on electrical equipment - back up systems for data centers, hopitals, banks, millitary - ok you get the idea! Anyway, battery maintenance is a big part of our business and we charge a lot for it. It can be risky, dangerous work but 99% of the time, anyone with a basic knowledge of DC systems and a few hundred bucks worth of tools - can charge HALF! what we charge and still make a sh!t load of money. Are they as good? They could be, and we've had field engineers decide to quit and do batt jobs - less hassle, they already have a relationship with customers and they make more money. Bottom line is - especially in this economy, people are looking for the best bang for the buck. And like Accumulator pointed out - most people are NOT autopians and don't fell the need (desire?) to get a car 100%, they want their daily driver cleaned and waxed and they ain't going to pay a lot for it. Dutrow - you may be on to something, stick with it - I wish you the best.

[Setec Astronomy]

This whole thread gave me a funny thought. I think the typical Autopian pro, works alone (or sometimes with another Autopian), precisely because of the OCD nature of an Autopian. The self-satisfaction, as well as the non-reliance on other people (who might not be quite as compulsive).

And just to repeat myself and echo some of the other members, there's certainly room for everybody in this world, and on this forum. I think it's just a big business/small business dichotomy, and as I said above, I think the general Autopian mindset lends itself to the latter.

[07e90]

This thread is like going to a Prius forum and talking about Hummer owners not being represented...

[todd@bsaw]

I will link you to my previous thread with a similar premise:
Levels of 'Professional' detailing


It appears that Setec had missed that thread because it lacks any cynical posts from him (or any of the other aloof posts). This site isn't exclusive to any certain type of detailing. It is those members that make it an imaginary exclusive club.

We discuss detailing in many different levels. No type of detailing is 'not allowed'. I have especially found it more accepting in the Professional forum than the General Discussion...
I wonder why...