What would you charge?

[SamIam]

I walked past a new black BMW 7 series today sitting in a restaurant parking lot at lunch today. Black, looked shiny, but as I got closer, I saw what looked like a 3-D version of the Statue of Liberty projecting from the hood. Wow, either this guy is super patriotic, or someone messed up his car. I left a note on it saying I can fix your hood.

He called before I was done with lunch and asked me to stop by. Anyways, he said it was only or mostly the hood, and asked how it could happen. I told him someone buffed it incorrectly. He said he used a chamy on it and asked what that could do to it. I told him probably cause some scratches. Anyways, he asked if I was bonded, I told him no. He was concerned about turning over his $80K car to me. I told him I show him my black Audi A8 and remove some marring induced by my wife wiping it down. He said great, come on over, and teach me what I need to know. He also asked, what would you charge? I told him I didn't know till I got a better look. He said he was going to charge the dealership anyways.

What would YOU charge to buff out a hood and remove a bunch of buffer induced swirl marks? By the way, I plan on using 1Z Paint Polish, maybe Ultra Polish by PC, and Glanz Wax, maybe topped with some S100, not sure about the S100.

Thanks,

Sam

[Greg]

$40/hour.

[bretfraz]

Originally posted by Greg
$40/hour.

Agreed!

[rlspringer]

Oh Yea!

[Scottwax]

Ditto. $40 or so an hour for swirl removal, oxidation removal, etc.

[Neil Chadwick]

Evaluate the situation as it pertains to future business...First you have to build his trust in you...Second the client has to have confidence you can obtain results that are satisfactory to him,not you!..I would use the marketing approach that the client should pay for your polishes at a very modest cost..What does it really cost you?...$3-4?....say $10 to him...Then if he is satisfied he should let you do the whole car and you will probably get his friends by word of mouth...A little good will on your part can and will go along way...it is a gamble but not a very large one that could bring you a lot of future revenue..Remember the reason you went into this business was probably based on you love to do this kind of work not how much money you can make...Take care of him and show him how good you really are,after 35+ years in this business I promise you you won't be sorry..If he turns out to be not such a desired client and stiffs you...what have you really lost?....if he turns out to be what I think he will be,it wil be a major hook-up for you....Neil Chadwick,Norfolk,VA

[Scottwax]

Originally posted by Neil Chadwick
Evaluate the situation as it pertains to future business...First you have to build his trust in you...Second the client has to have confidence you can obtain results that are satisfactory to him,not you!..I would use the marketing approach that the client should pay for your polishes at a very modest cost..What does it really cost you?...$3-4?....say $10 to him...Then if he is satisfied he should let you do the whole car and you will probably get his friends by word of mouth...A little good will on your part can and will go along way...it is a gamble but not a very large one that could bring you a lot of future revenue..Remember the reason you went into this business was probably based on you love to do this kind of work not how much money you can make...Take care of him and show him how good you really are,after 35+ years in this business I promise you you won't be sorry..If he turns out to be not such a desired client and stiffs you...what have you really lost?....if he turns out to be what I think he will be,it wil be a major hook-up for you....Neil Chadwick,Norfolk,VA

I understand your point, but if he only charges $10 for the hood and the guy decides he then wants the whole car detailed, he is going to balk at paying $100 or so to properly polish and seal the paint, especially if swirl removal is needed. Based on $10 for the hood, the guy will probably think $40-50 is reasonable for the whole car. If you would then agree to that price and the customer is happy, then he tells his friends he has a detailer who only charges $40-50 to polish and wax cars and you then end up doing a bunch of car for a cheap price or maybe making a lot of people mad when you won't do their car that cheaply.

Personally, I think it is better to start off with a proper price scale and make sure your work matches what you are charging.

[Neil Chadwick]

If you set up the sale correctly he will know right from the beginning what range you charge for a full detail,how much of a deal he really is getting and the nature of the work....if you base everything you do on the almighty dollar you will join the rest of the detailers who don't have the luxury of choosing their customers and the quality of cars you work on daily....but being forced to do the gross,mistreated,who cares cars just to make money and stay afloat....After all the years I have done this I now have the option of saying no to whomever I feel.....I do National show winning cars,private collections and have an exclusive agreement with a top notch body/resto shop to do all their work before the customer get their car back..some restos exceed 100K.....some cars have value in excess of 500K!!..my work starts at $100/hr...I have only gotten to this level because I earned it and had to produce the quality results combined with service day in and day out.Sometimes this required doing spot work for a client or helping out one of their friends in a bind..Usually a N/C by me..I have NEVER advertised my business or myself in 35+ years so a N/C now and then or a quick spot repair for little money is the best and most cost effective way to promote yourself...The only advice I will galdly pass along is as a consumer when someone comes at me with a price approach I always go the other way...when someone approaches me with a confident,let me show you attitude and is willing to make the first move I will always give them a chance and become very loyal and galdly spread the word to help them...when you are passionate about something the money always comes...when you are into anything for just money,it shows.....it will always be your choice!!

[Scottwax]

Neil, like I said, I see where you are coming from, but I see detailers all the time end up going down because they offer too many deals or are too willing to haggle on price. I made the mistake when I was first starting out of trying to be the cheapest in town to get business. All I ended up with is crap cars and bargain hunters. Once I raised my prices, I started getting a better class of cars. I also haven't had to do any type of advertising since 1996, save for a listing in the yellow pages (listing only, no ad). Word of mouth is the best form of advertising there is and when the new customer calls, they are already sold on your services and simply want to set up an appointment.

If someone is just starting out detailing, yes, you may have to cut a deal or two, but you need to be very upfront about your regular prices.

I also agree if you are only about money, you will fail. If you are about the quality of the work, the money will soon follow.

[Neil Chadwick]

In the original post from SamIam just the fact he would like an opinion on price suggests he doesn't have the years behind him to make that judgement...The tips I gave him are wisdom from my experiences and the fact that I have probably been detailing and restoring cars and having it my source of income longer than most people on this board have been alive?........The purpose of this forum is to share our wisdom,knowledge and experience.......So understand my answer....It is to help a less experienced professional...It is also very bad advice to give anyone price guidelines even on this forum...What sells for $10 in your area might sell for $20 in mine.Rent in my area might be 3x what you pay..Insurance might be 5x..also without ever seeing the job and it's overall condition even a guidelline can be risky...agree?...No advice is far better than bad advice

[bretfraz]

Neil,

With all due respect, you're not the only person here with wisdom, experience, and knowledge of the business. There are many here with decades of experience.

You're right when you state we're all here to share.... so let's share. You're entitled to your opinion of "bad advice" but how about let the recipient decide what is good and bad? People need guidelines to help them make decisions. You offered yours, Scott offered his, I offered mine, etc. That's what this community is all about. Don't stifle it with, "I've been doing this longer than you've been alive" stuff. That doesn't play well here.

You may be an old hand at detailing but you're new to this forum and community. I hope you understand where I'm coming from and become a contributor to Autopia instead of trying to be Big Daddy. We're not children here, please don't treat us like one.

Respectfully,

- - Bretfraz - -

[Scottwax]

Originally posted by Neil Chadwick
The tips I gave him are wisdom from my experiences and the fact that I have probably been detailing and restoring cars and having it my source of income longer than most people on this board have been alive?

And that makes your advice much better than mine how? I also speak from experience. I've been detailing 12 years now, nearly 10 of that full time as my only source of income. I know the mistakes I made starting out when it comes to pricing and I don't want to see others do the same thing. If you want to get high end clientel, you cannot be too cheap. Someone who pays $70,000 for a BMW 7 series isn't worried about saving $10 here and there provided they get quality work. If Sam tells the guy he will remove the swirls and reseal the hood for $10, the customer is going to seriously wonder why he is willing to do the job so cheaply...most likely thinking he is either using poor quality products or is desperate for work. Either scenario is not good, nor is it professional.

When I first starting detailing full time, my first real high end customer (who had a Rolls Silver Spur and a lowered and body kitted 560SEL) seemed offended when I offered him a multicar discount. He told me never to be afraid to ask for what I thought my work was worth. I believed that to be good advice and nearly 10 years later, I still regularly detail his cars (currently a Bentley Continental SC, Lamborghini Diablo, Mercedes S600, Cadillac EXT, 3 Harleys and a 44' coach).