Removing wheels

efnfast · 11-07-09, 09:42

For those who remove wheels to clean them, I'm curious if you carry some type of mechanics insurance (i.e., something beyond any type of insurance you'd carry as a detailer), in the event something ever happens.

I know obsessive compulsive autopeans will torque the nuts on properly and check them 4x to be certain, but if something happens as the person's driving away (not due to your own fault), you can bet whose going to be included in any lawsuit.

David Fermani · 11-07-09, 09:47

There's no such thing as "Mechanics Insurance". This type of loss would fall under a General Liabilty portion of a policy which is pretty standard.

efnfast · 11-07-09, 11:38

Really? I figured there was specifically some type of policy for doing mechanical-based work on vehicles....the risks/damages/etc... a detailer faces would be different than a mechanic or bodyshop, so I figured the policies would be different to reflect that.

the_invisible · 11-08-09, 12:37

You can always incorporate your business so that your personal assets will not be affected by any liabilities pertaining to your detailing business. Incroporation, however, makes tax and profit calculations more difficult. Your profits come in the form of "dividends".

Otherwise, a trustworthy torque wrench is still the way to go. Sometimes you cannot avoid damages completely due to other external factors.

Speaking of torquing wheel lug nuts, I was helping someone replace the brake pads and rotors on his 2004 Tundra. While putting everything back together, one of the lug nuts on the hub snaps off for no apparent reason. Turns out that the owner of the truck had a tire repaired by a tire shop, and the shop over torqued his wheel lug nuts.

When this sort of thing happens, it gets awkward. You did not cause any damage, but the damage occurs while you are working on the vehicle. If you can avoid removing the wheels to clean the car, avoid removing the wheels to clean the car. Period.

RustyBumper · 11-08-09, 04:31

I have a question regarding torqueing. How do you know or find out how much torque is required for wheels, on different vehicles?

jDizzle · 11-08-09, 04:42

some companies put it in their owners manual.. im lucky to have access to alldata at my school.. thought its only for like 6 more months.. i suppose after then id just use common sense... perhaps you could just use a simple internet search for each car you're going to remove the wheels from and use common sense, as in, if someone says 40 foot pounds, and another person says 190 foot pounds. they're wayy off base.. **most** will be within 75-110.

the_invisible · 11-08-09, 06:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by RustyBumper

I have a question regarding torqueing. How do you know or find out how much torque is required for wheels, on different vehicles?

When in doubt, 85lb-ft is always a safe setting for passenger vehicles. From a Honda Civic to a Tundra, the OEM wheel nut torque range is approximately about 80-90lb-ft of torque. The exact amount of torque is not as important as equal torquing between all lug nuts. The class, grade, and thread pitch used by many wheel studs and nuts are capable of about 120lb-ft of torque safely. They can handle this kind of torque and stress without any problem. Manufacturers usually suggest a lower torque specification for easy removal.

David Fermani · 11-08-09, 06:16

These are what I use to use:

Professional torque sticks, sockets, multipliers and extension bars

unleashedfury · 11-08-09, 10:36

Removing the wheels for a detail would fall under general liability.

Napa puts out a guide its desinged more for a brake/tire shop. But it has all the wheel torque specs for EVERY vehicle updated every year. I think it costs 30 bux.

Its not about OCD autopians for torqing lugnuts. Its actually industry standard.

When you tighten a nut. The threads "stretch" The more you tighten the more you stretch. Which can eventually cause failure as seen in the previous posters picture of a snapped off wheel lug stud. When you overtighten a nut. You put extra stress on the threads of the lug stud. Metals are treated to be a certain strength. By alloying and Heat Treating. Based on its end use If it was designed to handle lets say 100ft. Lbs. of torque. It can handle much more But will be stressed stretched, causing thread damage and eventual failure

On top of that. Torqing wheels are for preventing rotor damage. as you can warp the rotor easier by overtightening lugnuts And in the even the owner gets a flat tire And needs to change it on the side of the road. Its easier to remove lugs that are properly torqued vs. The ones that where spun on with a High powered gun. Or that were Wrenched by a guy who tries out for an Ironman competition.

A snapped off lugstud is a rather cheap fix. 50 bucks tops. Unless your talking a Very high end vehicle or a Porsche where the lugs are screwed right into the hub.

cjbigcog · 11-10-09, 04:53

As for specific torque, check the owners manual. Not sure if all manufactures print this info.

chefwong · 11-10-09, 05:20

I'm 50/50 on the bench about removing a customers wheels on detailing. If a wheel detail include wheel pull or balls to walls detail is implied, I would assume you - the detailer carries all the insurance in the world to cover these things. stuff happens and you should be covered.

not a good analogy but I bought a used brake kit for 10K. Not my mechanics fault, but a week after they were put in, brake hose burst. I suspect prior owner was not careful supporting the caliper (ss hose line) when removing them. sh1t happens...
thankfully it burst while I was pulling out on the street and was able to drift into a curb with no damage to anything.

I know it's not 100% and much harder to seal a wheel, but ACE Powersticks rock and I get my wheels 90% clean with them....without taking anything off, and they are much less abrasive IMO than some of the other ez detail brushes I have seen on the market

lecchilo · 11-12-09, 02:28

I never do and never will remove the wheels or anything of that nature... you can torque it correctly with 15 different torque wrenches and reference 15 different guides as to the torque value but at the end of the day, you did all that and that's who it's coming back to if anything goes bad. You can bet your *** that if the wheel breaks your name will be on the lawsuit right along with the wheel manufacturer, tire installers, etc. Seen it happen, and won't let it happen to me.

Wheels can be fairly easily cleaned from the front (facing away from vehicle) and also can be brought to you off the car for a thorough cleaning.

Just my $0.02