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Old 06-15-04, 10:54   #13 (permalink)
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Everyone’s skepticism is understandable and justified since the last detailing association disappeared into the ICA. The ICA is a great association, don’t get me wrong but not enough detailers joined and spoke up so favoritism leaned more towards the big business of carwashing and the detailer was forgotten.

NY detailer & Intel486
What do you get out of the association? Question should be “what do you want out of an association?” We have a survey on the website (www.detailersassociation.com) to find out what a detailer is willing to pay for and what they need to make their business succeed faster and easier -- or to even help them stay in business. Right now we’re still in the start-up phase and recruiting as many detailers as we can to find out what they want.

OK, so what will you get? I’ll reinforce everything Jim Hammill said. Our main focus right now is to make available business insurance (mainly general liability) and health insurance for mobile and fixed detailers. Mobile detailers have it the hardest right now because most insurance companies will not cover them. Out of the all the mobile detailers we have signed up, only a few have received business insurance. Half of that number has health insurance. With enough people, insurance companies will recognize the demand and provide -- usually at a much more affordable rate then obtaining it on your own. If you have a mobile detailing business and have insurance, congratulations -- you’re very lucky. Insurance companies these days are slamming the door in the contractor’s face BUT if enough people demand, especially through an association they usually will provide.

The association will provide members with Technical Service Bulletins the dealers and schools receive from the manufacturers. Detailers usually never see these but we will now thanks to our associate, the Department of Automotive Technology at The Southern University of Illinois Carbondale and Auto International. Only the lucky few have access to these.

Another perk of membership is participating in a buyers group. We have several detailing chemical companies willing to give deep discounts with a buying group. You’d probably pay for the membership fee just from the savings alone with a buyers group.

detailbarn, a hack wouldn’t usually pay for good equipment let alone an association membership due. If he does, then usually that means he wants to better himself and his business -- which wouldn‘t qualify him as a hack.

But to make sure we don’t sign hacks up, we will require a “Doing Business As” certificate. This is the registration document you get when registering your business at the County Clerk’s office. After you fax us a copy of the certificate, the association will call the County Clerk’s office in the state you’re doing business in just to verify. No privacy will be violated, just a simple question -- “Is so and so, of this company registered to do business?”

ncal, It wouldn’t hurt to get ASE certified in Paint Refinishing. Just another achievement of excellence to post on your portfolio.

Bottom line is, we’re here to help and no push anything on you. If you’d like to join, beautiful. If not, goodluck with business and we’d enjoy keeping in touch and reading your posts on the forum.
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Old 06-15-04, 10:56   #14 (permalink)
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Here in Texas, all I needed was a DBA to set up business banking, etc. Cost me $6. No license needed.
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Old 06-15-04, 10:57   #15 (permalink)
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Intel,

How can you say detailing doesn't take much skill?
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Old 06-15-04, 11:02   #16 (permalink)
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Good deal Scott. Registering my business cost me $50 here in NJ.
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Old 06-15-04, 11:22   #17 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally posted by PrecisionOnline
Intel,

How can you say detailing doesn't take much skill?
I don't want to start an arguement. I agree it does take skill to detail. Just not as much as compared to other organizations that have certifications.

I mainly see hackers as people who are 1) too lazy or 2) too concerned about a profit. Most of the hack jobs are people who see detailing as a quick buck. Let's use cheap chemicals, do a quick job, and make some money.

Maybe it's just gotten too easy to me but I see detailing as mostly labor. I do enjoy doing it though. I heard a saying about cooking that was, "Anyone who can read can cook." I guess I can go ahead and say, "Anyone who can read can detail."

The one thing that does take a large amount of skill in detailing is the rotary buffer. I will say that.
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Old 06-16-04, 02:43   #18 (permalink)
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I agree with Intel: While detailing can be considered as an art if done by a enthusiast, detailing as a job isn't exactly "high skilled'. Pretty much any Tom, **** and Harry who wants to learn the basics can do it well as long as they WANT to do it well....

Back to the org thing, if it works out, can you extend it overseas? I'd love to be the first to be certified in our area
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Old 06-16-04, 06:58   #19 (permalink)
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I am not a detailer but I am self employed. For years I have received mail from NASE (National Assoc. of the Self Employed). They pretty much offer the same benefits.

What I have noticed from all the mailings is that they are really trying to sell you insurance. I don't know if the association is underwritten by an insurance company. The other benefits they offer such as supply discounts really don't amount to much.

Anyway, just my .02
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Old 06-16-04, 09:22   #20 (permalink)
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On the skill debate I have to agree with what the others have said. Detailing is highly laborious and artful in the way that anyone can do it. Sure, most people are abysmal at their methods and only a few detailers are truly artists but the fact remains that anyone who wants to make money detailing can head down to K-mart and load up on the gear. As far as certification goes, I'd love to get my ICAR certification as I'm fascinated with body work. But I honestly don't have time. I'm sure there are many people who much busier than me to take a certification course. Personally, I think the truly talented people on this board know vast amounts regarding what and what can not be done to a vehicle without the need for a formal 'class'. And all you have to do is read this board to read about the detailers in our areas that are making great money, few complaints, and are considered reputable by everyone BUT true detailers. Perhaps a shady detailer might not join for the discounts or insurance, but to have that sticker saying 'PROUD MEMBER OF DETAILER INTERNATIONAL". . . All I'm trying to say is that there are a multitude of companies who are completely 'legitimate' through paper, but they still lack scruples. (ie. Corporate America)
I don't think anyone is trying to chase you out of this board, Autopia members are really laid back and open to new things, all you have to do is look at the Product Reviews forum and you'll see we will try anything once. However, your Detailer Association idea raises important questions. I think it is hard to advertise membership saying you will offer what people ask through feedback because it hasn't created an impetus to be interested.
Getting to join an association is just like advertising any business, and in this case detailers are asking 'what is in it for me besides dues?' Right now the answer is Insurance aide, group buys, and TSBs. Nothing wrong with that, but that is what it comes across to many, even if that is not the entire scope.
 
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Old 06-16-04, 10:04   #21 (permalink)
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Another question I would bring up would be, what about us weekend detailers that only do this on the side? I'm not going to run down to the clerks office for license then have the IRS laboring over account books trying to figure out how much I made on the side. Don't get me wrong, I'm not a hack and I do spend good money on great equipment and products and take pride in the vehicles I do. I just don't think certain things should be a requirement for those of us that do this for love more than money.

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Old 06-16-04, 04:20   #22 (permalink)
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theveed,

Detailing is a highly skilled business when it comes to using a rotary buffer for paint correction; wheel indentification for using certain acids; proper engine detailing and stain identification for proper removal. Glad you'd like to join but you'd be our #2 Phillipine detailer, someone beat yout to it. :-)
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Old 06-16-04, 04:55   #23 (permalink)
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I read everyones post and thought about this a litte today.

This would be very hard to start up, it will not be easy. At first every detailer in the world will sign up.... why... because it's free. Nothing is better then free advertisement.

Once you charge a fee for the this, only the detailers that are profiting from this will stay around. I can see more then 1/2 leaving once a charge is added.

But that might be a good thing, now what is left are the pro detailers and people that want to make this work.

This could go back & forth 100 x's about why people should join and why people should not join. who want's to pay and who does not want to pay.

The biggest thing is that everyone profits from it one way or another.

I can see many problems that come up.
Just because some one is registered business does not mean they can detail a car
Just because some one is not a registered business does not mean they suck at detailing.

I will go with it for now to see where it goes, and how it works.
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Old 06-16-04, 05:02   #24 (permalink)
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Maybe we forgot to add the association is going to be set-up as a not-for-profit organization, meaning the association will not be making a profit and we will be audited by an accountant for every dime we spend.
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