Will 3M Machine Polish and a cutting pad cut it?

[Gopher]

I'd checked my paint previously and noticed only a few scratches and minimal swirling and figured I didn't need an aggressive compound when I was ordering up supplies for my first real detailing. Yesterday the light hit my trunk in just the right way that I realized I really do have a lot of swirling.

My plan was to use 3M machine polish w/ a burgundy meg cutting pad and to follow that up with KAIO with a polishing pad then JW AJT sealant.

My question is whether the 3M Machine Polish should be enough for swirls on a silver car and minor scratches. I realize it isn't a real compound, but 3m claims it will suit that purpose.

Proper auto care wrote it up as follows:

"When applied with a high speed polisher (Makita 9227) or dual-action polisher (Porter Cable 7424), it quickly and effectively reduces or removes minor swirls, scratches and paint blemishes. Polished surfaces have a deep, reflective, wet-look shine ready for your favorite wax.

This is a more aggressive polish than the 3M Perfect-It Swirl Removers and Meguiar's No 3 Machine Glaze but is still clear coat safe. If you have an older vehicle with a finish that is oxidized or dull, this is the perfect solution. For best results, this polish must be applied by machine."

Opinions?

[Jakerooni]

I can't see a polish removing any sort of blemish. It's a polish after all. I'd rather use a cleaner wax if I don't have access to any sort of compound. But anything is possible anymore with the slew of new products entering the market day in and day out.

My best advice because I'm pretty old school on it. Is a regular rotary (none of these buffing machines) with a nice clean wool pad. A mild compound followed by a wax creme and new pad, finished up with a nice coat of nanowax or carnuba. Should make for a perfect shine everytime.

[Gopher]

thanks for the reply! Unfortunately I don't have access to a rotary--in fact my first Porter cable is supposed to arrive via ups TODAY, so upgrading is a bit premature...

Hmm... I do have some cleaner wax, but perhaps I should hold off for a compound. I'll try to borrow some IP from a friend (if I can get in touch with him). In the event I can't, are there any 'OTC' compounds that would be good for a titanium silver BMW?


FWIW I have the following on hand:

3M Polish (light cars)
3M Machine Polish
Klasse AIO
Klasse SG
Werkstatt AJT
Mothers Carnuba cleaner/wax

[Accumulator]

Gopher- Heh heh, saying that it's more abrasive than the Meg's #3 isn't saying much...#3 is nonabrasive On a less-critical note, saying that by rotary or PC it reduces/removes marring makes me think that the only way it truly *removes* is is via rotary.

I haven't tried it, so the following is not based on first-hand experience. But I *have* used a few 3M products, some of them extensively.

IMO it's too mild to pair with the Meg's burgundy pad. And *anything* used by PC with the burgundy pad will usually require something more aggressive than AIO (basically nonabrasive) on the white pad.

IMO the 3M polish would be better suited for the white pad, probably as a follow up to whatever product actually removes the marring. In other words, I think you'll need something more abrasive to do the actual correction.

[Coupe]

Originally Posted by Jakerooni

I can't see a polish removing any sort of blemish. It's a polish after all. I'd rather use a cleaner wax if I don't have access to any sort of compound. But anything is possible anymore with the slew of new products entering the market day in and day out.

My best advice because I'm pretty old school on it. Is a regular rotary (none of these buffing machines) with a nice clean wool pad. A mild compound followed by a wax creme and new pad, finished up with a nice coat of nanowax or carnuba. Should make for a perfect shine everytime.

What?
I think your confused on what a polish is.

And if you buff a car with wool and a mild compound it will be hologram city and by your description your hideing it with a wax. Big no no

[Jakerooni]

Originally Posted by Coupe

What?
I think your confused on what a polish is.

And if you buff a car with wool and a mild compound it will be hologram city and by your description your hideing it with a wax. Big no no

Ummm Funny I've been doing it that way for well over a decade now and have never once had a detail come back over paint issues. Nothing but huge rave reviews. Even months after the detail.... but your probably right... No clue as to what I'm doing ...carry on.

FWIW the compound is only stage one. To get the holograms out you remove the swirls and such with the creme.... It's a 3 stage process and it works great.

[Gopher]

Thanks for the feedback guys. I really appreciate it, but am a little confused by the answers I've gotten.

I have two megs cutting pads and two megs polishing pads--are you saying the cutting pads are non-abrasive?

My initial plan was to go 1) 3m machine polish 2)kaio 3) sealant

Is what you are telling me that the KAIO via polishing pad won't be enough to prep the paint for sealing after a compound?

[Accumulator]

Originally Posted by Gopher

Thanks for the feedback guys. I really appreciate it, but am a little confused by the answers I've gotten...

That's understandable..I'll try to clarify things.

I have two megs cutting pads and two megs polishing pads--are you saying the cutting pads are non-abrasive?

NO, that's the opposite of what I'm trying to convey. The Meg's burgundy pads are often (not always, but often) mildly abrasive and can leave micromarring. IIRC Meg's currently does not recommend their use by PC for this reason, even though scads of people do use them by PC with good results. I do not recommend you use that pad the way you had planned.

My initial plan was to go 1) 3m machine polish 2)kaio 3) sealant

Is what you are telling me that the KAIO via polishing pad won't be enough to prep the paint for sealing after a compound?

Correct, because of the preceding step with the 3M polish (or more accurately, the step with the Meg's burgundy pads). First, I doubt that the 3M polish will eliminate the marring; second, the AIO/white won't be aggressive enough to remove the micromarring that a sufficiently aggressive approach will leave.

Another way of putting it: if the [some polish]/Meg's burgundy is effective enough to remove your marring, it'll leave micromarring that the AIO/white won't be able to remove, because of the *pad*.

More: if you use the 3M with the white it probably won't remove all the marring. But it would leave the finish OK enough for the AIO. So..

I'd try the 3M/white numerous times. If it looks OK then go ahead with the AIO. If the 3M/white doesn't get the marring out, buy a more aggressive product to use the next time (perhaps with those burgundy pads) and live with the flaws until then.

The combo I would *NOT* try is the 3m/burgundy followed by the AIO/white. That 3M/burgundy strikes me as the worst of all possible worlds. If you want to try it anyhow, plan to follow with the same 3M polish on a white polishing pad, maybe it'll remove the micromarring that I think you'd have to deal with.

It sounds to me like you're trying to do a three-step process in two steps.

[Coupe]

Sorry but with some of your posts they make ya wonder

Polish is indeed abbrasive unless your talking about a pure polish.

Wooling paint and then going straight to a wax? There is no way your not leaving holograms. Wool needs to be followed up with a foam polishing pad or a finishing pad and a finishing polish.

What is a creme wax?

You also left a comment in another thread where the poster was having trouble with rotary holograms. You told him its becuase he isnt finishing by hand. It would take weeks to remove holograms by hand if you even could.

[Gopher]

That clarifies things greatly!!! Thanks for taking the time to explain it.

Now that I am more up to speed, I would like to do the following:
1. true compound via burgundy (any OTC recommendations if I can't get my buddy's IP?)
2. 3m polish via white pad-possibly numerous time to correct any micromarring from step 1
3. Klasse via white pad (probably just once to prep paint for sealant)

4. Werkstatt AJT - Spray and wipe

[Accumulator]

Gopher- *NOW* I think you have it figured out

I'm still not sure that the Meg's burgundy pad will work all that great (in part because ~6" pads like that just don't do correction for me the way a 4" pad will) but using it with a more aggressive product makes a lot more sense.

OTC compounds...hm...I'd go to an autobody/paint supply place and see what they have. Sorry, I'm no authority on OTC products. The 3M PI-III RC 05933 I like was discontinued and is getting hard to find, but maybe they'll have some at that kind of shop. The PI-II FIne Cut Rubbing Compound is another one, but it contains silica which can be like asbestos for your lungs without the proper mask. The current, PC-friendly version of Meg's #2 Fine Cut Cleaner might work OK but I haven't tried it.

Just plan on spending plenty of time with this, correction via PC is slow going. But now that you're approaching this as a 3-step process I think you're on the right track.

[Gopher]

I've made a few posts here asking for feedback and not everyone has been as responsive with the help as you. I really appreciate it.

FWIW, I found a thread here wherein i places the machine polish I planned on using in the same category as the Menzerna IP I was toying with trying to borrow from a friend... I guess I need to look to a compound a little more abbrassive then that even.

5 (Removes scratches you can't quite feel)
3M FINESSE-IT II MACHINE POLISH 39003
3M FINESSE-IT II FINISHING MATERIAL 05928 (same as above)
3M ONE STEP CLEANER WAX, MEDIUM OXIDATION REMOVER 39066
1Z PP
MENZERNA INTENSIVE POLISH
POORBOY'S SSR2